# Dealing with checkout harassment **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [November 30, 2006, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285 "2006-11-30T03:47:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2006, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285/1 "2006-11-30T03:47:24Z")
[From _Black & White_ city paper](http://www.bwcitypaper.com/bw.digg.page.final.html): > [@](#): > > Here’s a scenario that is familiar to anyone who has ever set foot in Wal-Mart, CVS, Rite-Aid, or any of a dozen other major retailers. After you have made a purchase, collected your bags, or packed everything into a shopping cart, you head for the exit. Just as you approach freedom an alarm sounds (usually a sequence of ugly, electronic grunts) and a robotic voice (always female) announces: “Please return to the checkout.” Other customers immediately look in your direction, and an employee begins to approach you. What’s your next move? > > If you possess an ounce of personal pride or perhaps two ounces of fortitude, then the 100 percent correct move is to proceed immediately out the door. Why? There are many reasons, chief among them being that rational adults should not instantly obey mechanical voices (unless that voice instructs us to exit a burning aircraft). Also, if you haven’t stolen anything and therefore do not require interrogation, there is absolutely nothing that should compel you to linger post-transaction. It’s depressing enough simply being there in the first place. Another good reason to make a quick exit is that you aren’t being paid to assist some giant retailer with its security measures. You aren’t part of the team, and you didn’t clock in. The clearest reason for leaving the store, however, is that there exists absolutely no legal obligation to remain there, and the store has no right to detain you. Read that last line. Again. Again. Wax on, wax off. Do you understand, grasshopper? _ **They cannot hold you once you have paid.** _ Read the rest of the article. It is amusing like a good Pit thread, only longer and with less swearing. But that bolded, italicized line of mine is the only relevant point. ---
**Author:** ![Santo\_Rugger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Santo\_Rugger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Santo_Rugger)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2006, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285/2 "2006-11-30T04:03:06Z")
Does this guy have a regular collumn in this paper, or is he some kind of “freelance” dude? I read the whole thing, it’s pretty good. Funny, and very easy to relate with. ---
**Author:** ![Random](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/57b2e6/32.png) [@Random](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Random)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2006, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285/3 "2006-11-30T04:37:15Z")
[QUOTE=Derleth] [From _Black & White_ city paper](http://www.bwcitypaper.com/bw.digg.page.final.html):Read that last line. Again. Again. Wax on, wax off. Do you understand, grasshopper? _ **They cannot hold you once you have paid.** _ Read the rest of the article. It is amusing like a good Pit thread, only longer and with less swearing. But that bolded, italicized line of mine is the only relevant point. [/QUOTE] That’s nice. Wrong, but nice. How many times have we done this thread in the last year? ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2006, 4:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285/4 "2006-11-30T04:40:51Z")
[QUOTE=Random] That’s nice. Wrong, but nice. [/QUOTE] Chapter and verse from relevant law, please. ---
**Author:** ![Random](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/57b2e6/32.png) [@Random](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Random)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2006, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285/5 "2006-11-30T04:52:36Z")
[QUOTE=Derleth] Chapter and verse from relevant law, please. [/QUOTE] No. But only because we’ve done this at least 4 times before. It gets tedious. Read this thread, and the earlier threads that I cite in that thread. [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=381724&highlight=detain](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=381724&highlight=detain) You’ll find cites to applicable law from several states in my posts and those of others. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2006, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285/6 "2006-11-30T05:32:05Z")
Wow. Just… wow. How deeply some of us cling to what we apparently wish to believe. ---
**Author:** ![Random](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/57b2e6/32.png) [@Random](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Random)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2006, 5:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285/7 "2006-11-30T05:50:43Z")
[QUOTE=Bricker] Wow. Just… wow. How deeply some of us cling to what we apparently wish to believe. [/QUOTE] It’s _Night Of The Living Detention Thread IV_! But there’s still hope. Even the gry thread posters gave up eventually. ---
**Author:** ![A.R.Cane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ee7513/32.png) [@A.R.Cane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A.R.Cane)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2006, 7:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285/8 "2006-11-30T07:28:11Z")
I don’t know what the local law is, but if I found myself in such a situation I think I would submit to a check of my receipt against my mechandise. I would expect to be treated courteously and to receive an apology after things checked out. If it went beyond that I would seriously consider contacting an attorney to explore the possibility of a law suit. I do find **Randoms** repeated beratings to be condecending and tiresome. **Random** if you can take the time to look up the previous threads, why can’t you just post the legal references? It is unreasonable to expect that the average member reads all the threads, or even most of them. I, or anyone else, might easily overlook a particular topic and later bring up the same subject. I don’t see why it’s a problem and I have to wonder why anyone would get so upset about it. I suggest that **Random** either post something informative and helpful, or chill out. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2006, 7:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285/9 "2006-11-30T07:41:41Z")
Well, the article cited by the OP was from a Birmingham, AL paper. Here is the relevant [section](http://www.legislature.state.al.us/CodeofAlabama/1975/15-10-14.htm) of the Alabam Code: > [@](#): > > \*\*Section 15-10-14 > > Detention and arrest of person suspected of larceny of goods held for sale.\*\* > > (a) A peace officer, a merchant or a merchant’s employee who has probable cause for believing that goods held for sale by the merchant have been unlawfully taken by a person and that he can recover them by taking the person into custody may, for the purpose of attempting to effect such recovery, take the person into custody and detain him in a reasonable manner for a reasonable length of time. Such taking into custody and detention by a peace officer, merchant or merchant’s employee shall not render such police officer, merchant or merchant’s employee criminally or civilly liable for false arrest, false imprisonment or unlawful detention. > > (b) Any peace officer may arrest without warrant any person he has probable cause for believing has committed larceny in retail or wholesale establishments. > > (c) A merchant or a merchant’s employee who causes such arrest as provided for in subsection (a) of this section of a person for larceny of goods held for sale shall not be criminally or civilly liable for false arrest or false imprisonment where the merchant or merchant’s employee has probable cause for believing that the person arrested committed larceny of goods held for sale. > > **(Acts 1957, No. 184, p. 237, §§1-3.)** It’s clear that, in Alabama, the merchant does have the right to detain someone if there is probable cause to suspect a theft has occurred. The question, then, is whether an alarm sounding is, in Alabama, sufficient to establish probable cause. I couldn’t find anything about this in the Code (i’m not sure whether that’s even the right place to look), but i’m willing to bet that the alarm does establish PC. Despite the fact that the legal issues seem fairly cut and dried here, i still feel, viscerally, that they give far too much leeway to the merchant in terms of detaining people, especially when the alarms in these stores so often seem to sound without cause. For example, i walked out of a bookstore once and the alarm sounded. All i had in my bag were two library books that i had taken out of my university library. The clerk, upon seeing them, gave a smile and said, “Sorry, library books set it off ALL THE TIME.” Now, why the fuck is it my problem, and why should i be treated like a thief, just because they can’t program their anti-theft device to recognize only their own merchandise? Pisses me off. ---
**Author:** ![An\_Arky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/87869e/32.png) [@An\_Arky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Arky)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2006, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285/10 "2006-11-30T14:26:20Z")
Is this truly an issue? I’ve set off the alarms before, and more often than not, nobody does anything and I just keep going. Sometimes I’ll look back at the cashier and they’ll wave me on. Rarely does anyone actually stop me and check my receipt, etc., except for places like Best Buy, where they do it to everybody, anyway. I’m not a terribly patient person, but this just fails to bother me. I’ve never, not once, anywhere, been “treated like a thief” or even looked at the wrong way in the situation. Maybe it’s because I’m a middle-aged white guy, but profiling wasn’t the issue raised here. ---
**Author:** ![corkboard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@corkboard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/corkboard)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2006, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285/11 "2006-11-30T14:53:24Z")
There was one shopping situation where I wish I had been detained. At lunch one day I headed over to the mall to buy a pair of jeans. I didn’t have much time, so I found the ones I wanted, tried them on, went to checkout, paid, they put them in a bag, and I left the store. In retrospect I guess I remember hearing the klaxon sirens sounding as I walked through the doors, but in Macy’s you hear them frequently, so I didn’t think anything of it. A few days later I grab my new jeans and put them on- and notice that they still had the plastic “theft deterrent” tag stapled to the waistband. You know, the thing that sprays dye all over you and the clothing if you try to remove it, or whatever it does. So I have to go back to the store to get it removed. I definitely noticed the sirens as I entered the store, then had to wait in line at checkout for 15 minutes before I got to the counter. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2006, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285/12 "2006-11-30T18:06:06Z")
[QUOTE=mhendo] The question, then, is whether an alarm sounding is, in Alabama, sufficient to establish probable cause. [/QUOTE] Yeah, that’s a good question. If the person at the exit sees you heading from the checkout counter to the door, do they really need to enforce the alarm. ---
**Author:** ![betenoir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/258eb7/32.png) [@betenoir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/betenoir)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2006, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285/13 "2006-11-30T18:48:39Z")
I don’t think it’s a good idea. And not whether or not it’s the law. First of all if you’re concerned about people staring at you like you’re guilty, walking out will make you look more guilty. Secondly when I did it, I never harrassed anyone. I just apoligized for not demagnatizing something, offer to take it back, check the bag and demagntize it. Thirdly, if you don’t go back you’ll probably set off the alarms at the next store you go to. And then look guilty all over again. And who wants that? ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2006, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285/14 "2006-11-30T19:42:28Z")
[QUOTE=gigi] Yeah, that’s a good question. If the person at the exit sees you heading from the checkout counter to the door, do they really need to enforce the alarm. [/QUOTE] Not that anyone that I’ve ever encountered checks, but why not? Just because you purchased X number of items does not mean you haven’t picked up X+Y items, and have secreted some on your person. ---
**Author:** ![Q.E.D](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/51bf81/32.png) [@Q.E.D](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.E.D)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2006, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285/15 "2006-11-30T19:48:06Z")
Exactly. In point of fact, it’s a common tactic for shoplifters to steal an expensive item, but purchase one or more cheap items to appear less suspicious. ---
**Author:** ![MelCthefirst](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eada6e/32.png) [@MelCthefirst](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MelCthefirst)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2006, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285/16 "2006-11-30T19:50:55Z")
The subject of store theft has been in our media lately probably due to Christmas shopping. Apparently the amount of dollars lost from theft is millions and millions and guess who pay for this - yep, the consumer. So maybe cut the shops some slack for your own benefit? ---
**Author:** ![Q.E.D](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/51bf81/32.png) [@Q.E.D](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.E.D)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2006, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285/17 "2006-11-30T19:57:29Z")
They should start with the beam in their own eye, then. The bulk of theft losses are due to internal theft. We’re also paying for the failure of retail establishments to control their own employees. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2006, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285/18 "2006-11-30T20:10:48Z")
[QUOTE=Q.E.D.] They should start with the beam in their own eye, then. The bulk of theft losses are due to internal theft. We’re also paying for the failure of retail establishments to control their own employees. [/QUOTE] We’re paying because, as a race, we can’t be entrusted not to lie, cheat, and steal from anyone or anything at any opportunity. ---
**Author:** ![OneCentStamp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/13edae/32.png) [@OneCentStamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OneCentStamp)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2006, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285/19 "2006-11-30T20:13:58Z")
[QUOTE=mhendo] It’s clear that, in Alabama, the merchant does have the right to detain someone if there is probable cause to suspect a theft has occurred. The question, then, is whether an alarm sounding is, in Alabama, sufficient to establish probable cause. I couldn’t find anything about this in the Code (i’m not sure whether that’s even the right place to look), but i’m willing to bet that the alarm does establish PC. Despite the fact that the legal issues seem fairly cut and dried here, i still feel, viscerally, that they give far too much leeway to the merchant in terms of detaining people, especially when the alarms in these stores so often seem to sound without cause. [/QUOTE] The legal issues _might_ be cut and dried if not for the twofold problem that in the OP’s story, he (1) was complaining about retailers (e.g. Costco) who check every receipt, alarm or no alarm; and (2) the merchant employees in question were at pains to assure him that nobody suspected him of theft. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2006, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285/20 "2006-11-30T20:27:38Z")
Despite the apparently shaky legal argument, that article amused the hell out of me. I think, however, that there is a distinct difference between Wallmart and Costco. You have to have a membership to shop at Costco and also sign a membership agreement. I didn’t read all of the fine print on mine but I would be willing to bet that there is a stipulation that you have to do the stupid receipt thing before you leave. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dealing-with-checkout-harassment/382285.md?page=2)