# Deadwood (new HBO show) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 22, 2004, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686 "2004-03-22T04:51:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![YPOD](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/e99b99/32.png) [@YPOD](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YPOD)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2004, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686/41 "2004-03-25T23:15:33Z")
i thought the cursing sounded way too modern - not that they cursed, or even used the same terms, but just cursed as much. My grandparents, who were born in the 1880s, grew up in Hell’s Kitchen, had no education and cursed like sailors - but nothing like the characters in Deadwood. A bit too much. I liked the characters, but my favorite is one that you only see briefly - the babe getting into the tub in the opening montage. Who is she? ---
**Author:** ![Kizarvexius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/da6949/32.png) [@Kizarvexius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kizarvexius)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686/42 "2004-03-26T19:21:55Z")
I also found the swearing to be distracting. Foul language usually has little effect on me – I grew up on army bases, for chistsakes. But in this case it turned me off. It seemed to me that the scriptwriter threw in wall-to-wall swearing not because it was needed, but because he COULD. This is HBO, after all. As to whether authentic swearing would have had a lesser impact on the audience, that might be true in the beginning. But once the viewers have had an opportunity to become familiar with the vocabulary and to know just how shocking or insulting a particular word or phrase was within the context of the setting, a judiciously chosen and well delivered epithet can pack quite a punch. For example, Colleen McCullough’s mammoth \*Masters of Rome \* series introduces readers to a handful of Latin swear words which salt and pepper the dialog from time to time. At one point (don’t ask me precisely where – we’re talking about six massive volumes) a senator completely loses his temper and launches off on a diatribe heavily spiced with obscenities. Despite the fact that most of them are in Latin, that particular passage was brutally effective. ---
**Author:** ![pepperlandgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f17d59/32.png) [@pepperlandgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pepperlandgirl)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686/43 "2004-03-26T19:38:00Z")
I wasn’t bothered by the profanity at all. Well, ok, for a moment i was like “Would they use that then?” and then I figured we didn’t invent profanity in the past 50 years, so I let it go. But I do agree that they could have used language more accurate at the time and got away with it. When you hear profanity, you know it. How many people had a problem figuring out what all the Chinese meant on Firefly? Either way, I don’t think it’s worth a second thought. If the only thing you have to complain about is the profanity then I guess it’s a fucking goddamned good show you cocksucker. ---
**Author:** ![flickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7bcc69/32.png) [@flickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flickster)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 7:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686/44 "2004-03-29T07:01:04Z")
Enjoyed the 2nd episode tonight. Coarse language didn’t seem to be as much “in your face” as it was in the 1st episode. The story is growing on me (helped being able to access additional character background information from the [HBO.com](http://HBO.com) site). There was some rather bold male nudity in tonight’s episode that created small stir with the Mrs. ---
**Author:** ![Darkhold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/90db22/32.png) [@Darkhold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darkhold)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 7:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686/45 "2004-03-29T07:51:50Z")
So far so good. I’m not hooked yet but I still want to check it out a few more times. Way better then their last effort. ---
**Author:** ![Shirley\_Ujest](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/45deac/32.png) [@Shirley\_Ujest](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shirley_Ujest)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686/46 "2004-03-29T13:42:51Z")
Another good episode last night. Jane seems to be slightly retarded in her speech. The guy who was going to get revenge on his dead brother, the walking-in-the-bar-owners-office-while-naked-and-holding-his-johnson-was-rather-funny-yet-painful-at-the-same-time. The bar owner is by far the most interesting character. Greedy sonofabitch. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686/47 "2004-03-29T14:02:12Z")
I was surprised at how Jane fell apart when the bar owner (I forget his name…the bad guy) walked into the Doc’s office to look at the little girl. From what Jane said to the Doc about having been “fucked” by other men, I have to wonder if there’s an implication of sexual abuse in her past (which would would only make sense in explaining her personality). ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686/48 "2004-03-29T14:45:47Z")
> [@ISiddiqui](#): > > I gotta agree. I’m glad they didn’t try to glam up Calamity Jane in any way, shape, or form. The ex-marshall definetly looks like a fun character, but Wild Bill definetly stole the show in every scene. We saw it for the first time last night, and we’re hooked. I loved Calamity Jane. She didn’t scare me in the least. I thought she was a very sympathetic character. The bad guy is one of the most evil bad guys I’ve ever seen… ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686/49 "2004-03-29T14:47:17Z")
But Jane does cuss like a longshoreman. Heh. It’s part of her fucking charm!! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Lissa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/85f322/32.png) [@Lissa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lissa)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686/50 "2004-03-29T16:25:09Z")
> [@SillyGirl](#): > > More than that though… I was confused by the prices of things, as well as the money talk. Did people really have $20,000 back then? That seems like an obscene amount of money for the gold rush… conversations seemed too concentrate on very large amounts of money (always were talking in thousands) and boots were $15!!! > > Was this normal then? Were prices inflated this much for the gold rush? > > I am not a historian… but wasn’t $15 generally more than enough to live on for a week in that time period? Prices were grossly over-inflated in gold rush camps. Transporting goods that far through areas of dubious safety was expensive, and greed played a part in the price as well. Pretty much, you had a captive market. > [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > was surprised at how Jane fell apart when the bar owner (I forget his name…the bad guy) walked into the Doc’s office to look at the little girl. From what Jane said to the Doc about having been “fucked” by other men, I have to wonder if there’s an implication of sexual abuse in her past (which would would only make sense in explaining her personality). I was very dissapointed with this scene. It seemed to me that the producers might have been concerned that Jane wasn’t a sympathetic-enough character, and so needed to show a soft, “girly” side to the audience. Jane may have been scared, but I can’t imagine her bursting into tears in public like that. Hell, I’m sure she probably cried when she was alone-- she was human, after all, but I can’t imagine her pride would have allowed such a breakdown in front of God and everybody. IIRC, Jane was a prositute at a very young age. It’s in character for her to be so concerned about a pretty little girl in such a rough place. Without protection, the child would wind up as a prositute very quickly. ---
**Author:** ![AuntiePam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@AuntiePam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AuntiePam)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686/51 "2004-03-29T22:46:31Z")
Al Swearengen, the bar owner, is my favorite character. He’d make a great CEO today, wouldn’t he? Always looking out for the bottom line. He doesn’t do anything out of cruelty, it’s all just business. Seth Bullock is growing on me too, but **man** , he sure has a hard on for Al, doesn’t he? He doesn’t know what **we** know about Al, so what’s his problem? It’s almost like Seth can’t deal with anyone getting in his way – and from what we saw in the first episode (that quick “legal” hanging), he has interesting methods for dealing with roadblocks. ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2004, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686/52 "2004-03-30T04:06:37Z")
> [@Lissa](#): > > I was very dissapointed with this scene. It seemed to me that the producers might have been concerned that Jane wasn’t a sympathetic-enough character, and so needed to show a soft, “girly” side to the audience. Jane in that scene (and subsequent ones) didn’t strike me as “girly” so much as “mental trainwreck.” She seems to have some kind of speech affect, she moves oddly, she can’t see well, she’s emotionally labile, and she doesn’t seem to relate well to other adults. There’s gotta be something going on there–some kind of alcohol related dementia, perhaps? Or late stage syphillis? I think she’s one of the more interesting characters, and seems relatively original. But then, I’m too young to remember “Calamity Jane” and “Wild Bill” as childhood figures, so maybe I have a less solid picture of their mythologies. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![flickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7bcc69/32.png) [@flickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flickster)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2004, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686/53 "2004-03-30T05:38:34Z")
One of the many things that I like about the series so far is that even though we have a story with recognizable figures, Wild Bill & Calamity Jane, they are not the primary focus. Sure they weave in and out of each episode (at least so far), but the story seems to focus more on the “everyday” characters. I get a grin every time Jeffrey Jones enters a scene because of where my internal movie database places him - _Howard the Duck_. I don’t know why, I’m sure he has played many other roles but for some reason that’s where my memory places him (not that I’m proud of remembering _Howard the Duck_) ---
**Author:** ![RogueRacer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/7ab992/32.png) [@RogueRacer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RogueRacer)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2004, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686/54 "2004-03-30T16:12:54Z")
I’m really liking this series so far. I like the way they are using a few historical characters and a real place to anchor a good fictional story. Ian McShane is outstanding. His character is such an evil bastard, but Swearengen is done so well that it’s almost hard to hate him… almost. Considering that things continue to work out well for him, he sure always seems to be having a bad day. Al seems to have a serious dislike for Wild Bill. I’m thinking that Doc has some serious flaw that they have hidden in the first few episodes. Maybe it’s just alcoholism, but that seems pretty common in the show. I kind of like how he stands up to Al to a point, even if it’s mostly just a token resistance. It looked like Seth started the problems with Al. I’m not sure why. Maybe he had seen Al’s type too many times before? Al seems to have Seth pegged as someone who is dangerous. It doesn’t look like too many people get that consideration from Al. Anyway, I’m looking forward to next Sunday. ---
**Author:** ![LateComer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b5ac83/32.png) [@LateComer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LateComer)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2004, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686/55 "2004-03-30T16:52:52Z")
> [@flickster](#): > > I get a grin every time Jeffrey Jones enters a scene because of where my internal movie database places him - _Howard the Duck_. I don’t know why, I’m sure he has played many other roles but for some reason that’s where my memory places him (not that I’m proud of remembering _Howard the Duck_) Odd. My brain IMD places him in Ferris Bueller’s Day off, William Sanderson is of course placed on Newhart. And Brad Dourif is placed solidly in Dune as Piter DiVries. ---
**Author:** ![mbacko1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/71e660/32.png) [@mbacko1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mbacko1)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2004, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686/56 "2004-03-30T17:58:34Z")
> [@LateComer](#): > > Odd. My brain IMD places him in Ferris Bueller’s Day off, > William Sanderson is of course placed on Newhart. > And Brad Dourif is placed solidly in Dune as Piter DiVries. I place Jeffrey Jones in Ferris Bueller’s Day Off William Sanderson from Bladerunner as the toymaker/engineer Brad Dourif from Lord of the Rings as Wormtongue. I love this show so far. The swearing is a bit over the top, but I love the characters and the realism of the muddy, dirty camp. I have to agree that the sets on HBO shows are the most realistic on TV. Mike ---
**Author:** ![Mauvaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mauvaise/32/11084_2.png) [@Mauvaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mauvaise)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2004, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686/57 "2004-03-30T20:46:33Z")
> [@LateComer](#): > > William Sanderson is of course placed on Newhart. In mine too. In fact, when I was watching the first episode, I knew I recognised him, but couldn’t place him. Then I realised who he was and said to myself, “Hi, I’m Larry. This is my brother Darryl and this is my other brother Darryl.” I am liking the show so far - though Al Swearengen is just sooo evil! Ian McShane (IMD - Sexy Beast) is brilliant. I’m not offended by the swearing, hell, I have a mouth on my that would rival their’s, however, I never use the word “cocksucker” twice in one sentence. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![BobT](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e8cbc/32.png) [@BobT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobT)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2004, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686/58 "2004-03-30T22:36:31Z")
According to historical sources on Calamity Jane, she would have been only 24 in 1876. She did have a problem with alcohol her entire life and that’s what contributed to her demise in her early 50s. Al Swearengen is a real character as are Seth Bullock and Sol Starr and probably several more. If you google them, you can find out who is going to come to a good end and who isn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2004, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686/59 "2004-03-31T01:00:19Z")
Does it count as a spoiler if you cite some historical nuggets? I’ll box them just in case. [spoiler]Seth Bullock became the first sheriff of Deadwood after the murder of Bill Hickock. Hickock was assasinated by a man named Jack McCall (which happens to be the name of the slow-witted, weasely little character who made the crack about “out drawing” Hickock at cards in the first episode. After McCall shot Hickock he was chased down and apprehended by Calamity Jane. She cornered him in a butcher shop with a meat cleaver. Jane came to be very highly regarded in Deadwood (the word “saint” was used) after she nursed the sick during a smallpox epidemic. In another incident she happened upon a stagecoach surrounded by Indians outside of Deadwood. The driver had been killed and none of the six remaining passengers (all men…the limber dicked cocksuckers) had the courage to take the reins. Jane jumped into the wagon without hesitation and drove it and its passengers out of danger. In 1885 (roughly nine years after the setting of the tV show) Jane got married in Texas and had one daughter. In 1895, Jane returned to Deadwood and was received as a hero. She died a few years later and was buried next to Bill Hickock in Deadwood. Seth Bullock was very successful as Deadwood’s first Sheriff and he cleaned up the town with relatively little violence or drama (hopefully the’ll cook some up for the show). Bullock later served in the Spanish American War and became good friends with Teddy Roosevelt who made Bullock a US Marshall. Information on Al Swearengen is sketchy but he was a real guy and, believe it or not, the real guys was probably even worse that the HBO show portrays him. He was especially brutal to prostitutes and was notorious for forcing them into the most degrading and depraved acts in the west. Swearengen made a lot of money but after a major fire destryed the town he lost everything and died penniless.[/spoiler] ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2004, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686/60 "2004-04-01T06:34:52Z")
Loved the 2nd episode as well. I really enjoyed Doc flexing some muscles and he seems to be another interesting character in the show. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deadwood-new-hbo-show/235686.md?page=4)