# Dancing School For Pigs. OPEN 24/7. (local sustainability) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 17, 2010, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-school-for-pigs-open-24-7-local-sustainability/547056 "2010-07-17T20:05:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Containing\_Iron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/57b2e6/32.png) [@Containing\_Iron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Containing_Iron)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2010, 11:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-school-for-pigs-open-24-7-local-sustainability/547056/101 "2010-08-11T11:31:46Z")
about $6 / gallon gas please see: > **[Petrol diesel fuel prices in Europe March 29th 2023](https://www.drive-alive.co.uk/fuel_prices_europe.html)** > > Check prices for petrol and diesel in Europe at March 29th 2023. All fuel costs in euros. See at a glance where to fill up. since 1 euro = 1,3076 USD (google, now) and 1 gallon = 3,78541178 liter (google again, a bit later then the previous now) what I pay for gas: $7,6/ gallon and yet… the economy of Holland still functions (mostly, YMMV, IANAEconomist, etc) ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2010, 6:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-school-for-pigs-open-24-7-local-sustainability/547056/102 "2010-08-12T06:21:25Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > > [@Frank](#): > > > > Notice they do not fly so much as plummet. > > Not to mention the original phrase is “teach a pig to SING”, not dance. 😉 Yet the idea of teaching them to dance _is_ a tad more evocative. ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2010, 6:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-school-for-pigs-open-24-7-local-sustainability/547056/103 "2010-08-12T06:40:15Z")
> [@adhay](#): > > > [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > > > It sounds like they made a movie of the book [Why Your World Is About To Get A Whole Lot Smaller by Jeff Rubin.](http://www.amazon.ca/Your-World-About-Whole-Smaller/dp/0307357511) Not a lot of propaganda; just a lot of good information about our cheap oil based global economy, how close we are to peak oil, and what happens after peak oil. > > And here’s a review. > > > [@](#): > > > > 5.0 out of 5 stars Now, this is what a wake up call looks like!, May 22 2009 > > By Lotta Read Rocket Hood > > This review is from: Why Your World Is About to Get a Whole Lot Smaller (Hardcover) > > As a student of international political economy and a retired journalist who knows how diligently those who benefit from consumption driven economic growth have tried to prevent “peak oil” from going mainstream, I cannot imagine a better introduction for the masses. > > > > After a 20 year stint as chief economist for CIBC World Markets, Rubin is a figure in a position to know. The book is a searing indictment of the flat-earth stupidity that marks today’s disciples of popular economic theory. He exposes a painfully obvious oversight: Conventional economic “wisdom”, blinded by the dogmatic adherence to supply and demand thinking has overlooked one thing - MORE SUPPLY CAN’T COME ON LINE IN RESPONSE TO INCREASED DEMAND IF NATURE IS LIMITING THE SUPPLY. > > > > Theory falls when facts kick you in the teeth. We have been listening to economists when we should have been listening to petroleum geologists. > > > > With credit to Kunstler, Heinberg and other leaders who paved the way for him, Rubin is someone the suits will take seriously, if for no other reason than he was one of them. There is a lot of shame to go around among our academic, corporate and political leaders. Whether they are malicious, myopic or in denial, this book is going to make holding their noses high at cocktail parties a much sweatier and nerve-racking affair. > > > > In a tight, conversational style with substantial cheek, Rubin embarrasses a civilization with this book and begs them to explore rationality and begin preparing for a harsh dose of reality. The cheap energy binge party is over - we’d better get set for the hangover. > > > > Thanks Mr. Rubin > > Just more “drek”, eh, **tom**? Oh, my word! You’ve found a laudatory review by an amateur critic in an Amazon listing. However did you manage to do that? If that doesn’t clinch your argument, I don’t know what does. I respect the seriousness of the potential crisis, but most of the Peak Oilers aren’t doing themselves any favors. I think by now, according to Kunstler, everyone was already supposed to have been desperately selling their electronics on Craigslist. (Though to what end I can’t fathom: if the sellers can no longer afford to run these items, surely any would-be buyers can’t either.) Or was it that suburban families were going to be hoofing it to their local big box stores to strip them of their copper. (Again, to what end?) ---
**Author:** ![adhay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@adhay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhay)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2010, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-school-for-pigs-open-24-7-local-sustainability/547056/104 "2010-08-12T12:19:54Z")
> [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](#): > > > [@adhay](#): > > > > And here’s a review.Just more “drek”, eh, **tom**? > > Oh, my word! You’ve found a laudatory review by an amateur critic in an Amazon listing. However did you manage to do that? If that doesn’t clinch your argument, I don’t know what does. > > I respect the seriousness of the potential crisis, but most of the Peak Oilers aren’t doing themselves any favors. I think by now, according to Kunstler, everyone was already supposed to have been desperately selling their electronics on Craigslist. (Though to what end I can’t fathom: if the sellers can no longer afford to run these items, surely any would-be buyers can’t either.) Or was it that suburban families were going to be hoofing it to their local big box stores to strip them of their copper. (Again, to what end?) I’m not familiar with Kunstler except for about 10 mins into his little novel called Made By Hand. I skimmed it and came across some useful ideas (more later) but I can’t abide his style. Back it goes. I’ll make it quick. I live in a fertile valley with lots of sun, surface water and well-developed agriculture. My town and the 2 other towns that share this valley are now kept alive and prosperous by a three month of flood of free-spending tourists who roll in every summer on cheap oil. That will pass. The agriculture is here; all that is needed is motorized transport when there is no gas at the pumps. I envision small bio-diesel/ethanol plants and modest fleets of community and private diesel and alcohol-powered vehicles. I have spent the past 2 months here literally going door to door around town and discovered that many here have considerable awareness of what’s impending. At the moment, these folks are too busy raking in the tourist dollars they will need to survive the winter to sit down and talk. I’m taking the rest of the summer off, myself. Some time after Labor Day. In response to your post, I’m in favor of bringing in as much of the 21st century a possible. While the dollar is still worth something, set up local wifi and cell networks for example. They wont last forever no matter how many spare batteries you store but they will make the transition to a post-oil economy a lot easier. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2010, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-school-for-pigs-open-24-7-local-sustainability/547056/105 "2010-08-12T19:46:22Z")
> [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](#): > > > [@Guinastasia](#): > > > > Not to mention the original phrase is “teach a pig to SING”, not dance. 😉 > > Yet the idea of teaching them to dance _is_ a tad more evocative. It’s ‘maybe the horse will dance’ if you’re going for the “dance” metaphor. A horse-thief is in jail and as he’s being led out to be executed, he says to the king “Ah, your majesty–my only regret is I don’t have one more year. I am a great animal trainer and my life’s goal was to teach the horse to dance for you.” The king thinks a minute and grants the prisoner one year to teach the horse to dance. The jailer leads the thief back to the cell and says “I know for a fact that you’ve never trained an animal in your life. So why did you do that?” The prisoner replies “A year is a long time, my friend. The king may die. I may escape. And maybe the horse will dance.” All of that is irrelevant to the fact that the OP is an idiot. I’ll be sure to leave an unnecessary light on somewhere just to cause his blood-pressure to go a bit higher. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![adhay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@adhay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhay)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2010, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-school-for-pigs-open-24-7-local-sustainability/547056/106 "2010-08-18T22:38:55Z")
> [@](#): > > I’ll be sure to leave an unnecessary light on somewhere just to cause his blood-pressure to go a bit higher. 😉 Aside from your motives, I appreciate the light. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2010, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-school-for-pigs-open-24-7-local-sustainability/547056/107 "2010-08-18T23:09:31Z")
> [@adhay](#): > > In response to your post, I’m in favor of bringing in as much of the 21st century a possible. While the dollar is still worth something, set up local wifi and cell networks for example. They wont last forever no matter how many spare batteries you store but they will make the transition to a post-oil economy a lot easier. What part of “nuclear” is unclear? (Answer: all of it - just in a different order.) When that gasoline-powered generator that you’re using to charge your cell phone runs dry, there will be alternatives. Several of them are already developed techniology, which only haven’t supplanted oil because people are too busy raking in the oil dollars they will need to survive the winter to sit down and implement the alternatives. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2010, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-school-for-pigs-open-24-7-local-sustainability/547056/108 "2010-08-18T23:44:27Z")
If horses can’t dance, then how do you explain the [Lipizzaners](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lipizzan)? Huh? HUH??? ---
**Author:** ![Triskadecamus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b19c9b/32.png) [@Triskadecamus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Triskadecamus)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2010, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-school-for-pigs-open-24-7-local-sustainability/547056/109 "2010-08-19T15:52:47Z")
And, by the way, the pig quote is not originally posted by you, it’s from Robert Heinlein. Tris ---
**Author:** ![adhay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@adhay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhay)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2010, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-school-for-pigs-open-24-7-local-sustainability/547056/110 "2010-08-19T22:31:16Z")
> [@mlees](#): > > > [@Adhay](#): > > > > … > > > [@](#): > > > > Seems like no matter where I go, there I am. That would be, here I am. Trust me. ---
**Author:** ![adhay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@adhay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhay)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2010, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-school-for-pigs-open-24-7-local-sustainability/547056/111 "2010-08-19T22:36:23Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > If horses can’t dance, then how do you explain the [Lipizzaners](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lipizzan)? Huh? HUH??? They are not pigs? ---
**Author:** ![adhay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@adhay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhay)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2010, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-school-for-pigs-open-24-7-local-sustainability/547056/112 "2010-08-19T22:42:15Z")
> [@Triskadecamus](#): > > And, by the way, the pig quote is not originally posted by you, it’s from Robert Heinlein. > > Tris I attributed it here. [Comedy Central The Daily Show Fan Page](http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/thu-june-17-2010/fred-thompson). So? ---
**Author:** ![adhay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@adhay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhay)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2010, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-school-for-pigs-open-24-7-local-sustainability/547056/113 "2010-08-22T03:19:41Z")
Last bump. Is any among you dancing? Don’t whistle if you are. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-school-for-pigs-open-24-7-local-sustainability/547056.md?page=5)