# Dear Miss Ogynist...Miss Andryst...Miss Anthrope...Miss thang... ahem. Dear catsix, **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 10, 2006, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112 "2006-08-10T03:42:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2006, 10:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/21 "2006-08-10T10:44:17Z")
> [@Shoshana](#): > > Wow, this has to be some kind of record. Your 5th post on the boards is a Pit thread? Nah, I think my first post was starting a Pit thread. The search engine isn’t entirely behaving right now, but from what I can tell, that’s the case. I wasn’t Pitting another poster, though, but I did lurk on and off for at least a year before finally speaking up. Of course, this isn’t typical for most people. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2006, 12:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/22 "2006-08-10T12:06:55Z")
> [@catsix](#): > > When someone treats me in a manner that I find rude, I won’t bother to give them any courtesy or respect in return. I’m not worried about what they think of me. When someone actually treats me in a polite, respectful manner, such as **Scumpup** , I find that they don’t have reason to call me rude. Any time you’d like to have a couple of beers, **Scumpup**. Hope you’ve been enjoying your summer. 🙂 The problem is that your subjective expectations – what you personally find rude – doesn’t quite map with society’s. It’s as though I sneezed, someone said “God bless you!” and I responded with snarling invective, saying I did not need the blessings of some imaginary man in the sky, relied upon by weak-minded people to substitute for reason and critical thinking. That would be a rude response… even if I personally found the random “God bless you” in response to a sneeze to be rude. If what motivated the action was geniune kindess, then I believe kindness - or at least civility - is merited in return. ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2006, 12:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/23 "2006-08-10T12:12:26Z")
> [@](#): > > **Bricker** said: > It’s as though I sneezed, someone said “God bless you!” and I responded with snarling invective, saying I did not need the blessings of some imaginary man in the sky, relied upon by weak-minded people to substitute for reason and critical thinking. I don’t respond at all when someone says “god bless you”. ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2006, 12:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/24 "2006-08-10T12:15:41Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > That would be a rude response… even if I personally found the random “God bless you” in response to a sneeze to be rude. If what motivated the action was geniune kindess, then I believe kindness - or at least civility - is merited in return. I think that **Catsix** distrusts apparent kindness. And it is true that a lot of superficially kind actions **do** stem from unkind,selfish motivations. On the other hand, people do actually like to be nice, and get a little thrill from pleasing other people–so some kindness is kindly met. When you are faced with a situation where you can’t tell, do you assume the best or the worst? Is it worse to let someone walk off thinking smug, condecending thoughts about you, or worse to hurt the feelings of someone whose courtesy was sincerely meant? ---
**Author:** ![Ukulele\_Ike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/df788c/32.png) [@Ukulele\_Ike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ukulele_Ike)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2006, 12:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/25 "2006-08-10T12:33:55Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > It’s as though I sneezed, someone said “God bless you!” and I responded with snarling invective That’s why I always say “Gesundheit.” ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2006, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/26 "2006-08-10T12:46:30Z")
> [@Ferret Herder](#): > > […] but I did lurk on and off for at least a year before finally speaking up. > Of course, this isn’t typical for most people. I lurked for like 9 months before my first post. I knew who all the most prolific posers in CS, GD and BBQ were, and their personalities. Not so strange, really, this was my first MB and I wanted to get things right… ---
**Author:** ![Sal\_Ammoniac](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8dc957/32.png) [@Sal\_Ammoniac](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sal_Ammoniac)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2006, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/27 "2006-08-10T12:54:39Z")
> [@catsix](#): > > Read the rest of his name drops. The guy’s gotta be a troll. [terminological nitpit]I think you mean a sock.[/terminological nitpit] ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2006, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/28 "2006-08-10T13:04:26Z")
> [@Ferret Herder](#): > > Nah, I think my first post was starting a Pit thread. The search engine isn’t entirely behaving right now, but from what I can tell, that’s the case. I wasn’t Pitting another poster, though, but I did lurk on and off for at least a year before finally speaking up. > > Of course, this isn’t typical for most people. I lurked for at least a year before posting. I believe my first posts concerned 9/11/2001; having been across the street from the WTC when it happened, I felt I could do some rumor control. ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2006, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/29 "2006-08-10T13:07:18Z")
> [@](#): > > **Manda JO** said: > I think that Catsix distrusts apparent kindness. And it is true that a lot of superficially kind actions do stem from unkind,selfish motivations. On the other hand, people do actually like to be nice, and get a little thrill from pleasing other people–so some kindness is kindly met. What catsix objects to is being treated differently by a random stranger than said random stranger would treat an able bodied man. I have no problem with offers of help that any reasonable person would make to another person regardless of that other person’s gender. Most people, seeing someone try to lift a box that is way too big or heavy, would ask ‘Want a hand with that?’ regardless of the gender of the lifter. Most people would hold a door for someone, regardless of their gender, whose hands are full. Most people would not stand up and offer their seat on a bus or a train to a 28 year-old, able-body looking man carrying a backpack. They might think they’re trying to be nice, but really what they’re saying is ‘I have assumed based on the fact that you possess breasts that you are unable to stand up.’ When I worked for PennDoT, most of the men assumed that I would do my share of the work and never gave me any guff about being a girl. If I couldn’t carry two boxes of Crafco at a time, I carried one at a time and made speed so that I still did my entire pile. There was, however, one guy on the crew who attempted to take a shovel off of me because ‘that hotpatch is too heavy for you, honey.’ My foreman saw no problem with me telling him to get out of my way before I put that shovel up his ass. ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2006, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/30 "2006-08-10T13:07:50Z")
I would give up my seat to a non-pregnant **catsix** without a second thought. I would never give up my seat to **Guinastasia** , even if she were pregnant, on crutches, and tethered to an IV machine. I guess it all depends whether I _like_ them or not. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2006, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/31 "2006-08-10T13:14:08Z")
I dunno, I disagree with a lot of stuff **catsix** says, but I like her a lot, too. She doesn’t have a bone of hypcrisy in her body, as far as I can see, and comes straight out and says what she means. If the steretypical Japanese is at one end of the spectrum, bowing, sweet smiles, while they insult your mother, then **catsix** is at the opposite end. ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2006, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/32 "2006-08-10T13:19:33Z")
> [@](#): > > **Crafter\_Man** said: > I would give up my seat to a non-pregnant catsix without a second thought. You probably wouldn’t get your nose bent if I said ‘Nah, that’s OK, you were there first.’ But that’s just my impression. > [@](#): > > **Anaamika** said: > She doesn’t have a bone of hypcrisy in her body, as far as I can see, and comes straight out and says what she means. Even if I have to say it a thousand and ten times that it’s not politeness I have a problem with, it’s being treated like I need a leg-up that a man doesn’t need. ---
**Author:** ![Beaucarnea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/c0e974/32.png) [@Beaucarnea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beaucarnea)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2006, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/33 "2006-08-10T13:27:25Z")
What I objected to is **catsix’s** refusal to answer a reasonable question when she had obviously worked herself into attack mode. She did, eventually, in a round about way, kind of, eventually, answer the question “what would be your reaction to a woman of similar construct holding the door for you” My point in the original thread was that she would snarl at a man holding a door for her, but would have no reaction if a woman did the same. Seems as though she has a problem with courtesy from me, but not from women. And, given her history of attacking women, I found her argument incongruent. Was merely pointing out that she would have unequal reactions to the situation. And yes, longtime lurker who has seen **catsix** derail numerous threads in order to /Helen Reddy/ roar /Helen Reddy/ ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2006, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/34 "2006-08-10T13:31:15Z")
> [@catsix](#): > > Even if I have to say it a thousand and ten times that it’s not politeness I have a problem with, it’s being treated like I need a leg-up that a man doesn’t need. But the issue is that the people doing it, for the most part, are genuinely not aware that that particular assumption is (a) wrong, or (b) offensive. When I was in high school, the group I hung out with included a guy named Doug, whose ancestry was Asian. One time we all went to the home of the grandmother of another one of our crowd. As we were all introduced, and on our best behavior… “Pleased to meet you, ma’am…” she came to Doug, and, on hearing his name, said, “Oh, Mr. S. and I have traveled all over the world, dear; we understand these things. What’s your real name?” Because, of course, no Asian could actually be named “Doug,” you see. Now, was that a rude comment? She meant well. She simply didn’t understand. To hs credit, Doug simply grinned and said, “Actually, Mrs. S., it really is Doug. I was born here.” No insult taken where none was intended. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2006, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/35 "2006-08-10T13:36:08Z")
> [@Manda JO](#): > > I think that **Catsix** distrusts apparent kindness. And it is true that a lot of superficially kind actions **do** stem from unkind,selfish motivations. On the other hand, people do actually like to be nice, and get a little thrill from pleasing other people–so some kindness is kindly met. > > When you are faced with a situation where you can’t tell, do you assume the best or the worst? Is it worse to let someone walk off thinking smug, condecending thoughts about you, or worse to hurt the feelings of someone whose courtesy was sincerely meant? Yipes – that’s an awful lot to read into opening up a door, or giving up a seat. 😕 Smug, condescending thoughts? Huh? Over what’s a reflexive cultural norm in most of the country? And unkind, unselfish motivations? Look, if that one in a bazillion jerks uses giving up a seat or opening a door as a chance to make unwelcome advances, it’s not the courtesy that’s problematic … it’s the guy’s subsequent behavior. Did you have some other unkind motivations in mind? I can’t even think of any possible ones besides macking … perhaps my imagination needs a jolt. :shrug: ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2006, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/36 "2006-08-10T13:38:34Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > When I was in high school, the group I hung out with included a guy named Doug, whose ancestry was Asian. > > One time we all went to the home of the grandmother of another one of our crowd. As we were all introduced, and on our best behavior… “Pleased to meet you, ma’am…” she came to Doug, and, on hearing his name, said, “Oh, Mr. S. and I have traveled all over the world, dear; we understand these things. What’s your real name?” > > Because, of course, no Asian could actually be named “Doug,” you see. > > Now, was that a rude comment? > > She meant well. She simply didn’t understand. To hs credit, Doug simply grinned and said, “Actually, Mrs. S., it really is Doug. I was born here.” No insult taken where none was intended. Yes, that is rude and I would be offended. Ignorance is not a defense, especially not on these boards. It’s not the same situation as the catsix situation, though, IMO. No Asian could be named Doug, indeed. Talk to my SO, who has the most American, patriotic name around. (And no, it’s not Uncle Sam.) ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2006, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/37 "2006-08-10T13:40:01Z")
> [@](#): > > **Beaucarnea** said: > Was merely pointing out that she would have unequal reactions to the situation. Then not only are you probably a sock-puppet troll, you didn’t fucking pay attention. I have a problem with the attitude of those like **Cemetery Savior** who offer up a seat to **any woman even if she just won a triathlon** the same way that they would to a **person (male) who has physical limitations or age-related infirmities**. I want to be treated the same way he would treat an able-bodied man, not the same way he would treat a disabled man. What the bloody blue fuck on a Triscuit is wrong with that? ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2006, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/38 "2006-08-10T13:42:11Z")
> [@catsix](#): > > Even if I have to say it a thousand and ten times that it’s not politeness I have a problem with, it’s being treated like I need a leg-up that a man doesn’t need. Line me up alongside the guy who held the door for a woman and was treated to “You don’t need to hold the door for me just because I’m a lady!” He replied, “I didn’t hold it because you’re a lady; I held it because I’m a gentleman.” Some of us have been brought up to feel ashamed if we don’t display this kind of deference. If you don’t need it, don’t bite our heads off for it. ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2006, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/39 "2006-08-10T13:45:08Z")
> [@catsix](#): > > You probably wouldn’t get your nose bent if I said ‘Nah, that’s OK, you were there first.’ Not at all. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2006, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112/40 "2006-08-10T13:48:00Z")
> [@Malacandra](#): > > Line me up alongside the guy who held the door for a woman and was treated to “You don’t need to hold the door for me just because I’m a lady!” > > He replied, “I didn’t hold it because you’re a lady; I held it because I’m a gentleman.” > > Some of us have been brought up to feel ashamed if we don’t display this kind of deference. If you don’t need it, don’t bite our heads off for it. It’s not that. It’s not even as though I would bite anyone’s head off for it! But yeah, it does just make me raise an eyebrow when I hear men saying they would stand up for a woman, anytime, no matter her physical condition. It smacks of making us into the weaker sex, that we need such things, that we can’t do it ourselves. I understand your need for politeness. And sure, if you hold the door open for me, I’ll go through it with a smile and a thank you. But I sure as hell won’t take your seat on the subway. And I probably won’t accept help if I am carrying something heavy, either - but I will appreciate you opening the door for me. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-miss-ogynist-miss-andryst-miss-anthrope-miss-thang-ahem-dear-catsix/368112.md?page=3)