# Dear Miss Ogynist...Miss Andryst...Miss Anthrope...Miss thang... ahem. Dear catsix, **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 10, 2006, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112 "2006-08-10T03:42:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/281 "2006-08-12T16:25:11Z")
> [@](#): > > **Guinastasia** said: > At this point, I doubt she even knows what “nice” is, being as how she never seems to act that way. > > eleanorigby, sadly, she’s from Pittsburgh, like myself. I assure you though, if you ever come here, I will open doors for you. I seem to recall going out of my way to do a nice thing for **you** the only time I ever met you. Think hard. You’ll remember it. ---
**Author:** ![Beaucarnea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/c0e974/32.png) [@Beaucarnea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beaucarnea)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/282 "2006-08-12T16:25:53Z")
[QUOTE=Zoe] **Beaucarnea** , I get the impression that you may misunderstand what a _feminist_ is. It’s a person, female or male, who believes in equal social, political and economic rights for females (and by implication, for both sexes). Interesting contribution to the SDMB. Welcome! [/QUOTE] Hello, **Zoe** , thank you for the welcome. Yes, I understand and sympathize with feminism; I was just being facetious by painting **catsi** x’s conflicting socio-political views with a broad brush. In some threads **catsix** comes across as a woman-hater, but in this discussion she seems to read the worst in men. I just used those words (feminist, misogynist, misandryst) to emphasize what looked (to me) like contrary views. Just being a smart aleck. I have been working the past couple of days and have only been able to jump in from time to time- just read the thread in entirity. Forgive the long post: The “young lady” tangent has been a bit of a surprise- I was using the phrase as a descriptor- as in: “The young lady on the bus or the young gentleman on the bus…”. I do not address anyone in this manner: “Young Lady, you are in serious trouble…” I completely understand how the phrase “Young Lady” used as a moniker could be irritating and condescending. I have to concede with everyone who feels that “ladies first” habits originated from an antiquated practice of protecting the frail female members of society. Has anyone remembered that 50+ years ago many women perpetuated this idea with bustles, corsets, parasols, finishing schools, fainting at rude behavior, etc? “Ladies first” may have had a legitimate headstart encouraged by both sexes. But men and women (and society in general) have evolved significantly within the past 40 years. Thankfully, times have changed. That bears repeating: Thankfully, times have changed. And unless there is a 155 year old man somewhere in Savannah who is still removing his hat, bowing, and unloading frail, fussy women from buggies we are mostly done with the old fashioned coddling of women. And while I am here, I have some serious sucking up to do. The correct thing would be to include quotes to back up my comments, but this thread is loooong- so I will just knock out a few things right quick. **Maureen** , I think I have one of those non-sexual crushes described in another thread. You are reasonable, smart, and just a little tough. Awesome. **CanvasShoes** : respect. You have a knack for keeping a discussion on track. Very cool head. **PunditLisa** : Makes points that cannot be disputed. **Guinastasia** : Funny and smart-alecky without being nasty. Noted. 🙂 **Triskadecamus** : Thank you for stepping in to the mess I made and summarizing neatly what I should have opened the thread with. This thread would have been a lot less hateful if I had your communication skills. **Scumpup** : Yes, I was being nasty and making broad assumptions to pad my argument. You called it right. **amijane** : I am glad you stepped into this discussion. You make a very good point. You are correct in your statement that visibly pregnant women often get special treatment. So do a lot of people with visibly obvious disabilites; and people who have a lot of packages; and people who look exhausted. And people who appear fit and healthy who get no special consideration. This discrimination isn’t fair. But we don’t have any choice but to _visually_ assess who might need help- unless someone asks. If you look physically able to run a marathon I won’t stand up on the train. But if you say to me “My ankles are killing me” I promise to give you my seat. Guaranteed. And I agree completely that you have the right to decline niceties just as I have the right to attempt them. I don’t find a polite decline rude at all. I don’t even blink if someone declines my offer of seat or open door. That is the beauty of good manners. That whole irony thing that I stated earlier is now bordering on paradox at this point. I pitted **catsix** because I was tweaked at her venomous response to what I feel is a simple kindness. And I stand by my point that kindness from strangers does not need to be discouraged or misconstrued. **catsix** , you have the same right to misintrepret my motivations as I do to offer you a seat. And whether or not you choose to give up your seat in favor of someone who appears to need it more than you is your right. But don’t spank the rest of us for making that decision. And I can still assure you that if I offer you a seat or open your door that I will respect you if you take the seat, or don’t take the seat. I just want to be nice. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/283 "2006-08-12T16:35:05Z")
[QUOTE=catsix] I seem to recall going out of my way to do a nice thing for **you** the only time I ever met you. Think hard. You’ll remember it. [/QUOTE] Yes, you drove me home. Big whoop. Since then, you’ve gone out of your way to insult me by attacking my personal issues every chance you get. Forgive me I don’t fall all over myself to worship at your feet, oh wise one. ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/284 "2006-08-12T16:39:05Z")
> [@](#): > > **Guinastasia** said: > Yes, you drove me home. Big whoop. Since then, you’ve gone out of your way to insult me by attacking my personal issues every chance you get. Forgive me I don’t fall all over myself to worship at your feet, oh wise one. You’ve earned everything I’ve said about you here on these forums by your behavior here on these forums. What I will not allow you to do is sit here and lie about how I would never, ever do anything nice for anyone when you know damned well that’s not true. I’ve had about enough of your dishonesty. ---
**Author:** ![XJETGIRLX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/9fc29f/32.png) [@XJETGIRLX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XJETGIRLX)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/285 "2006-08-12T16:50:34Z")
I just experienced something at the grocery store I wanted to share here. I was in the express line behind a woman who must have been in her early 70’s. She was looking at a flier for the coinstar machine and asking the clerk about it. She dropped the flier and it landed on the ground behind her. I leaned down to pick it up for her when she snapped, “Oh leave it be. I can get it. It will do me good!” She had a look on her face that said “Suck it!” I smiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiled. 😃 God bless her. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/286 "2006-08-12T16:58:50Z")
[QUOTE=Guinastasia] Yes, you drove me home. Big whoop. Since then, you’ve gone out of your way to insult me by attacking my personal issues every chance you get. Forgive me I don’t fall all over myself to worship at your feet, oh wise one. [/QUOTE] Frankly, I don’t believe she drove you home. That would have required that you leave your parents’ basement. **Catsix** is obviously a lying sack of shit. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/287 "2006-08-12T17:00:35Z")
[QUOTE=Beaucarnea] **Scumpup** : Yes, I was being nasty… [/QUOTE] I’ll respond further to you when you come out of the sock drawer. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/288 "2006-08-12T17:00:45Z")
[QUOTE=catsix] You’ve earned everything I’ve said about you here on these forums by your behavior here on these forums. [/QUOTE] Likewise. And just because a person does something nice, doesn’t mean that person is necessarily a good person all the time. _shrugs_ ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/289 "2006-08-12T17:01:51Z")
[QUOTE=Scumpup] Frankly, I don’t believe she drove you home. That would have required that you leave your parents’ basement. **Catsix** is obviously a lying sack of shit. [/QUOTE] Oh, every once in a while, I do polish off my hump and venture out into the light. And I live in my parents’ ATTIC. Get it right, would ya? ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/290 "2006-08-12T17:04:39Z")
Guinastasia said: > [@](#): > > At this point, I doubt she even knows what “nice” is, being as how she never seems to act that way. > [@](#): > > And just because a person does something nice, doesn’t mean that person is necessarily a good person all the time That seems a funny way to admit you were wrong. ::shrug:: ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/291 "2006-08-12T17:19:03Z")
I was speaking of “on this board”-since I don’t usually drag in outside shit. I met her once, briefly. Talked to her for about an hour. Yet every time I’ve encountered her here, she’s been nothing but nasty. It’s my belief that people’s true colors come out online, not always, but usually, since they don’t have to face the person in real life if they were nasty. Everyone used to say how nice and polite **Jersey Diamond** and **Joe Cool** were in real life. But look at how hateful they were on the boards. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/292 "2006-08-12T17:23:28Z")
You were responding to Kalhoun talking about be polite in public. Don’t bother with weakass tapdancing bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/293 "2006-08-12T17:25:37Z")
All right, fair enough, I was wrong. I still doubt though that she’s sweetness itself when not flipping out at people online. ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/294 "2006-08-12T17:30:19Z")
**Guinastasia** : Have you ever done anything nice for **catsix**? So let me get this straight, **Guin** : You have no job. You have no skills. You have no RL friends. You pay no taxes. You’re incapable of taking care of yourself. You leech off your parents (a.k.a. The Enablers). You spend all day on the computer. You rarely venture outdoors. You’re scared of your own shadow. You suffer from an “anxiety disorder” (a.k.a. a convenient excuse for not taking responsibility for your life). You appear to have no purpose in life. Does anyone depend on your existence? You exist for… what reason? ---
**Author:** ![Triskadecamus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b19c9b/32.png) [@Triskadecamus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Triskadecamus)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/295 "2006-08-12T17:31:37Z")
So, it seems the discussion has moved on from “courtesey” to other matters of interaction. Tris ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/296 "2006-08-12T17:45:11Z")
[QUOTE=Crafter\_Man] **Guinastasia** : Have you ever done anything nice for **catsix**? So let me get this straight, **Guin** : You have no job. You have no skills. You have no RL friends. You pay no taxes. You’re incapable of taking care of yourself. You leech off your parents (a.k.a. The Enablers). You spend all day on the computer. You rarely venture outdoors. You’re scared of your own shadow. You suffer from an “anxiety disorder” (a.k.a. a convenient excuse for not taking responsibility for your life). You appear to have no purpose in life. Does anyone depend on your existence? You exist for… what reason? [/QUOTE] Oh, you say that like it’s a _bad_ thing! 😃 Seriously, **Crafter Man** , I could waste five minutes trying to convince you otherwise, or I could shrug my shoulders, realize it’s useless teaching a pig to sing, and just let you believe what you want. No skin off my ass. You have a real nice day, now! ---
**Author:** ![CanvasShoes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/74df32/32.png) [@CanvasShoes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CanvasShoes)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/297 "2006-08-12T17:50:18Z")
> [@](#): > > Shoes: And she knows that they are doing it for that reason because? [QUOTE=catsix] Because they said so. See this is a web forum. On it, people express opinions and then other people express different opinions. **Cemetery Savior** and a couple of others have expressed the opinion that they offer seats on trains and buses to any woman, even if she’s totally physically fit, but they don’t do the same for able bodied men. Silly me, I took them at their word and then argued against their practice of doing that. [/qquote] Except that I wasn’t replying to what you had to say about other posters’ opinions, I was replying to **crafterman’s** post, which had this to say: > [@](#): > > Catsix never said she was offended by someone offering her a seat. She said it perturbed her when someone did it based solely on gender. You need to learn to follow the thread. As I said before, which you ignored, I don’t have a problem with your having an opinion on this subject. At, all. Some of what you said, I agreed with. Mine, and many other posters’ beef (as is evidenced by the quantities of posts in this thread alone expressing this) is with your extreme hatefulness and bitchiness about it. But even moreso with your almost constant assumptions that others’ actions have some evil motive in mind (oh, he opened the door for me, I won’t say anything, but he and I REALLY know that he’s just saying I’m a useless, weak, incompetent “little woman” :rolleyes: ), generally one which places you as victim. But let me say it more clearly, without all those pesky posts that came before in the way. Maybe you’ll actually answer this time. When you are out in real life, and a strange man dares to open the door for you, how do you know what his motivations are? And more, how do you know that they are of the “I’m doing this because I know you’re a weak helpless woman” variety? ---
**Author:** ![CanvasShoes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/74df32/32.png) [@CanvasShoes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CanvasShoes)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/298 "2006-08-12T17:58:36Z")
> [@](#): > > I have yet to see someone give a reason for it other than 1) antiquated ‘fairer sex’ foolishness or 2) a conversation starter in order to hit on the female in question. Then you haven’t been reading the thread. > [@](#): > > You wanna provide other reasons? Several other posters already have. Again, you do not know that the man who is opening the door for you, doesn’t also operate under the “whoever gets to the door first” rule. Which IS by the way, one of the “other reasons” you somehow haven’t seen in this thread. Given by several posters. [quote] I’ve also yet to see a man here say that he would do the same thing for **any able bodied man**. I don’t know the gender of each and every poster, but I saw at least one poster that I believe is a man, say he operates under the “whoever gets to the door first” rule and that he would open a door for a man. And I know I’ve seen men open doors for both my boyfriend and I just because they happened to be there. Actually, I’ve been involved in some pretty funny “door opening” situations. The person opening the door occasionally gets stuck a group of people he or she didn’t bargain on, leading to jokes of “so, you’re the designated door opener eh” and so on. The door opener is thought of as a “good sport” and laughs are had all around. Big whoop. Good gracious woman, you sure invest a LOT of emotion and imagine a LOT of insult in a simple act of courtesy. ---
**Author:** ![amijane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f0a364/32.png) [@amijane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amijane)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/299 "2006-08-12T18:24:13Z")
[QUOTE=CanvasShoes] When you are out in real life, and a strange man dares to open the door for you, how do you know what his motivations are? And more, how do you know that they are of the “I’m doing this because I know you’re a weak helpless woman” variety? [/QUOTE] Why on earth else would he open a door for me when he would not do the same for a man of similar age/visual door-opening ability as me? Because he was taught it’s good manners? Why was he taught it’s good manners to open doors for women, where did the notion that women shold not open doors for themselves come from? From a society that presumed, politely I’m sure, that women were less able, weaker, and far too dainty to open their own doors. If a man opens a door for me, he’s not presuming that I am those things but _that is where he behaviour stems from_. I don’t have to accept that, so I decline his offer politely. Yep, it might irk him for me to do so, but why should I censor my behaviour to not be irksome, when he’s not doing the same for me? If he’s opening the door because I am carrying a huge heavy object, fine. Other than that, I can open my own door just fine, ta very much. In fact, I’ll even hold it open for you! ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/300 "2006-08-12T18:33:44Z")
[QUOTE=amijane] \*\*Why on earth else would he open a door for me when he would not do the same for a man of similar age/visual door-opening ability as me? \*\* Because he was taught it’s good manners? Why was he taught it’s good manners to open doors for women, where did the notion that women shold not open doors for themselves come from? From a society that presumed, politely I’m sure, that women were less able, weaker, and far too dainty to open their own doors. If a man opens a door for me, he’s not presuming that I am those things but _that is where he behaviour stems from_. I don’t have to accept that, so I decline his offer politely. Yep, it might irk him for me to do so, but why should I censor my behaviour to not be irksome, when he’s not doing the same for me? If he’s opening the door because I am carrying a huge heavy object, fine. Other than that, I can open my own door just fine, ta very much. In fact, I’ll even hold it open for you! [/QUOTE] HOW DO YOU KNOW HE WOULDN’T DO IT FOR A MAN??? HOW DO YOU KNOW?? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112.md?page=16)