# Dancing with the Stars -- DWTS -- Spring 2012 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 28, 2012, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253 "2012-02-28T14:05:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Feyrat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/fbc32d/32.png) [@Feyrat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Feyrat)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2012, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253/61 "2012-03-20T19:04:03Z")
> [@twickster](#): > > We all love Derek. Loving Derek is a prerequisite for participating in these threads. šŸ˜‰ Not true! I do not love Derek - I think heā€™s way over-hyped. Heā€™s good, donā€™t get me wrong, and possibly one of the best for showcasing his partner with his choreography, but it really got under my skin last season how everyone was constantly pimping him and falling at his feet. ---
**Author:** ![Girl\_Next\_Door](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@Girl\_Next\_Door](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Girl_Next_Door)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2012, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253/62 "2012-03-20T20:01:03Z")
> [@Oy](#): > > It was a good season opener, although I think the judges and Bergeronā€™s memories are faulty. Kristi Yamaguchi got a well deserved triple nine her first week, and didnā€™t score less than a nine on any dance until week 7, so neither Katherine nor Jaleel performed the best first night dance ever. > > I suspect they lured Derek back this season by giving him his choice of partners. On paper his choice looked good, but I suspect that he picked the wrong one. Maria was solidly middle of the pack, and that laugh would drive most people over the edge within a week or so. Still, if anyone can get her into the finals, itā€™s him. Heā€™s a superlative teacher and choreographer. > > I didnā€™t understand the judge love for Jack and Anna. He struck me as having poor posture, stiff and awkward movement, no heel leads and iffy footwork. If he was ever a hearthrob, I find it puzzling. > > Donald, on the other hand, was delightful, and I thought much better than Jack, even though the judges scored him lower. Yes, his exuberance led him to some lack of control, but stillā€¦ Weā€™ll have to see how he does on ballroom; if he can exercise the control and grace necessary, heā€™s a potential contender. > > I found Gavin to be charming, and less stiff and awkward than Jack. I didnā€™t understand his low marks. > > Roshon has been a tad over-influenced by Michael Jackson. He was tight, precise, and clearly both skilled and talented. If he can shake the hip-hop for real ballroom, heā€™s a shoe-in for the finals. Chelsieā€™s a good choice of partner for him. > > Sherri was really enjoying herself, and she wasnā€™t bad. I find her loud enthusiasm a little wearing. Well, more than a little. And apparently not an intellectual giant, although given the existence of Brooke, we already know that thereā€™s no necessary correlation between intelligence and dance ability. > > Melissa disappointed me, because she was one of the three ā€œstarsā€ Iā€™d actually heard of. The judges liked her better than I did, and they really didnā€™t like her all that much. She was better than Martina, but thatā€™s about the best I can say for her. Maks over-danced her, which rarely helps for the female stars (it can help if the pretty female pro dances around a male contestant). > > Williamā€™s reception puzzled me. Yeah, heā€™s a good looking guy. But this show has had Jason Taylor, Rick Fox, and Gilles Marini, none of whom had women screaming over them, and all of whom were (to my eye) much better looking. Go figure. His dancing was fine; Cheryl knows how to choreograph to her partnerā€™s advantage. > > Martina confirmed what Monica Seles had shown earlier - tennis is not a good background for ballroom dance. The judges were much kinder than I would have been, but then it was evident that she was terrified, so maybe I would have been kind too. > > Katherine was lovely. She seemed in tears as the judges spoke to her; was she that nervous, or was it part of her ingenue persona? Unlike some of you, I thought Mark restrained himself pretty well. > > Gladys and Tristan were delightful. Sheā€™s in her upper sixties, so you donā€™t expect all that much in the way of technique, but for a woman her age, she had the moves, and she was clearly enjoying herself. She wasnā€™t cringe-inducing, as so many of the older contestants have been. And heaven knows, she has got to be easier to deal with than Nancy Grace was, so itā€™s got to be better for young Tristan. > > But the big surprise of the evening was Jaleel. He was a younger, lither Donny Osmond, and I mean that in the best way. If he can do Latin any where nearly as well as he can do ballroom, heā€™s my pick for the season. Kym knows how to choreograph his type, and heā€™s apparently fit and really agile, as well as just plain good. I was really, really impressed. > > So my picks as of the moment for the final are Jaleel, Katherine, and Roshon, with either Sherri or William for the semi-final. No really terrible dancers except Martina, and she wonā€™t be around long. No outright ringers. Looks like a good season. I am 100% in agreement. OK, 97% (Mark is a knob.) ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2012, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253/63 "2012-03-21T00:22:00Z")
Dwts ratings continue to slip. This is season 14 and really not that surprising. Ratings took a big nose dive after season 12 and its not gotten better. Season 13ā€™s weak cast really hurt the show. 34% drop is pretty bad. Maybe word will get out that this season has a great cast thats worth watching. > [@](#): > > Dancing With The Stars Season 14 Ratings > ā€œDancing With the Starsā€ Season 14 debuted to low ratings. > > Has the ballroom lost its sheen? ā€œDancing With the Starsā€ Season 14 kicked off on Monday with 18.5 million viewers tuning in, but was down from the previous two seasons. > > According to ABC, the ā€œDWTSā€ premiere scored a 3.5 rating in the 18-49 demo. When _compared to the Season 12 premiere, the show was down 34 percent and 13 percent from the Season 13 premiere._ Season 13 debuted to roughly 19 million viewers and a 4.0 rating in the demographic. Season 12 had 22.7 million viewers with a 5.3 rating in the demo. > **['Dancing With The Stars' Losing Its Luster?](https://www.huffpost.com/entry/dancing-with-the-stars-season-14-ratings_n_1367518)** > > 'Dancing With The Stars' Losing Its Luster? ---
**Author:** ![amarinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@amarinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amarinth)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2012, 6:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253/64 "2012-03-21T06:27:54Z")
Finally saw it - that was a really strong first night. I liked: Maria & Derek Donald (but not Peta - I donā€™t think her choreography was showing him off the way it should have) William & Cheryl Katherine & Mark - hopefully she has a fanbase and Mark doesnā€™t ruin it Gladys & Tristan (that woman is 68 years old - not the best dance, but I really liked watching her) Jaleel & Kym Iā€™m glad they get an automatic second week. And someone needs to turn down the volume on Maksā€™s spray tan. ---
**Author:** ![carlb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carlb/32/5930_2.png) [@carlb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carlb)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2012, 12:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253/65 "2012-03-21T12:14:00Z")
Interesting first night - seemed to me like the worst of the dancers would be lower-middle of the pack in previous seasons. Nobody was outright embarrassing; there were no Master Ps, no Kenny Maynes, no Tucker Carlsons. If I had to make an early prediction on whoā€™s going home first it would be Martina. In a way itā€™s a shame, because in any other season she would get to stick around for a few weeks, and weā€™d get to see if she improves and by how much. I donā€™t see that happening this time around. **BRAG TIME!!** My wife and I have tickets to the finale! We won them at a charity auction. What was really cool was that it was just listed as tickets to the show. In the middle of the bidding (and surely to pump up the dollar figure), the auctioneer (who was Nick Kosovich) announced that the tickets would be for the finale. PLUS, we get a dance lesson with the Kosoviches. Iā€™m more excited than any straight male has a right to be. šŸ™‚ ---
**Author:** ![Oy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bc8723/32.png) [@Oy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oy)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2012, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253/66 "2012-03-21T12:30:07Z")
Good for you, **carlb**! And good on you for being a happily straight guy willing to enjoy ballroom dance without fearing that somehow that will make his equipment shrivel and drop off or otherwise revoke his manly man privileges. ---
**Author:** ![not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/not_what_you_d_expect/32/3246_2.png) [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/not_what_you_d_expect)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2012, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253/67 "2012-03-21T12:47:45Z")
I finally got to watch the show. My husband said he doesnā€™t want to watch this year, so I was trying to work around him. Of course, this doesnā€™t stop him from making wise cracks when he passes through the room. (Melissa needs to watch her facial expressions while listening to the judges.) And then he sits down and watches it anyway. I like everyone this year. I had actually heard of all of the stars except Katherine Jenkins and Roshon. Katherine is absolutely lovely. Roshon can move. Gavin is charming. Almost all of them can actually dance. Excellent start. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2012, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253/68 "2012-03-21T13:22:08Z")
Another one chiming in to say that this is the strongest field I can remember for this show. Think Iā€™ll root for Jaleel, as he seemed the most surprising breakout of the group. Gladys and Martina may be the weakest so far, but no one really stunk up the joint. Didnā€™t catch the live show, so have no idea what the first-week scores were. ABC, in its infinite wisdom, cut off the on-line replays just before the judges rendered their verdicts. Also sat in front of the TeeVee Tuesday patiently waiting for the results show, not realizing that thereā€™s (apparently) none until next week. Dā€™oh! ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2012, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253/69 "2012-03-21T14:08:18Z")
> [@amarinth](#): > > And someone needs to turn down the volume on Maksā€™s spray tan. Word. ---
**Author:** ![Andiethewestie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba9def/32.png) [@Andiethewestie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andiethewestie)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253/70 "2012-03-24T03:47:36Z")
The top 4 contenders I think based on likability, fanbase and dancing is Jaleel, William, Donald and Maria. I think Kathryn while a high scorer just wonā€™t be getting the needed votes, unless of course she gets points that will separate her from the pack. Right now on the DWTS facebook page fans are going nuts for William, and I certainly see the attraction. Not only is he a very good looking guy, heā€™s got the Latino vote because heā€™s a household name in Latin Americaā€¦ it is literally like putting Brad Pitt on DWTS for the Latinos and thereā€™s a nice sized fanbase in Miami and Puerto Rico, not to mention a pretty strong fanbase outside North America. As for dancing, I think William did very well for having half the practice time of everyone else. The Quickstep will tell us if he can hold it together. Jaleel was a natural on the Foxtrot, even if the posture and the footwork were messy, but heā€™ll be right in the zone on the Jive, having Kym choreograph jives is a real treat. I suspect Kathryn has had lots of training, sheā€™s been in the Royal Academy of Music and took Musical Theatre, similar to Nicole Scherzinger. Thereā€™s youtubes of her dancing, in Carmen and in a tap chorus line and sheā€™s very credible on stage, so I am pretty sure sheā€™ll rival Jaleel again. Donald is just a great personality, he did get a little out of control in parts on his Cha Cha, and it became more club than ballroom. He should be better on the Quickstep, if he can get the posture better, heā€™s got quite a hunch. Maria really stiffened up, and maybe she was over-rehearsed, because I think theyā€™ll come back with a much better showing on the Quickstep. This next dance is definitely Derekā€™s forte, and sheā€™ll benefit from his choreography. The others are all middle dancers with Gavin and Martina and even Jack a little too stiff and need to loosen up. I am afraid for them this week, since they have to do Jive and over thinkers never do well at it, itā€™s a dance you just have to let go and let live. Rochon is a great little dancer, but the hip hop is really ā€œpartā€ of him, and thatā€™s tough to let go of, but he might be okay on the Quickstep if he can maintain hold. Sherry is okay, and will probably get sympathy with weight issues and single mom stuff, but her line isnā€™t really as pleasing to watch. I think Gladys will be fine on the Quickstep, but I suspect it wonā€™t be as ā€œquickā€ as some of the others. Gladys got a little tripped up in spots on the Cha Cha and I donā€™t think Tristan will be over ambitious for the next dance. Melissa had a rough week but I think the Quickstep sheā€™ll do better even though Maks isnā€™t the best at choreographing this dance. ---
**Author:** ![Oy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bc8723/32.png) [@Oy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oy)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253/71 "2012-03-24T13:41:01Z")
> [@Andiethewestie](#): > > The top 4 contenders I think based on likability, fanbase and dancing is Jaleel, William, Donald and Maria. I think Kathryn while a high scorer just wonā€™t be getting the needed votes, unless of course she gets points that will separate her from the pack. > > Right now on the DWTS facebook page fans are going nuts for William, and I certainly see the attraction. Not only is he a very good looking guy, heā€™s got the Latino vote because heā€™s a household name in Latin America.. it is literally like putting Brad Pitt on DWTS for the Latinos and thereā€™s a nice sized fanbase in Miami and Puerto Rico, not to mention a pretty strong fanbase outside North America. As for dancing, I think William did very well for having half the practice time of everyone else. The Quickstep will tell us if he can hold it together. > > Jaleel was a natural on the Foxtrot, even if the posture and the footwork were messy, but heā€™ll be right in the zone on the Jive, having Kym choreograph jives is a real treat. I suspect Kathryn has had lots of training, sheā€™s been in the Royal Academy of Music and took Musical Theatre, similar to Nicole Scherzinger. Thereā€™s youtubes of her dancing, in Carmen and in a tap chorus line and sheā€™s very credible on stage, so I am pretty sure sheā€™ll rival Jaleel again. > > Donald is just a great personality, he did get a little out of control in parts on his Cha Cha, and it became more club than ballroom. He should be better on the Quickstep, if he can get the posture better, heā€™s got quite a hunch. > > Maria really stiffened up, and maybe she was over-rehearsed, because I think theyā€™ll come back with a much better showing on the Quickstep. This next dance is definitely Derekā€™s forte, and sheā€™ll benefit from his choreography. > > The others are all middle dancers with Gavin and Martina and even Jack a little too stiff and need to loosen up. I am afraid for them this week, since they have to do Jive and over thinkers never do well at it, itā€™s a dance you just have to let go and let live. Rochon is a great little dancer, but the hip hop is really ā€œpartā€ of him, and thatā€™s tough to let go of, but he might be okay on the Quickstep if he can maintain hold. Sherry is okay, and will probably get sympathy with weight issues and single mom stuff, but her line isnā€™t really as pleasing to watch. I think Gladys will be fine on the Quickstep, but I suspect it wonā€™t be as ā€œquickā€ as some of the others. Gladys got a little tripped up in spots on the Cha Cha and I donā€™t think Tristan will be over ambitious for the next dance. Melissa had a rough week but I think the Quickstep sheā€™ll do better even though Maks isnā€™t the best at choreographing this dance. I was under the impression that William was a really big Latino soap star. That doesnā€™t correspond to Brad Pitt - more like Susan Lucci. That said, I think your point about his being a household name for the Latino population is a good one, especially since, given his looks, he will appeal to the women who make up the majority of the fanbase for this show. I think Katherine will do better with the fans than you think she will, **Andie**. But itā€™s always a crapshoot with the audience, so I wonā€™t be shocked if Iā€™m wrong. Chelsea did a very good job of smacking the ā€œcoolā€ out of Romeo in season 12, so much so that Romeo actually seemed to fall in love with ballroom. I think thereā€™s a good chance sheā€™ll be able to do the same with Roshon, who doesnā€™t have the nasty attitude Romeo started out with (he ended up going through what appeared to be a fundamental personality change in the course of the season, and hugely for the better. I hope it carried through to his real life.). And I disagree with you about Maria. I think she was strictly middle-of-the-pack. She reminds me of Shannon Elizabeth. But Iā€™m one of Derekā€™s fans, so I hope youā€™re right. ---
**Author:** ![Andiethewestie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba9def/32.png) [@Andiethewestie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andiethewestie)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253/72 "2012-03-24T16:34:15Z")
> [@Oy](#): > > I was under the impression that William was a really big Latino soap star. That doesnā€™t correspond to Brad Pitt - more like Susan Lucci. That said, I think your point about his being a household name for the Latino population is a good one, especially since, given his looks, he will appeal to the women who make up the majority of the fanbase for this show. > > I think Katherine will do better with the fans than you think she will, **Andie**. But itā€™s always a crapshoot with the audience, so I wonā€™t be shocked if Iā€™m wrong. > > Chelsea did a very good job of smacking the ā€œcoolā€ out of Romeo in season 12, so much so that Romeo actually seemed to fall in love with ballroom. I think thereā€™s a good chance sheā€™ll be able to do the same with Roshon, who doesnā€™t have the nasty attitude Romeo started out with (he ended up going through what appeared to be a fundamental personality change in the course of the season, and hugely for the better. I hope it carried through to his real life.). > > And I disagree with you about Maria. I think she was strictly middle-of-the-pack. She reminds me of Shannon Elizabeth. But Iā€™m one of Derekā€™s fans, so I hope youā€™re right. Thanks for your responses. I guess I should explain myself more. For me, Katherine is a very strong dancer no question about it, but she will have to contend with some formidable fan bases stateside, including Levy who has legions of American fans in the Latino community in Florida and Puerto Rico. If Katherine stays consistently top 3 throughout the competition sheā€™ll go far. If she has one bad night I definitely see a Sabrina Bryan scenario. My sense about Levyā€™s fanbase is itā€™s far beyond Lucci, whoā€™s more famous for the number of times she didnā€™t win an emmy than for her acting. For a Latino to get recognized in the American mainstream is big to that community. Think more a Clooney when he was on ER, or Depp when he was on 21 Jump Street, who looks like Pitt when he was in Thelma and Louise, then you get a sense of the enormity of his popularity with latinos, since heā€™s apparently done some movie work as well. You just donā€™t get this kind of swooning for a tv star unless theyā€™re in the Clooneyfied stratosphere. To my eye, Romeo never really danced well, but that season had very few strong dancers outside the top 3. This season thereā€™s at least 6 dancers who can easily contend for the top 3 without the ā€˜affectā€™ of unlearning another dance style. So I think Roshon has his work cut out for him. Not saying he canā€™t get there, but other fanbases may have something to say about it. Yes, I agree Maria is more Shannon than Nicole thatā€™s for sure, but I do think nerves were a factor in her stiff cha cha. But thereā€™s a high likabilty about Maria that will probably score well with Americans who see her everyday on television. She is not as polarizing as Sherry Shepherd, for example who has been outspoken so may not have the same kind of support. I could be wrong, but people either love Sherry or really dislike her. Derek should be able to take Maria farther than Shannon. He says he doesnā€™t like the Cha Cha to choreograph but he really likes the Quickstep and it will sell Maria well. It was one of Shannonā€™s best dances, and like Maria I see Ballroom being a better fit for her. ---
**Author:** ![Andiethewestie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba9def/32.png) [@Andiethewestie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andiethewestie)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253/73 "2012-03-24T17:06:45Z")
Now I know that basing the show on the odds makers is problematic, but I think they may be onto something this season. Since everyone is doing well, fanbases are going to be extremely important. Hereā€™s the next set of odds: Jaleel White 11/4 William Levy 7/2 Donald Driver 4/1 Maria Menounos 13/2 Katherine Jenkins 15/2 Roshon Fegan 8/1 Gladys Knight 15/1 Jack Wagner 15/1 Melissa Gilbert 18/1 Sherri Shepherd 20/1 Gavin DeGraw 35/1 Martina Navratilova 50/1 Wednesday, March 28, 2012 (Times shown in Central Daylight Time) These things change weekly, but thereā€™s one thing that sticks out for me. Despite the fact that Katherine Jenkins has scored 2 points higher than William, and 5 points higher than either Maria or Donald, her chances of winning are below these three who are more well known. She should be close to the top, not 5th. This is why for me, she is more vulnerable to a shocking elimination than some of the others. ---
**Author:** ![tumbleddown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e9bcb4/32.png) [@tumbleddown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tumbleddown)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253/74 "2012-03-24T21:22:11Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > Dwts ratings continue to slip. This is season 14 and really not that surprising. Ratings took a big nose dive after season 12 and its not gotten better. Season 13ā€™s weak cast really hurt the show. 34% drop is pretty bad. The ratings right now are not only a result of last season being enh. The biggest loss in demographic is in the Under-30s who are all over on NBC watching ā€œThe Voiceā€ which has huge ratings in that demo. ABC would do well in considering a move to another set of nights for DWTS, though I donā€™t know how that would work with Len & Brunoā€™s SCD commitments. ---
**Author:** ![Andiethewestie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba9def/32.png) [@Andiethewestie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andiethewestie)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253/75 "2012-03-24T21:41:54Z")
> [@tumbleddown](#): > > The ratings right now are not only a result of last season being enh. The biggest loss in demographic is in the Under-30s who are all over on NBC watching ā€œThe Voiceā€ which has huge ratings in that demo. ABC would do well in considering a move to another set of nights for DWTS, though I donā€™t know how that would work with Len & Brunoā€™s SCD commitments. Itā€™s highly doubtful ABC would move the night. Considering they have took 5 million viewers away from The Voice and won the night, they still win the timeslots easily. They have always struggled with the 18-32 demo, thatā€™s pretty much always the case. When they were up against House it was the same thing. The younger audience just doesnā€™t watch DWTS. Advertisers have to realise that the 18-32 year olds arenā€™t necessarily the biggest buyers out there, in fact many would argue the older demo has more buying power. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253/76 "2012-03-24T22:00:52Z")
Anyone know if Melissa Gilbert had a lot of plastic surgery? Thereā€™s a lot of comments about her looking like Joan Rivers in a red wig. It makes me sad seeing her with that mask like face. I knew half-pint grew up, but dang she didnā€™t have to look like this. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253/77 "2012-03-24T22:23:04Z")
This article speculates Melissa had work done just before the new season started. > **[Melissa Gilbert Prepped With Plastic Surgeon Before 'DWTS' Premiere](https://okmagazine.com/news/melissa-gilbert-prepped-plastic-surgeon-dwts-premiere/)** > > Sure, some stars end up lifting weights or getting into better shape when they do their thing on the dance floor, but for Melissa Gilbert it appears she visited ---
**Author:** ![Andiethewestie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba9def/32.png) [@Andiethewestie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andiethewestie)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2012, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253/78 "2012-03-25T01:03:16Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > This article speculates Melissa had work done just before the new season started. > [http://www.okmagazine.com/news/melissa-gilbert-prepped-plastic-surgeon-dwts-premiere](http://www.okmagazine.com/news/melissa-gilbert-prepped-plastic-surgeon-dwts-premiere) Being over 30 is in this business is particularly cruel to women. I donā€™t begrudge her wanting to get something done, if it helps her psychologically. In our effā€™d up youth worship in the world today women would rather hear ā€œsheā€™s had work doneā€ even if itā€™s not great instead of ā€œsheā€™s getting oldā€ Not only is it a blow to the ego, itā€™s a significant shock to the pocketbook. ---
**Author:** ![Oy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bc8723/32.png) [@Oy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oy)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2012, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253/79 "2012-03-25T14:12:36Z")
**Andie** , could you explain what those odds mean? Iā€™m sorry, but I donā€™t gamble or follow gambling or know anyone who does, so I donā€™t understand how the numbers work or what they represent. Iā€™m kind of like someone who has never played cards trying to understand the bidding and scoring for bridge (which I can play, and _still_ would have trouble explaining to a novice). ---
**Author:** ![Andiethewestie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba9def/32.png) [@Andiethewestie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andiethewestie)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2012, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253/80 "2012-03-25T19:16:11Z")
Well, I am not a bookie, but I think what the betting odds mean is the amount of risk involved in placing a bet on a star to win. Right now the risk is minimal for Jaleel vs. Martina. Jaleel is the favorite so you can still win, if you bet on Jaleel, but the return isnā€™t high. However, it is better to place a bet on Jaleel when the odds against him are still in play, meaning that on the fraction the denominator is lower than the numerator. The higher the favorite the less risk involved, so they get ranked based on the probability of winning the season. So if you put down 4dollars on Jaleel, you would get in return 15 dollars (11 dollars profit plus your original bet of 4). But if you put 4 dollars on Martina, you could win 404 (400 dollars profit plus 4 dollars bet, because you multiply that number 50 x4 and add your original bet. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dancing-with-the-stars-dwts-spring-2012/614253.md?page=5)