# Dear Cynic a'la Diogenes \[why one woman is voting for McCain\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 14, 2008, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845 "2008-09-14T04:39:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![pinkyvee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/6de8d8/32.png) [@pinkyvee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pinkyvee)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845/1 "2008-09-14T04:39:18Z")
> [@Democrats, listen up if you'd like to win the election.](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-listen-up-if-youd-like-to-win-the-election/463026/1): > > _Stop Bitching at the American People_. > > Comments? YES! You are so correct. I am a registered Dem. I voted for Obama - not Hilary - in the primary. And then… after our primary … I watch Hilary get smeared by viceous attack dogs ~~\>\*\* DEMOCRATIC LIBERAL\*\* attack dogs - and even though I did not vote for Hilary in the primary - I was offended. This foul and unfair treatment soured me toward the Obama camp. I became officially an UNdecided American voter. I watched BOTH conventions with great interest keeping an OPEN MIND. UNdecided was I. It seemed to me that Obama was being led by others in the Dem party. He went from his fired up passion filled beginnings to a packaged product. I did not like this product very much. I was not convinced this man could stand up to his own party power brokers - someone had neutered him! He does not seem to be his own man - he’s being managed too carefully. I don’t like being told what to do - I was a vote ripe for the picking. I felt nuthin’ - and considered sitting this one out - till Sarah gave her acceptance speech - then I felt fired up - I felt motivated to open my mind up to consider possibly voting REP this time – McCain is better with her by his side - I found Palin to be interesting and refreshing. Then I read an editorial written by Gloria Steinem about how a vote for Palin is (basically) a vote for anti-feminism - What the hell? The same political machine that rolled over Hilary is doing the same thing again … :smack: When the hell did feminism become synonymous with pro abortion? Gloria was the tipping point - I am convinced to vote Rep this time. I am a Dem voting Rep this time. And I suspect I am not alone. You can Thank Gloria if you care to. Pinky ---
**Author:** ![bdgr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a87d85/32.png) [@bdgr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bdgr)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845/2 "2008-09-14T04:53:19Z")
> [@pinkyvee](#): > > YES! > I am a Dem voting Rep this time. > And I suspect I am not alone. > > You can Thank Gloria if you care to. > > Pinky Well, thats the price. When the Dems play it clean they get slaughtered because the pubbies aren’t going to. and when they fight back, they get a few dems that in some twisted logic think that going pubbie is somehow making a point. damned if you do and damned if you don’t, but I suspect for everyone of you that cant understand that you have to stand up and fight against bullys there are plenty of others who see not standing up as a sign of weakness and/or admission of guilt. so go ahead and vote for pubs, even though they are slinging more mud than the dems…And when we have 8 more years of the same nightmare you can thank yourself. Gloria doesn’t control your vote, you do. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845/3 "2008-09-14T04:56:00Z")
What “vicious, liberal media attack dogs” do you imagine attacked Hillary? Somehow, I’m not buying that you were ever a Dem. ---
**Author:** ![pinkyvee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/6de8d8/32.png) [@pinkyvee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pinkyvee)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845/4 "2008-09-14T04:58:33Z")
> [@bdgr](#): > > I suspect for everyone of you that cant understand that you have to stand up and fight against bullys there are plenty of others who see not standing up as a sign of weakness and/or admission of guilt. Your sentence was constructed in a way that is confusing - do you want to change it around a little so that your meaning/intent is clear? Thanks Pinky ---
**Author:** ![pinkyvee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/6de8d8/32.png) [@pinkyvee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pinkyvee)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845/5 "2008-09-14T05:03:57Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > What " I suspect for everyone of you that cant understand that you have to stand up and fight against bullys there are plenty of others who see not standing up as a sign of weakness and/or admission of guilt." do you imagine attacked Hillary? > > Somehow, I’m not buying that you were ever a Dem. I still am. Have been since I was 19 years old. You didn’t notice the bite marks on Geraldine Ferraro’s backside? Pinky ---
**Author:** ![bdgr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a87d85/32.png) [@bdgr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bdgr)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845/6 "2008-09-14T05:07:20Z")
> [@pinkyvee](#): > > Your sentence was constructed in a way that is confusing - do you want to change it around a little so that your meaning/intent is clear? > > Thanks > > Pinky I think the meaning and intent is clear. If the dems lose you, but gain 100 others because they fight back, then losing you isn’t a big deal. ---
**Author:** ![pinkyvee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/6de8d8/32.png) [@pinkyvee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pinkyvee)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 5:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845/7 "2008-09-14T05:12:20Z")
> [@bdgr](#): > > I think the meaning and intent is clear. If the dems lose you, but gain 100 others because they fight back, then losing you isn’t a big deal. If your meaning had been clear I would not have asked you to clarify. I asked you to clarify because (I thought) you were directing your remark toward me. I appreciate your re write. Thanks Pinky ---
**Author:** ![bdgr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a87d85/32.png) [@bdgr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bdgr)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845/8 "2008-09-14T05:20:38Z")
> [@pinkyvee](#): > > If your meaning had been clear I would not have asked you to clarify. Because it was not clear to you does not mean that it wasn’t clear. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845/9 "2008-09-14T05:20:52Z")
> [@pinkyvee](#): > > I still am. > Have been since I was 19 years old. > > You didn’t notice the bite marks on Geraldine Ferraro’s backside? > > Pinky You mean the self-inflicted marks from when she said Obama was only where he was because he’s black? What was said about Ferraro in the media that was sexist and why do you believe that the remedy is to vote for a misogynist? ---
**Author:** ![pinkyvee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/6de8d8/32.png) [@pinkyvee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pinkyvee)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845/10 "2008-09-14T05:35:03Z")
> [@bdgr](#): > > Because it was not clear to you does not mean that it wasn’t clear. but bdgr - if you were writing something _to me_ in order to have a discussion\* with me \* - shouldn’t I ask for clarification if it’s not clear to me? I don’t know how to communicate with you unless I try to understand what you mean - it I ask for clarification it’s so we can continue to discuss a topic- I thought that’s what you wanted. Is it? thanks again Pinky ---
**Author:** ![bdgr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a87d85/32.png) [@bdgr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bdgr)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 5:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845/11 "2008-09-14T05:57:21Z")
> [@pinkyvee](#): > > but bdgr - if you were writing something _to me_ in order to have a discussion\* with me \* - shouldn’t I ask for clarification if it’s not clear to me? > > I don’t know how to communicate with you unless I try to understand what you mean - it I ask for clarification it’s so we can continue to discuss a topic- I thought that’s what you wanted. Is it? > thanks again > > Pinky absolutely ---
**Author:** ![pinkyvee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/6de8d8/32.png) [@pinkyvee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pinkyvee)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 6:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845/12 "2008-09-14T06:11:31Z")
> [@bdgr](#): > > absolutely 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![pinkyvee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/6de8d8/32.png) [@pinkyvee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pinkyvee)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 6:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845/13 "2008-09-14T06:17:59Z")
> [@](#): > > Stop whining and bitching about the past. Stop making the poor and downtrodden the only thing you’ll talk about. Stop promising to fix people’s miserable lives, and start telling them how great things are going to be in the future. This is the intended message of the OP - it’s a very good message and deserves discussion not derision. thanks! Pinky ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845/14 "2008-09-14T06:22:13Z")
> [@pinkyvee](#): > > This is the intended message of the OP - it’s a very good message and deserves discussion not derision. > > thanks! > > Pinky Too bad it has no relationship to the reality of Obama’s campaign. It’s a right wing caricature of progressive politics. ---
**Author:** ![pinkyvee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/6de8d8/32.png) [@pinkyvee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pinkyvee)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 6:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845/15 "2008-09-14T06:25:47Z")
discussion not derision ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 6:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845/16 "2008-09-14T06:47:52Z")
Who are you talking to? You still haven’t answered my question as to why you believe that voting for a misogynist will remedy whatever sexist sentiment you imagine you see in the media. ---
**Author:** ![pinkyvee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/6de8d8/32.png) [@pinkyvee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pinkyvee)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 7:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845/17 "2008-09-14T07:14:21Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Who are you talking to? > > You still haven’t answered my question as to why you believe that voting for a misogynist will remedy whatever sexist sentiment you imagine you see in the media. I made a decision not to respond to any person who asks me to explain something I did not say and defend a position I do not hold. I do not partake in straw man arguments. There is no correct answer to your question as stated: “why you believe that voting for a misogynist”. I do recognize that this thread topic is not about me and any beliefs you falsely accuse me of holding - but about how the Dem party can present their ideas and get elected .. What are your thoughts about that? Thanks Pinky ---
**Author:** ![pinkyvee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/6de8d8/32.png) [@pinkyvee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pinkyvee)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 7:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845/18 "2008-09-14T07:20:25Z")
> [@Democrats, listen up if you'd like to win the election.](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-listen-up-if-youd-like-to-win-the-election/463026/101): > > can you present your question using complete sentences? which question is that? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 7:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845/19 "2008-09-14T07:27:27Z")
If you don’t want to clarify and answer questions about your views then why did you post them. You said you’re voting for McCain because you think that liberals in the media launched sexist attacks against Hillary and Ferarro. I asked you what attacks in particular, you haven’t answered. I asked you why voting for John McCain (a misogynist) will remedy sexism in the media. You refuse to answer. You are the one who brought that subject up. It seems to me that you’re just being evasive and passive-aggressive (for instance with your disingenuous insistence that we “discuss, not deride” a premise which itself was derisive and false) because you don’t really have answers to my questions. You say you’re a Democrat (I’m not, by the way). Can you list three examples of Democratic party principles you believe in? ---
**Author:** ![pinkyvee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/6de8d8/32.png) [@pinkyvee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pinkyvee)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2008, 7:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845/20 "2008-09-14T07:48:26Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > If you don’t want to clarify and answer questions about your views then why did you post them. My views cannot be that important to you - I am not that self absorbed that I imagine you actually give a rat’s pattootie what I think. The reason I used my own experience and my decision making process was to illustrate the OP’s point - “Listen up if you’d like to win the election”. Aren’t you at all interested in how the Dems can win back disenfranchised female voters? In order to woo back voters perhaps the Dems would like to learn how/why they lost female supporters. I just won’t argue with you - I prefer to listen to anything useful you offer in the way of persuasive discussion and take away any pearls you might drop my way. I am also not here to change anyone’s mind. I will respect your position (once I understand it) but I just don’t respond to straw man tactics. I’m pretty tired and must go to sleep now. I hope your evening (morning?) is pleasant. Thanks Pinky [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-cynic-ala-diogenes-why-one-woman-is-voting-for-mccain/463845.md?page=2)