# Dancing on the grave of health care "reform" **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 3, 2010, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487 "2010-02-03T04:17:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 48
**Author:** ![Lightnin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lightnin/32/180_2.png) [@Lightnin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightnin)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/941 "2010-03-23T18:23:02Z")
The only babbling rage I see in this thread is coming from you, **SA**. Sorry if the truth hurts. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/942 "2010-03-23T18:23:14Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > And how are my rants any different that the jillions of similar rants that go on around here every day regarding conservatives and Republicans. Few people hold **Der Trihs** in very high regard either. ---
**Author:** ![psychobunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/54ee81/32.png) [@psychobunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/psychobunny)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/943 "2010-03-23T18:31:01Z")
For **Starving Artist** : > [@](#): > > "One of the traditional methods of imposing statism or socialism on a people has been by way of medicine. > It’s very easy to disguise a medical program as a humanitarian project, most people are a little reluctant to oppose anything that suggests medical care for people who possibly can’t afford it. > Now, the American people, if you put it to them about socialized medicine and gave them a chance to choose, would unhesitatingly vote against it…They say once the … bill is passed this nation will be provided with a mechanism for socialized medicine capable of indefinite expansion in every direction until it includes the entire population. Now we can’t say we haven’t been warned…Now the advocates of this bill when you try to oppose it challenge you on an emotional basis. They say, “What would you do? Throw these poor people out to die with no medical attention?” That’s ridiculous and of course no one is advocating it… this program I promise you, will pass just as surely as the sun will come up tomorrow and behind it will come other federal programs that will invade every area of freedom as we have known it in this country until one day as Normal Thomas said we will wake to find that we have socialism, and if you don’t do this and I don’t do this, one of these days we are going to spend our sunset years telling our children and our children’s children, what it once was like in America when men were free.” See-there is support for your views (from Ronald Reagan in 1961 talking about Medicare and as history has shown, he was wrong, as you are also wrong) . ---
**Author:** ![Duke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e8c25b/32.png) [@Duke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/944 "2010-03-23T18:35:02Z")
I never did trust Normal Thomas. Guy tries to blend into society so obviously, you know something’s up. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/945 "2010-03-23T18:40:31Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > …_tokes_… Really not a good idea. Some folks just…shouldn’t. > [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > … Might I suggest Imodium AD instead? There you go! ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/946 "2010-03-23T18:45:04Z")
This thread is a laff riot. The guy starts the thread, clearly stating (if not in so many words) that he’s baiting people to get angry; then when they do, he points to them as typical liberal haters. I have no problem with hating the likes of this prick or his racist, Nazi-loving friends on the right. I just hope that when the right-wing crowds go completely out of control and start shooting, that the response is lethal and immediate. ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/947 "2010-03-23T18:46:40Z")
> [@Bosstone](#): > > Few people hold **Der Trihs** in very high regard either. Der Trihs is at least correct ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/948 "2010-03-23T18:49:45Z")
> [@Bosstone](#): > > Few people hold Der Trihs in very high regard either. The difference of course, is that **Der Trihs** is wrong. And while I don’t really have time to get into all this today, how about YOU answer my charges? How about anwering why prior to the counter-culture revolution and all the idiocy that has followed in its wake, we as a society are now plagued with so many ills that either never existed beforehand or were so small as to be inconsequential? I’ve listed them enough around here that you should know what I’m talking about. And don’t give me any shit about racism! Racism and/or its defeat has absolutely nothing to do with why schools were able to educate students back then, or why drugs and street crime have become such a huge problem and taken so many lives and ruined so many others, or why millions of kids in this country are being raised in single-family homes and doomed to live shitty lives, as are their children as well. And contrary to what I’ve been told more than once around here, it didn’t “just happen” either. For two hundred years this country was able to educate its students, maintain families and keep drugs, gangs and crime suppressed enough so that most people never came into contact with them. There are very specific reasons why so many things have gone to shit in this country since the late sixties, and liberalism is its name. And unlike **Der Trihs** , I am perfectly happy to list exactly the problems liberalism has caused and the chronology as they’ve happened. I have done so already several times. But where you people get so outraged over the fact that 45,000 people a year die without healthcare, you turn a blind and utterly uncaring eye toward the millions and million of lives that have been ruined or lost because of what you’ve done to life in this country. There are none so blind as those who will not see. ---
**Author:** ![Mosier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ea924/32.png) [@Mosier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mosier)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/949 "2010-03-23T18:51:49Z")
Hey Starving Artist, wanna know what I hate about Conservatives? You’re demonstrating it perfectly in your posts. Conservatives use the same tired argument for every one of their positions, and try to convince us our society will collapse and we will all become slaves if liberal legislation X happens. Just calm down. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/950 "2010-03-23T18:53:05Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > The difference of course, is that **Der Trihs** is wrong. Whatever you say, grampa. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/951 "2010-03-23T18:53:07Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > But where you people get so outraged over the fact that 45,000 people a year die without healthcare, you turn a blind and utterly uncaring eye toward the millions and million of lives that have been ruined or lost because of what you’ve done to life in this country. Millions and millions? Did they slip and fall on uncollected dog poo? Or were they killed by rudeness? Is your post your cite? ---
**Author:** ![Mosier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ea924/32.png) [@Mosier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mosier)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/952 "2010-03-23T18:56:29Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > The difference of course, is that **Der Trihs** is wrong. > > And while I don’t really have time to get into all this today, how about YOU answer my charges? How about anwering why prior to the counter-culture revolution and all the idiocy that has followed in its wake, we as a society are now plagued with so many ills that either never existed beforehand or were so small as to be inconsequential? I’ve listed them enough around here that you should know what I’m talking about. > > And don’t give me any shit about racism! Racism and/or its defeat has absolutely nothing to do with why schools were able to educate students back then, or why drugs and street crime have become such a huge problem and taken so many lives and ruined so many others, or why millions of kids in this country are being raised in single-family homes and doomed to live shitty lives, as are their children as well. And contrary to what I’ve been told more than once around here, it didn’t “just happen” either. > > For two hundred years this country was able to educate its students, maintain families and keep drugs, gangs and crime suppressed enough so that most people never came into contact with them. There are very specific reasons why so many things have gone to shit in this country since the late sixties, and liberalism is its name. And unlike **Der Trihs** , I am perfectly happy to list exactly the problems liberalism has caused and the chronology as they’ve happened. I have done so already several times. > > But where you people get so outraged over the fact that 45,000 people a year die without healthcare, you turn a blind and utterly uncaring eye toward the millions and million of lives that have been ruined or lost because of what you’ve done to life in this country. > > There are none so blind as those who will not see. Jesus, how many times to people have to demonstrate to you that you’re wrong about culture prior to the sixties? We had INSTITUTIONALIZED RACISM prior to the sixties! Teen pregnancy rates were HIGHER in the fifties. Graduation rates were LOWER in the fifties. Crime has NOT CHANGED SIGNIFICANTLY since the sixties, and several reports show it has decreased in most categories. You are romanticizing your childhood, and you need to wake up. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/953 "2010-03-23T19:01:31Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > As flattering as it is that you seem to think genius is required to kick my ass, how about answering some of my charges instead of writing them off as psychological issues? I don’t know, the answer to this question may well be found here: > [@](#): > > It was so full of wrongheadedness and typical …knee-jerk assumption that I couldn’t arse myself take the time to answer it. I’m just sayin’. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/954 "2010-03-23T19:02:33Z")
> [@Mosier](#): > > Jesus, how many times to people have to demonstrate to you that you’re wrong about culture prior to the sixties? There. Your post should do it. Count on **Starving Artist** to get it now. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/955 "2010-03-23T19:05:02Z")
> [@bup](#): > > There. Your post should do it. Count on **Starving Artist** to get it now. Naw, I’m pretty sure it’s going to require at least one more. ---
**Author:** ![LeeshaJoy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e8cbc/32.png) [@LeeshaJoy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LeeshaJoy)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/956 "2010-03-23T19:08:09Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > Naw, I’m pretty sure it’s going to require at least one more. It’s always going to require “one more.” Don’t bother. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/957 "2010-03-23T19:09:41Z")
> [@LeeshaJoy](#): > > It’s always going to require “one more.” Don’t bother. :rolleyes: Ok, maybe two, then. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/958 "2010-03-23T19:09:41Z")
Eh, the only thing SA ever benefits from ‘one more’ of is prunes. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/959 "2010-03-23T19:25:31Z")
> [@Bosstone](#): > > Whatever you say, grampa. So your defense for liberalism’s failings is that I’m 61 years old? :dubious: Typical. > [@Mosier](#): > > Jesus, how many times to people have to demonstrate to you that you’re wrong about culture prior to the sixties? We had INSTITUTIONALIZED RACISM prior to the sixties! I said don’t give me that shit! It has nothing to do with the problems I’m describing, and it could have been (and largely was being) eliminated prior to the counter-culture revolution. > [@Mosier](#): > > Teen pregnancy rates were HIGHER in the fifties. This has never been proved. > [@Mosier](#): > > Graduation rates were LOWER in the fifties. Not sure about this one, but I doubt it. And if so I’d wager it’s because people had to actually _learn things_ and pass tests in order to graduate, unlike now where we even have teachers who put apostrophes in plurals and don’t know the difference between “capitol” and “capital”. [Cite](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=556919). > [@Mosier](#): > > Crime has NOT CHANGED SIGNIFICANTLY since the sixties, and several reports show it has decreased in most categories. Maybe, maybe not. But the NATURE of it has changed greatly, with most of it being caused in one way or the other by drugs. And it is much more pervasive. Most people’s lives were untouched by crime prior to the late sixties and a person would be hard pressed to know anyone these days whose life hasn’t been impacted in some way by drugs and/or crimes related to them. And of course, you are all blithely blowing completely past the undeniable and perfectly obvious fact that drugs and its associated crime are responsible for far more deaths and misery than racism or any other of this country’s past problems. And then there’s the millions of kids being forced to grow up in single-parent homes as a result of liberal if-it-feels-good-do-itism, and the philosophy that people don’t need a piece of paper to live with each other. But never mind…I got chit to do and I know your answer anyway: “Won’t somebody think of the children!” :rolleyes: You didn’t care about the children then, characterizing those of us who brought up the inevitablity of them as “uptight squares, man”, and you don’t care about them now. And the reason you don’t care about them is that you’re responsible for them. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/960 "2010-03-23T19:30:27Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > So your defense for liberalism’s failings is that I’m 61 years old? :dubious:… Puppy. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487.md?page=47) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487.md?page=49)