# DC Sniper to be executed tonight **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 10, 2009, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078 "2009-11-10T18:54:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2009, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078/61 "2009-11-11T04:37:30Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > You said that denying women abortion for instance was immoral and that killing a thinking, rational human being is immoral, thus is that not absolute morality or do you think there are exceptions to this other than self-defence? Well, it’s hard for me to think of a good reason to deny a woman an abortion, short of something ridiculous like the death of the fetus setting off a big bomb somewhere ( sort of the pregnancy version of _Speed_ ). But that’s still not “absolute”. Nor is it absolute in the sense of being a law of physics or some such. It’s just that the fetus is a lump of tissue, and the woman is a person and there aren’t many plausible situations where the needs of a lump of tissue override the desires of an actual person. As for killing people, I’m no pacifist. As I said; my main objection to the death penalty is that I don’t trust the government to kill the right people, and leave the innocents alone. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2009, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078/62 "2009-11-11T04:51:12Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Is that an official athiest belief? Yes I am their spokesman. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2009, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078/63 "2009-11-11T04:51:40Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > I don’t necessarily wish the guy to get raped, but he should be serving some serious hard time in jail for the rest of his living days. Well, you sort-of got your wish, he _did_ die in jail. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2009, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078/64 "2009-11-11T05:04:26Z")
[QUOTE=gonzomax] Yes I am their spokesman. [/QUOTE] You just single handedly brought a whole bunch of folks home to Jesus… > [@](#): > > We atheists have great respect for life. I think Hitler, Stalin and Mao were all atheists, so I’m a bit unsure how your premise holds up. For that matter, I seem to recall that Timothy McVeigh claimed to be an atheist… 😛 -XT ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2009, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078/65 "2009-11-11T05:16:59Z")
Heck, I’m an atheist who doesn’t have a moral problem with the death penalty. My objection is on purely practical grounds. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2009, 5:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078/66 "2009-11-11T05:23:31Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > I think Hitler, Stalin and Mao were all atheists, so I’m a bit unsure how your premise holds up. The claim that Hitler was an atheist has little basis other than the belief that Evil = Atheism, as far as I know. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2009, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078/67 "2009-11-11T05:28:26Z")
[The Religion of Hitler » Internet Infidels](http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/john_murphy/religionofhitler.html) Hitler was far from an atheist and made many public references toward the bible. The bible thumpers are denying one of their own. ---
**Author:** ![TurboNuke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f19dbf/32.png) [@TurboNuke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TurboNuke)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2009, 7:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078/68 "2009-11-11T07:30:08Z")
I’m an atheist. Uh theres no afterlife right? So theres no pleasure or pain after death, there’s nothing. So with your highly evolved atheistic sensibilities you think its better to keep him alive and torture him? IMO, put him down like a sick dog and his troubles and ours will be over with. And for those who think that we don’t have to kill him because keeping him in prison is effortless, you ever hear of prison guards? You think you’re responsible for his death when the goverment kills but it’s perfectly acceptable to let someone else risk his life imprisoning him. Hypocritical. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2009, 8:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078/69 "2009-11-11T08:38:17Z")
[QUOTE=Der Trihs] The claim that Hitler was an atheist has little basis other than the belief that Evil = Atheism, as far as I know. [/QUOTE] Could be wrong about Hitler…I thought he once self identified himself as atheist, but I might be mis-remembering. I was just tweaking gonzo’s nose in any case. -XT ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2009, 8:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078/70 "2009-11-11T08:47:24Z")
According to [wiki](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolf_Hitler%27s_religious_beliefs) (because I’m bored), here is what they have to say about Hitler’s religious beliefs: > [@](#): > > Adolf Hitler’s religious beliefs have been a matter of dispute, in part because of apparently inconsistent statements made by and attributed to him. The relationship between Nazism and religion was complex and shifting over the period of the Nazi Party’s existence and during its years in power. > [@](#): > > Early on, Hitler expressed his opinion about God and religion as follows, “We do not want any other god than Germany itself. It is essential to have fanatical faith and hope and love in and for Germany.”[7] > [@](#): > > Hitler’s private statements about Christianity were largely negative. Hitler’s intimates, such as Joseph Goebbels, Albert Speer, and Martin Bormann, report many[specify] such statements, although the historical validity of some remarks has been questioned, particularly the collection called Hitler’s Table Talk. Ian Kershaw makes clear the questionable nature of Table Talk as a source;[17] however, although Kershaw recommends treating the work with caution, he does not suggest dispensing with it altogether. Atheist activist/historian Richard Carrier goes further, contending that certain portions of Table Talk, especially those regarding Hitler’s hatred of Christianity, are mistranslations.[18] Carrier states that Hitler was criticizing Catholicism in particular, while remaining religious.[19] Speer confirmed the authenticity of those of Hitler’s table talk transcripts made by Henry Picker in his 1976 Spandau: The Secret Diaries, and rejected accusations calling Picker a cunning forger. > [@](#): > > Some scholars maintain, that in contrast to other Nazi leaders, Hitler did not adhere to esoteric ideas, occultism, or Nazi mysticism, and even ridiculed such beliefs in private and possibly in public.[24] Other scholars believe the young Hitler was strongly influenced, particularly in his racial views, by an abundance of occult works on the mystical superiority of the Germans, like the occult and anti-semitic magazine Ostara, and give credence to the claim of its publisher Lanz von Liebenfels that Hitler visited him in 1909 and praised his work.[25] Indeed, evidence indicates Hitler was a regular reader of Ostara.[26] Drawing on higher criticism and some branches of theologically liberal Protestantism, Hitler for a time advocated for German Christians a Positive Christianity, traditional Christianity purged of everything that he found objectionable and with certain, particularly racist, additions. Hitler never directed his attacks on Jesus himself,[27] but viewed traditional Christianity as a corruption of the original ideas of Jesus, whom Hitler regarded as an Aryan opponent of the Jews.[28] In Mein Kampf Hitler writes that Jesus “made no secret of his attitude toward the Jewish people, and when necessary he even took the whip to drive from the temple of the Lord this adversary of all humanity, who then as always saw in religion nothing but an instrument for his business existence. In return, Christ was nailed to the cross.” Hitler downplayed the idea of Jesus’ redemptive suffering, stating in a speech in 1927:[dubious – discuss] So, as with much of Hitler’s life and beliefs, the only thing one can say with certainty is that the man was a first class loon. [QUOTE=gonzomax] Hitler was far from an atheist and made many public references toward the bible. The bible thumpers are denying one of their own [/QUOTE] If you say so, gonzo. The assertion doesn’t seem to be supported by the facts, but that has never stopped you before. -XT ---
**Author:** ![tumbleddown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e9bcb4/32.png) [@tumbleddown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tumbleddown)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2009, 10:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078/71 "2009-11-11T10:17:27Z")
> [@bup](#): > > So even though I’m sure this is the guy, I still wish our society was better than to kill him to show that killing is wrong. I feel much the same way. Mixed messages, in the extreme. Besides, it’s 2009. Technology is amazing. This man should’ve been in a small soundproofed, egg-shaped room. Him, with one chair, one that could be moved into a reclining position by controls outside the room. (Egg-shaped room denying him any other place to sit or lay down.) In front of the chair, a large screen TV showing photos of his victims and via loudspeakers, the voices of their family members and loved ones, explicating at length and in detail about what was stolen from them. On a loop. Twenty hours a day. Non-continuous hours. There could be a phone number. Victims’ family members should be able, if they’re inclined, to call that number and add to the recording. Victims’ birthday, the family should be able to call and talk about how it’s another year and their father/brother/son/husband/uncle is still gone, how he’d be X years old today, and so on. And that should be piped into the punishment egg at an especially amplified volume. An inescapable and constant reminder of what youv’e done. Now _that’s_ fit punishment. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2009, 10:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078/72 "2009-11-11T10:42:18Z")
> [@tumbleddown](#): > > An inescapable and constant reminder of what youv’e done. Now _that’s_ fit punishment. Doesn’t that rather assume that he’s sorry already? ---
**Author:** ![amanset](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8dc957/32.png) [@amanset](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amanset)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2009, 11:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078/73 "2009-11-11T11:07:00Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > I’d honestly rather see him rot in prison for the rest of his life, being used as a fuck toy by a big hairy guy named Bubba. Hopefully to have a VERY long life to contemplate what he did. > > -XT Just imagine the outrage here if someone declared that they’d like to see a woman repeatedly, forcibly raped for the rest of her life. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2009, 11:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078/74 "2009-11-11T11:25:39Z")
> [@BiblioCat](#): > > I’ve seen this arguement whenever this subject comes up, and I can’t figure out how executing someone is more expensive than imprisoning that same person. The cost of the state supporting him (food, clothes, medical care, just to start) for years or even decades must be astronomical. I tend to get a bit resentful … mrAru and I have to _work_ to get food, shelter, cable and medical care. Theirs may not be fancy, but damn it, we do not live an extravagant life, nor do we in general eat fancy food. Any ‘gourmetness’ comes from the effort to use decent ingredients and cook from scratch instead of from convenience foods. Why should they break the law, and get supported for years on my tax dollar? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2009, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078/75 "2009-11-11T11:51:21Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > Anyways good riddance to this sniper SOB and even if it does not deter crime the death penalty is necessary for the government to function absolute justice and morality. There’s no absolute justice and morality, but the weird thing here is that you think a government can reliably dispense it. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2009, 11:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078/76 "2009-11-11T11:52:15Z")
> [@aruvqan](#): > > Why should they break the law, and get supported for years on my tax dollar? Because we as a society have decided that prison is the solution to just about every social problem; with the result that we have a gigantic prison population. And if your argument is that they should be forced to work, that just means you are driving down the wages or eliminating the jobs of the law abiding citizens who would otherwise do those jobs. And if your argument is they should be executed, that’s expensive as well. ---
**Author:** ![Markxxx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5daacb/32.png) [@Markxxx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Markxxx)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2009, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078/77 "2009-11-11T12:41:43Z")
Lucky for Susan Smith, the woman who killer her two kids and then blamed a black guy for doing it. Oh yeah women almost never get the death penalty no matter how vicious or malicious their crimes are. That’s my peeve with the death penalty is that it is so unfairly applied. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2009, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078/78 "2009-11-11T14:25:36Z")
> [@Markxxx](#): > > Lucky for Susan Smith, the woman who killer her two kids and then blamed a black guy for doing it. We need to do way instain mother\> who killer thier babbys. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2009, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078/79 "2009-11-11T14:35:33Z")
> [@Markxxx](#): > > Lucky for Susan Smith, the woman who killer her two kids and then blamed a black guy for doing it. > > Oh yeah women almost never get the death penalty no matter how vicious or malicious their crimes are. > > That’s my peeve with the death penalty is that it is so unfairly applied. I believe the strongest correlation is between killing a stranger and getting the DP. Susan Smith killed her own children, which is an extremely common set of circumstances for women murderers. Note that the sniper killed strangers. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2009, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078/80 "2009-11-11T15:00:56Z")
> [@jtgain](#): > > We certainly need to make sure we aren’t executing an innocent person, but can’t we do that in less than 20+ years like it takes California? That system seems almost pointless. > > I see it sometimes “John Smith was executed by lethal injection today for the 1986 rape and murder of…” and I’m thinking, 1986? The man was a different person then. I was a kid living at home with mom and dad. It makes no sense, for justice or otherwise to wait that damned long. This sounds really peculiar to me. I can see arguing that long waits for execution are expensive or inefficient, but arguing that they make capital punishment “almost pointless”? You object to waiting 20+ years to execute offenders because “the man was a different person then”? In other words, he might now have changed into somebody who wouldn’t commit such crimes, so it no longer seems quite just or appropriate to execute him? You sound as though you’re saying “We need to hurry up and off these evil murderers before they get a chance to repent and become non-evil former murderers who don’t deserve to be offed!” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dc-sniper-to-be-executed-tonight/517078.md?page=5)