# Dancing on the grave of health care "reform" **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 3, 2010, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487 "2010-02-03T04:17:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 58
**Author:** ![Sleeps\_With\_Butterflies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@Sleeps\_With\_Butterflies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sleeps_With_Butterflies)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2010, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/1141 "2010-03-26T22:36:43Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > What I honestly believe is that people like you have caused tremendous problems in this country that you refuse to face…or even to acknowlege…and that you choose instead to make fun of my age and pretend that it negates my arguments. > > So when you whinge about 45,000 deaths a year from no health care (0.00015% of the population, btw) or the number of lives lost in Iraq, both of which absolutely pale in comparison to the deaths and ruined lives that have resulted from forty years of liberal social predominance, it rings hollow…somewhat like your skull. > > And by the way, in the summertime I mow the lawns of my sister, my two neices and a sixty-seven year old single woman who lives across the street, all in one day and in as much as 110 degree heat. Think you could keep up, toots? Toots? Ha! Even your attempts at insults are dated and stuck in another era. You’re hilarious. Keep 'em coming, maybe you’ll find an insult that sticks since the rest of what you’ve tried can’t hit a mark. People like me? Huh? “Whinging” about this death and that death and blah blah blah. Where do you get this stuff? Are you having a hard time telling people apart or are you just flinging your garbage around in hopes of it making sense. What it’s more like is you being an angry Chatty Cathy doll from your childhood. :: pulls string :: You kids get off my lawn! :: pulls string :: I remember when you could get a gallon of gas for a quarter! :: pulls string :: Damned liberals are ruining this country! :: pulls string :: Hey toots, bring me my Geritol and a glass of milk! Also, is your lawn mowing prowess supposed to be impressive? Is that’s what you consider to be a good workout or are you just looking for a job? And yes, since mowing lawns isn’t that hard except for the disabled and the elderly… I can keep up. ---
**Author:** ![sinjin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ebca7d/32.png) [@sinjin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sinjin)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2010, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/1142 "2010-03-26T22:44:33Z")
> [@Meyer6](#): > > Please provide cites that show the exact number of people who have been killed or harmed by ‘liberal social predominance’. You don’t get to just make up your own statistics. > > And mowing lawns is your big claim to being a tough guy? Ooooh, I’m impressed. Also, it sounds like your sister and neices are taking advantage of you. I guess they know an easy mark when they see one. Bah, he’s just a 61 year old coot hoping to get into the pants of the old lady’s daughter’s drawers. He wouldn’t be interested in the old lady himself because “she’s old” vs SA who has his viagra paid for by his insurance company is rip roaring to go. Hahahahaha. I knew guys like him in the sixties. Guys who preferred Pat Boone to the Beatles and loathed the Stones. Maybe he’ll find a Delorian to take him Back to the Future. We can only hope.🆒 ---
**Author:** ![Fuji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a9a28c/32.png) [@Fuji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuji)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2010, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/1143 "2010-03-26T22:45:10Z")
> [@Rand\_Rover](#): > > They have “brought down” countries that have enacted them. Just look at the many articles lamenting the brain drain ferom countries with the huge tax rates necessary to support these programs. This is a rather disingenuous equivalence you’ve asserted. [Brain drain](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brain_drain) != economic collapse. For example, despite large numbers of Indian professionals [emigrating to the USA](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_American#Immigration), the Indian economy’s performance over the last decade was one of the greatest in the world, averaging [over 7% per annum](http://business.mapsofindia.com/india-gdp/history.html). Although taxes do not reach Western European levels, it should be noted that the top bracket income tax rate is 30% and there is also a 12.5% VAT, as well as [property taxes](http://www.indiahousing.com/india-property-tax-rates.html) : _“Although there are many other forms of taxes in India like Income Tax, Sales tax etc yet the property tax is the single largest source of revenue for government.”_ ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2010, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/1144 "2010-03-26T22:46:22Z")
> [@Sleeps\_With\_Butterflies](#): > > Toots? Ha! Even your attempts at insults are dated and stuck in another era. BWAHAHAHA! You dumb twat, that was the idea. “Toots” is dated even for my generation. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2010, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/1145 "2010-03-26T22:48:10Z")
There are places in the world worse than many countries with large social programs and high taxes, and lots of people go from those places to those countries. But people already in those countries with high ability are still clamoring to get out. The fact that people from worse places go to those countries doesn’t sound like anything to crow about to me. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2010, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/1146 "2010-03-26T22:50:58Z")
My feet will dance the gloating for the passing of the bill Cramming down a bowling ball, its such a bitter pill! With any luck at all, we’ll cram one bigger still! And **Starkers** can swallow it whole! Glory, glory for Obama! Healthcare’s gonna get yer ma-ma! The joy that we have found, givin’ **Rand** a reach-around! And we’ll boogie till we puke! See, I figure I deserve to go to Heaven not because of how good I am, but that my natural inclination is to be so very much worse… ---
**Author:** ![CannyDan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cannydan/32/548_2.png) [@CannyDan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CannyDan)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2010, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/1147 "2010-03-26T22:51:03Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > …in as much as 110 degree heat… You live in the northeast US, right **SA**? I just looked up the temperature records. Troy, New York holds the record high temperature of 108 degrees F on July 22, 1926. That’s nineteen TWENTY SIX. One hundred ten degrees is nowhere a common summer temperature. It’s a small point, but like your other maunderings, even your memories of temperature are not in accord with reality. You really need to give up the personal anecdote as citation business; it isn’t working for you. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2010, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/1148 "2010-03-26T22:57:00Z")
Oh, hell, thats nothin’. Fighting off hippy chicks trying to get in his pants, now there’s a howler! Hooo, doggies! ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2010, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/1149 "2010-03-26T22:57:34Z")
Also, despite the repeated assertions to the contrary of many of our more brain-dead esteemed liberals on the boards, I never said anything about “economic collapse.” I said that high taxes to support large social programs hurt the economy. There’s a huge spread between “fully functioning economy unburdened by high taxes to support social programs” and “economic collapse,” and different countries with large social programs are at different places in that spectrum (obviously). ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2010, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/1150 "2010-03-26T22:59:57Z")
Dully noted. Open wide! ---
**Author:** ![Fuji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a9a28c/32.png) [@Fuji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuji)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2010, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/1151 "2010-03-26T23:00:15Z")
> [@Rand\_Rover](#): > > There are places in the world worse than many countries with large social programs and high taxes, and lots of people go from those places to those countries. But people already in those countries with high ability are still clamoring to get out. The fact that people from worse places go to those countries doesn’t sound like anything to crow about to me. I’m assuming you’re referring to my post (if not, my apologies). You were the one who asserted that brain drain would “bring down” a nation’s economy. This simply isn’t the case. This isn’t Liechtenstein we’re talking about here, but _one sixth of humanity_, ferchrissakes. I’d say that’s a pretty large sample size… ---
**Author:** ![Fuji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a9a28c/32.png) [@Fuji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuji)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2010, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/1152 "2010-03-26T23:02:00Z")
> [@Rand\_Rover](#): > > Also, despite the repeated assertions to the contrary of many of our more brain-dead esteemed liberals on the boards, I never said anything about “economic collapse.” I said that high taxes to support large social programs hurt the economy. There’s a huge spread between “fully functioning economy unburdened by high taxes to support social programs” and “economic collapse,” and different countries with large social programs are at different places in that spectrum (obviously). Oh, so you’re admitting you were wrong in making your previous assertion? Good to know. ---
**Author:** ![Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e47c2d/32.png) [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffy_the_Elephant_Shrew)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2010, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/1153 "2010-03-26T23:11:11Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > With apologies to the spirit of Bob Marely. Jah love, Bob. Howzabout some Toots & the Maytals? ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2010, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/1154 "2010-03-26T23:11:21Z")
What previous assertion? I never said anything about economic collapse. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2010, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/1155 "2010-03-26T23:11:38Z")
> [@Bosstone](#): > > I’m a little leery of relying heavily on this argument > … > the polls… Yes, quite; but it’s awful funny seeing **Rand Rover** reduced to advocating [Mobocracy](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ochlocracy). ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2010, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/1156 "2010-03-26T23:14:49Z")
I never advocated mobocracy. I just pointed out that the health care reform bill that passed was not supported by a majority of people. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2010, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/1157 "2010-03-26T23:31:53Z")
Well, you’re right. A good portion wanted even _more_ socialistic health care. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2010, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/1158 "2010-03-26T23:32:10Z")
> [@sinjin](#): > > Bah, he’s just a 61 year old coot hoping to get into the pants of the old lady’s daughter’s drawers. He wouldn’t be interested in the old lady himself because “she’s old” vs SA who has his viagra paid for by his insurance company is rip roaring to go. Hahahahaha. I knew guys like him in the sixties. Guys who preferred Pat Boone to the Beatles and loathed the Stones. Maybe he’ll find a Delorian to take him Back to the Future. We can only hope.🆒 If you guys only knew. This is too funny! A quick rundown of the music **Starvey** has close by finds Steely Dan, Nine Inch Nails, Mark Morrison (_Return of the Mack_, a longtime favorite), The Jazzmasters, R.L. Burnside, George Michael, ZZ Top, Paul Hardcastle, Eric Clapton, the Sneaker Pimps (plus some Kelli Ali solo stuff), Dave Brubeck, Franchesca Gagnon (Alegria), Corrine Bailey Rae, Herbie Hancock, Santana, Elton John, Van Morrison, The Game, Valeska Jacobowicz, Stevie Ray Vaughn, Jimmie Vaughn, etc. Shall I go on? A lot is older, granted, but you’ll notice there’s not a Pat Boone or Fabian anywhere in the mix. And Viagra? I’m just glad it’ll be there when I need it. 😃 You dilweeds don’t have a clue what I’m like and you never have. Aren’t knee-jerk stereotypes supposed to be the domain of us evil conservatives? > [@CannyDan](#): > > You live in the northeast US, right SA? I just looked up the temperature records. Troy, New York holds the record high temperature of 108 degrees F on July 22, 1926. That’s nineteen TWENTY SIX. > > One hundred ten degrees is nowhere a common summer temperature. It’s a small point, but like your other maunderings, even your memories of temperature are not in accord with reality. You really need to give up the personal anecdote as citation business; it isn’t working for you. Is this a “cite”? If so, you’ll see why I have such disregard for them? No, I don’t live in the northeast, but if you’ll cough up enough dough to make it worthwhile to bring you into my personal life - say, $20,000 or so - I’ll tell you where I live and take you out with me the next time I mow in temps over 100 degrees? (We can make it 110 if you like, but you’ll have a narrower and more immediate window of time to get here.) Sound like a deal? ---
**Author:** ![Meyer6](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cc9497/32.png) [@Meyer6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meyer6)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2010, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/1159 "2010-03-26T23:37:08Z")
> [@Rand\_Rover](#): > > There are places in the world worse than many countries with large social programs and high taxes, and lots of people go from those places to those countries. But people already in those countries with high ability are still clamoring to get out. The fact that people from worse places go to those countries doesn’t sound like anything to crow about to me. Did you read any of the cites given to you - in [this](http://www.straightgoods.com/Analyze/0018.shtml) one: …overall only about 25,000 Canadian taxpayers leave for the US each year - and only about 1,000 of them have incomes over $100,000. I wouldn’t exactly call that ‘clamouring to get out’. ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2010, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487/1160 "2010-03-26T23:39:32Z")
Meyer6, you seem to have been struck by the same Canada-centric disease EP has. There are countries other than Canada. Google your own self for cites about European countries. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487.md?page=57) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-on-the-grave-of-health-care-reform/527487.md?page=59)