# Dear NY Times: Why bother endorsing Kasich?? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [January 31, 2016, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741 "2016-01-31T13:04:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741/21 "2016-02-01T13:16:08Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > This is a particularly solid presentation of the modern conservative mentality. Ultra-liberals like myself and most normal people will listen to a well substantiated argument even if they don’t necessarily draw identical conclusions. Evaluating evidence is part of being a functional American. Modern conservatives present a contrasting approach. They evaluate the conclusion and the observer and skip the argument altogether. In fact they basically think all opinions are equal: the quality of the evidence and logic are not salient considerations according to this view. Modern conservatives presumably choose this sort of stance to protect a fragile disposition, though of course ignorance of the fundamentals of valid inference plays a role as well. I accept this and find it psychologically fascinating. > > It doesn’t blow my mind to listen to the arguments and views of a Kissinger, Nixon or Eisenhower. I may not agree with their reasoning, but I am capable of learning from well argued viewpoints. +1. Got very little to add here. It’s astounding how “Yeah, but they’re liberals” is an immediate conversation-stopper. Who cares about how accurate or honest or reasonable they are - they’re _liberal_, and that means their opinion cannot possibly be right. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741/22 "2016-02-01T13:24:52Z")
To be fair … how often do you listen with a serious ear to Glenn Beck? Would you really weigh his analysis of why Sanders or Clinton is the better candidate very heavily? ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741/23 "2016-02-01T13:40:44Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > To be fair … how often do you listen with a serious ear to Glenn Beck? Would you really weigh his analysis of why Sanders or Clinton is the better candidate very heavily? Of course not. But there’s a difference here. The New York Times has won upwards of a hundred Pulitzers and has a long-standing reputation for exemplary journalism. Glenn Beck is an insane blowhard with a long-standing reputation for fecal diarrhea. Pick any Glenn Beck segment and chances are you can spot quite a few lies, mistakes, and bad strings of logic. There is simply no comparison. There’s a difference between “I’m no longer paying much attention to a source’s blithering because they’re wrong all the time” and “I’m not going to give any source that doesn’t already agree with my political views the time of day”. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741/24 "2016-02-01T13:52:43Z")
More reasonable right-wing conspiracy theories would see the Kasich endorsement as being the result of mild concern by the Times that a non-loon is doing well enough in NH to be a threat, and thus need tamping down by a poisonous (to the GOP base) endorsement. Further, his having been endorsed (at least technically) by the Times should be toxic enough that Kasich will not be picked as a VP candidate, thus further weakening any ticket headed by Trump or Cruz. Or it could be that the Times editorial board is patting itself on the back by showing it would at least listen to a “reasonable” GOP candidate, when in reality it would find ample reason if Kasich was nominated to portray him as a rampaging dinosaur. Amusingly, there is a far-left alternative newspaper in central Ohio that just published an op-ed accusing the Times of being in the tank for Kasich (because a Times Magazine article on him didn’t attack him with sufficient viciousness). This was _before_ the Times endorsement. They’ll really be in a monster tizzy now. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741/25 "2016-02-01T14:54:49Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > The Times is the voice of the Left. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741/26 "2016-02-01T15:08:04Z")
If the NYT is the voice of the Left, [why is it endorsing Clinton over Sanders](http://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/31/opinion/sunday/hillary-clinton-endorsement.html?_r=0)? ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741/27 "2016-02-01T15:23:06Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > Well, as the Paper of Record, the NYT is now on the record for having taken the time to research and endorse the only Republican candidate who is not a raving demagogic, hate-spewing lunatic, an utterly ignorant twit, or has been associated with corrupt practices. Untrue! There’s fellow basement dweller Jim Gilmore. He’s still in. ---
**Author:** ![Knorf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58956e/32.png) [@Knorf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knorf)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741/28 "2016-02-01T15:33:14Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > The Times is the voice of the Left. No leftists look to the NY Times as a “voice” to represent them, not even on their editorial pages, which are far too corporate. Respect for good journalism is the most you’re going to get. > [@BrainGlutton](#): > > If the NYT is the voice of the Left, [why is it endorsing Clinton over Sanders](http://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/31/opinion/sunday/hillary-clinton-endorsement.html?_r=0)? Exactly. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741/29 "2016-02-01T15:33:35Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > To be fair … how often do you listen with a serious ear to Glenn Beck? Would you really weigh his analysis of why Sanders or Clinton is the better candidate very heavily? But that’s because he’s Glen Beck. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741/30 "2016-02-01T16:16:15Z")
I take note of newspaper endorsements and the more prestigious and influential the paper, the more I take note of it. The NYT and the Washington Post are in a league of their own, those endorsements I take quite seriously and if they differ from my preference it makes me take a second look. ---
**Author:** ![davida03801](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b5e925/32.png) [@davida03801](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davida03801)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741/31 "2016-02-01T16:26:56Z")
ABT ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741/32 "2016-02-01T17:15:54Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > I take note of newspaper endorsements and the more prestigious and influential the paper, the more I take note of it. The NYT and the Washington Post are in a league of their own, those endorsements I take quite seriously and if they differ from my preference it makes me take a second look. Apparently [WaPo is also siding with Clinton,](http://www.alternet.org/media/washington-post-just-published-probably-most-inaccurate-editorial-bernies-campaign-so-far) or at least against Sanders. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741/33 "2016-02-01T17:23:23Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > To be fair … how often do you listen with a serious ear to Glenn Beck? Would you really weigh his analysis of why Sanders or Clinton is the better candidate very heavily? Glenn Beck is not a serious commentator. If the NYT had a writer who spent his off hours drawing up conspiracy theory brainstorms on chalkboards I would expect everyone to ignore _him_, too. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741/34 "2016-02-01T20:34:19Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > If the NYT is the voice of the Left, [why is it endorsing Clinton over Sanders](http://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/31/opinion/sunday/hillary-clinton-endorsement.html?_r=0)? Huh? Both Clinton and Sanders are on the Left. There is no distinction between being the voice of the Left and picking one Left leaning candidate over another, even if the Left leaning they pick is not as left as the other one. I mean, unless you are one of those strange people who think Clinton is a DINO (or worse yet, a Republican, which is quite possibly the weirdest thing I’ve heard Hillary Clinton ever be called), in which case it really isn’t worth listening to you on this issue. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741/35 "2016-02-01T21:26:56Z")
She \*was \*a Goldwater supporter, in her young/naive/suburban/privileged-upraising days. But then, like so many others of that background, she discovered there were other people in the world. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741/36 "2016-02-01T21:35:08Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Douthat’s not on my side of the party, but I definitely think he’s probably the smartest guy worth reading on that side of it. It is the only part of the GOP that has any intellectual vitality at this point. ---
**Author:** ![Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/do_not_taunt/32/2968_2.png) [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Do_Not_Taunt)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741/37 "2016-02-01T21:51:37Z")
> [@ISiddiqui](#): > > Huh? Both Clinton and Sanders are on the Left. There is no distinction between being the voice of the Left and picking one Left leaning candidate over another, even if the Left leaning they pick is not as left as the other one. > > I mean, unless you are one of those strange people who think Clinton is a DINO (or worse yet, a Republican, which is quite possibly the weirdest thing I’ve heard Hillary Clinton ever be called), in which case it really isn’t worth listening to you on this issue. Actually, there’s a possibility you left out. Clinton is a Democrat and a centrist, though not a DINO, whereas Sanders is a leftist. That possibility actually seems closest to correct IMHO, which is why I also think that the NYT is a fairly centrist paper. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741/38 "2016-02-01T22:04:22Z")
> [@ISiddiqui](#): > > Huh? Both Clinton and Sanders are on the Left. There is no distinction between being the voice of the Left and picking one Left leaning candidate over another, even if the Left leaning they pick is not as left as the other one. > > I mean, unless you are one of those strange people who think Clinton is a DINO (or worse yet, a Republican, which is quite possibly the weirdest thing I’ve heard Hillary Clinton ever be called), in which case it really isn’t worth listening to you on this issue. Clinton is not on the Left. DINO or not, she is somewhat to the right of Obama. Who is **not** on the Left. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741/39 "2016-02-01T22:16:09Z")
> [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](#): > > Actually, there’s a possibility you left out. Clinton is a Democrat and a centrist, though not a DINO, whereas Sanders is a leftist. She’s a [New Democrat.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Democrats) She was [DLC](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democratic_Leadership_Council) in 1992 and I suppose she’s DLC now, though it no longer exists in organized form; certainly there’s no reason to think her politics have drifted leftward since then. And the New Democrats/DLC are emphatically **not** on the Left, that was/is the whole point of them. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2016, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741/40 "2016-02-01T22:16:46Z")
> [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](#): > > Clinton is a Democrat and a centrist, though not a DINO, whereas Sanders is a leftist. That possibility actually seems closest to correct IMHO, which is why I also think that the NYT is a fairly centrist paper. Considering that Clinton was the 11th more liberal Senator when she was serving in the Senate, calling her a centrist also seems to be a bit silly, IMHO. She’s a lefty, maybe trending towards center-left, but still left. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dear-ny-times-why-bother-endorsing-kasich/744741.md?page=3)