# Death by grapes? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 27, 2010, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660 "2010-02-27T17:16:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![JessWess](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/8baadc/32.png) [@JessWess](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JessWess)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2010, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660/1 "2010-02-27T17:16:33Z")
This is a debate that has been raging for years among our group of friends, and much derision has come from it. We are firmly divided into two camps on the hypothetical question of, “could you beat someone to death with a bag of grapes?” To clarify, it is in reference to the bags of grapes at the grocery store, they cannot be frozen, you cannot just use the bag to suffocate someone–it must be grape blunt force trauma. Some of us firmly believe that with enough strength and skill, it could be done, others of us hold to the fact that there is just not enough structural integrity in your average grape to cause damage of that kind–eventually you would just have a bag of mush. I thought if others could weigh in on this, it may give some resolution to the issue that has divided us for so long. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Oregon\_sunshine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/50afbb/32.png) [@Oregon\_sunshine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oregon_sunshine)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2010, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660/2 "2010-02-27T17:21:05Z")
“Tonight I shall be carrying on from where we got to last week, when I was showing you how to defend yourselves against anyone who attacks you armed with a piece of FRESH FRUIT!!!” 😃 ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2010, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660/3 "2010-02-27T17:40:59Z")
It’s not the structure, it’s the weight. A bag of grapes is maybe two pounds, and the grapes are more likely to break when hitting a person. It would seem be as fearsome a weapon as the soft pillows. A bag of oranges, OTOH. . . . ---
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2010, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660/4 "2010-02-27T17:47:08Z")
Agree with RealityChuck. I just don’t believe there’s enough mass to do much, if any damage, especially when it’s just going to turn into mush after a few whacks. Question: exactly how does one procure the appropriate “skill” to bludgeon someone to death with a bag of grapes? ---
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2010, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660/5 "2010-02-27T17:50:03Z")
BTW I’m fairly certain this is something you could have easily settled by just hitting each other with bags of grapes a few times. Really, what’s going to happen? If by some miracle it _is_ possible to do real damage, you could just stop. ---
**Author:** ![Superfluous\_Parentheses](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8edcca/32.png) [@Superfluous\_Parentheses](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superfluous_Parentheses)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2010, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660/6 "2010-02-27T18:49:16Z")
What’s the heaviest bag available in the supermarket? Is the bag water tight? If so, I believe you could eventually kill someone by hitting them with a large enough bag of water - especially if you hit them on the side of the head - it doesn’t take a very heavy knock to the temple to render someone unconscious. Water is _dense_. Anyone who’s dived into a pool and landed flat will know that the stuff can certainly hurt you. ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2010, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660/7 "2010-02-27T19:27:40Z")
You could do them a serious injury, no doubt about it. I’ll tell you how to do it later, but I don’t want you to start wining about the answer. Grapes should not be trifled with - best use tinned mandarin oranges in syrup for that. ---
**Author:** ![Dag\_Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@Dag\_Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dag_Otto)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2010, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660/8 "2010-02-27T20:11:34Z")
There is only one poster who can answer this, and he is long gone. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2010, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660/9 "2010-02-27T20:15:35Z")
Seems to me like it would soon turn to a bag of mush. The worst you could do would be bruising the person, or maybe giving them an abrasion with the bag. > [@RealityChuck](#): > > …A bag of oranges, OTOH. . . . A bag of oranges is used to nasty effect in the 1990 movie _The Grifters_, IIRC. ---
**Author:** ![TruCelt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trucelt/32/523_2.png) [@TruCelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TruCelt)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2010, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660/10 "2010-02-27T20:20:22Z")
You could, by brain trauma. Repeated trauma to the brain is cumulative. For cites search on damage caused by “heading” a soccer ball. Although the individual impacts would be less, repeated impact to the same spot slams the brain against the opposite wall of the skull. It would take a while, and you’d see neuroligical damage increase as you went along, but I believe you could eventually cause death. I’m sure there is also a “sweet spot” you could choose which would cause death faster. I’m thinking the forehead, as that would slam the limbic center against the back of the skull. . . You could also try to cause enough swelling in the throat to impede breathing or restrict blood flow to the brain. . . ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2010, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660/11 "2010-02-27T20:36:24Z")
OK, since you are all clamouring for the answer, freeze them first. ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2010, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660/12 "2010-02-27T20:41:08Z")
First you have to define your terms. What is the maximum weight of a bag of grapes? What is the minimum weight of the person being hit? If the first is large enough and the second small enough, it can be done. Suppose the victim is a newborn infant. ---
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2010, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660/13 "2010-02-27T20:42:50Z")
> [@TruCelt](#): > > You could, by brain trauma. Repeated trauma to the brain is cumulative. For cites search on damage caused by “heading” a soccer ball. Although the individual impacts would be less, repeated impact to the same spot slams the brain against the opposite wall of the skull. It would take a while, and you’d see neuroligical damage increase as you went along, but I believe you could eventually cause death. A soccer ball is much harder and less flexible than a bag of smashed grapes would be. While it may technically be possible, over an extended period of time, to injure someone with such an implement, it would be like attempting to bludgeon someone to death with a whiffle ball bat. You may do some damage given enough time, but in reality, who’s going to stand idly by and allow themselves to get whacked with a bag of mushy grapes for hours on end? ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2010, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660/14 "2010-02-27T20:47:28Z")
> [@casdave](#): > > OK, since you are all clamouring for the answer, freeze them first. Bzzzzt. Prohibited by the OP. ---
**Author:** ![TruCelt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trucelt/32/523_2.png) [@TruCelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TruCelt)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2010, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660/15 "2010-02-27T20:50:42Z")
> [@DCnDC](#): > > A soccer ball is much harder and less flexible than a bag of smashed grapes would be. While it may technically be possible, over an extended period of time, to injure someone with such an implement, it would be like attempting to bludgeon someone to death with a whiffle ball bat. You may do some damage given enough time, but in reality, who’s going to stand idly by and allow themselves to get whacked with a bag of mushy grapes for hours on end? The OP places no limits on the time required, nor upon the condition of the victim. Further, you may wish to re-examine my use of the phrase “although the individual impacts would be less . . .” Come now, you must have something useful to add. P.S. The handle end of the whiffle bat is quite hard, as my brother learned about 35 years ago. ---
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2010, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660/16 "2010-02-27T20:57:53Z")
Fair enough. If there are no restrictions on individual scenarios, sure, it’s possible to bludgeon someone to death with a bag of grapes. If you’re hitting a 3 year old with Lobstein disease, absolutely it’s possible. However, in _reality_, someone comes up to me with a bag of grapes and tries to hit me with it, even if it connects I will be able to react and stab that person in the eye before they can take another swing. That’s all I’m saying. ---
**Author:** ![Indistinguishable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/90ced4/32.png) [@Indistinguishable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indistinguishable)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2010, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660/17 "2010-02-27T21:04:06Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > It’s not the structure, it’s the weight. A bag of grapes is maybe two pounds, and the grapes are more likely to break when hitting a person. It would seem be as fearsome a weapon as the soft pillows. It can’t do damage because it weighs too little? Can’t you do damage to someone beating them with a bag containing two pounds of rocks? (If the problem is that the grapes break when you hit a person, then the problem _is_ the structure, not the weight.) ---
**Author:** ![Alan\_Smithee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/2acd7d/32.png) [@Alan\_Smithee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alan_Smithee)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2010, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660/18 "2010-02-27T21:09:31Z")
F = M \* A If you could accelerate the grapes to a high enough speed, you could do damage. ---
**Author:** ![Shagnasty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9dc877/32.png) [@Shagnasty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shagnasty)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2010, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660/19 "2010-02-27T21:20:29Z")
> [@Dag\_Otto](#): > > There is only one poster who can answer this, and he is long gone. And do you know the reason why he is gone? They don’t have internet access in maximum security prison. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Scrivener](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@The\_Scrivener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Scrivener)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2010, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660/20 "2010-02-27T21:23:55Z")
Does the would-be victim also have hemophilia? Nothing like a little uncontrolled internal hemorrhaging to speed things along… I suspect that a big enough bag, wielded with a lot of speed and force, might well do the trick. But the OP seems to limit this to conventional grocery store bags, and those little plastic things probably won’t hold enough grapes to do the job. Even if you could stuff enough grapes in one to do the job, the bag would tear very quickly. Is there a limit on the number of bags? Could you quad- or quintuple the bags to execute your homicidal ambition? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-by-grapes/530660.md?page=2)