# Death penalty for Conversion to Christianity? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 22, 2006, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-penalty-for-conversion-to-christianity/349478 "2006-03-22T20:16:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2006, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-penalty-for-conversion-to-christianity/349478/1 "2006-03-22T20:16:49Z")
An afghan man who converted from islam to christainity is facing a possible death penalty. Is this a capital crime under Muslim law? What do muslim leaders say about this, in view of the universal declaration of human rights? ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2006, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-penalty-for-conversion-to-christianity/349478/2 "2006-03-22T21:03:02Z")
> [@](#): > > The Afghan constitution, which is based on Sharia, or Islamic law, says that apostates can receive the death penalty. Source: [CNN.com - Bush presses Afghanistan on jailed Christian - Mar 22, 2006](http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/03/22/bush/index.html) > [@](#): > > Sharia (Arabic: شريعة; also Sharī’ah, Shari’a, Shariah or Syariah) is the Arabic word for Islamic law, also known as the Law of Allah, and governs both public and private lives of those living in an Islamic state. [citation needed] Sharia covers not only religious rituals, but many aspects of day-to-day life, politics, economics, banking, business or contract law, and social issues. The term Sharia refers to the body of Islamic law. Some accept Sharia as the body of precedent and legal theory before the 19th century, while other scholars view Sharia as a changing body, and include reform Islamic legal theory from the contemporary period. > > - snip - > > In most interpretations of an Islamic state, conversion by Muslims to other religions is forbidden and is termed apostasy. Muslim theology equals apostasy to treason, and in most interpretations of shariah, the Penalty for apostasy is death. Source: [Sharia - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sharia) > [@](#): > > Apostasy in Islam (ارتداد, Irtidād) is the rejection of Islam by some means, be it spoken or written. Displayed disloyalty or blasphemous acts can also be deemed apostasy. The concept has parallels in some other religious systems, particularly monotheistic ones such as Christianity. There is no definition and consequent punishment that spans all Islamic views. The concept of how to deal with apostasy in Islamic theocracies is traditionally a matter of hadd under Sharia law, and it varies over the different schools of thought throughout the history of Islam. There is a consensus in the four fiqh (Schools of Jurisprudence) that an apostate should be killed. > > Most Muslim countries rarely carry out the death penalty at present, but in a recent case in Afghanistan, a man who converted to Christianity was charged with rejecting Islam and could be executed unless he reconverts. [1] Contemporary Muslims in the liberal movement oppose the death penalty, as have some earlier Islamic scholars. Source: [Apostasy in Islam - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apostasy_in_Islam) ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2006, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-penalty-for-conversion-to-christianity/349478/3 "2006-03-22T21:43:01Z")
> [@CNN](#): > > The Afghan constitution, which is based on Sharia, or Islamic law, says that apostates can receive the death penalty. As best as I can tell, this is not really true, or is at best a major oversimplification. Article Two of the [Constitution of Afghanistan](http://www.jemb.org/eng/Legal%20Framework/Legislation%20of%20Reference/Constitution/Constitution%20(English).pdf) (PDF file) states that “the sacred religion of Islam shall be the religion of the Islamic Republic of Afghanistan” but that “Followers of other religions shall be free within the bounds of law in the exercise and performance of their religious rights”. (That may mean “religious rites”–the translation seems to be a little shaky in places.) Article Three says that “No law shall contravene the tenets and provisions of the holy religion of Islam in Afghanistan”. There doesn’t seem to be anything explicitly about apostasy one way or the other. So it’s a question of interpretation: Is _not_ having a law making apostasy from Islam punishable by death a contravention of the “tenets and provisions of the holy religion of Islam”? Clearly, many Muslims would say yes–they would say that allowing people to become “apostates”–to convert from Islam to other religions–is contrary to the tenets and provisions of Islam. (Saying that “followers of other religions” have the right to free exercise doesn’t, strictly speaking, mean that Muslims may convert, just that any existing Christians or Hindus who are about who were never Muslims to begin with may freely exercise their religions. There would also be the question of what exactly the “bounds of law” are in the area of free exercise of religion.) However, the Afghan constitution does make a couple of references to the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, which the framers of the constitution declare the Afghan people to “respect” in the Preamble and which is to be “respected” again in Article Seven. The [UDHR](http://www.unhchr.ch/udhr/lang/eng.htm) is very clear on the subject of “apostasy” (Article 18): > [@](#): > > Everyone has the right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion; **this right includes freedom to change his religion or belief** , and freedom, either alone or in community with others and in public or private, to manifest his religion or belief in teaching, practice, worship and observance. ( **Emphasis** added.) Caveats: I might have missed something in there; it’s 34 pages long and it isn’t even a real text file so you can’t search the document. Also, I am of course going by the English translation, which I doubt has official legal standing. For all I know the Pashto or Dari versions say “Article One: Death To All Infidels!” ---
**Author:** ![AskNott](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asknott/32/5790_2.png) [@AskNott](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AskNott)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2006, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-penalty-for-conversion-to-christianity/349478/4 "2006-03-22T21:44:53Z")
::Checks the header:: Well, this is General Questions, so I have nothing to say. ---
**Author:** ![Anne\_Neville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Anne\_Neville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anne_Neville)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2006, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-penalty-for-conversion-to-christianity/349478/5 "2006-03-22T22:31:19Z")
[QUOTE=AskNott] ::Checks the header:: Well, this is General Questions, so I have nothing to say. [/QUOTE] pssst- **AskNott** - [over here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=364037). ---
**Author:** ![yBeayf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/e274bd/32.png) [@yBeayf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yBeayf)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2006, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-penalty-for-conversion-to-christianity/349478/6 "2006-03-22T23:04:57Z")
Yep, according to most traditional interpretations of shari’ah, an apostate is deserving of death (even if the sentence isn’t actually carried out). As an apostate from Islam, I’m not shy about talking about it, but if I ever visited a Muslim-majority country or area, you can bet I’d be keeping my mouth shut about my personal history. ---
**Author:** ![Anne\_Neville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Anne\_Neville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anne_Neville)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2006, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-penalty-for-conversion-to-christianity/349478/7 "2006-03-22T23:31:18Z")
I’ve heard that some Muslim countries also had laws against Christians converting to Judaism. Did they? Do any still have laws like that? ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2006, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-penalty-for-conversion-to-christianity/349478/8 "2006-03-23T02:45:26Z")
[QUOTE=yBeayf] Yep, according to most traditional interpretations of shari’ah, an apostate is deserving of death (even if the sentence isn’t actually carried out). As an apostate from Islam, I’m not shy about talking about it, but if I ever visited a Muslim-majority country or area, you can bet I’d be keeping my mouth shut about my personal history. [/QUOTE] **ybeayf** , has death been the traditional punishment for apostasy in most Islamic nations over time, or is it a byproduct of current Islamic conservativism? In your opinion, of course. thanks! ---
**Author:** ![yBeayf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/e274bd/32.png) [@yBeayf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yBeayf)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2006, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-penalty-for-conversion-to-christianity/349478/9 "2006-03-23T02:52:13Z")
> [@](#): > > ybeayf, has death been the traditional punishment for apostasy in most Islamic nations over time, or is it a byproduct of current Islamic conservativism? In your opinion, of course. There are several ahadith that prescribe or imply the penalty for apostasy is death. The first one I can dig up is Sahih Bukhari 9.83.17: > [@](#): > > Narrated 'Abdullah: > > Allah’s Apostle said, “The blood of a Muslim who confesses that none has the right to be worshipped but Allah and that I am His Apostle, cannot be shed except in three cases: In Qisas for murder, a married person who commits illegal sexual intercourse and the one who reverts from Islam (apostate) and leaves the Muslims.” ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2006, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-penalty-for-conversion-to-christianity/349478/10 "2006-03-23T02:57:12Z")
[QUOTE=yBeayf] There are several ahadith that prescribe or imply the penalty for apostasy is death. The first one I can dig up is Sahih Bukhari 9.83.17: [/QUOTE] Thanks, but I guess what I’m asking is whether or not apostates generally got executed, or was it sort of tolerated in certains cultures or states. ---
**Author:** ![yBeayf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/e274bd/32.png) [@yBeayf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yBeayf)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2006, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-penalty-for-conversion-to-christianity/349478/11 "2006-03-23T03:06:42Z")
> [@](#): > > Thanks, but I guess what I’m asking is whether or not apostates generally got executed, or was it sort of tolerated in certains cultures or states. Hmmm. That, I don’t know. **Tamerlane**? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2006, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-penalty-for-conversion-to-christianity/349478/12 "2006-03-23T03:47:02Z")
> [@](#): > > Thanks, but I guess what I’m asking is whether or not apostates generally got executed, or was it sort of tolerated in certains cultures or states. I’ve wondered that myself. What would happen if a Methodist converted to Ba’hai or a Scientologist converted to Catholocism. Would Muslims figure these converts were heading in the right direction even if they hadn’t arrived at the right destination? ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2006, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-penalty-for-conversion-to-christianity/349478/13 "2006-03-23T13:49:36Z")
Thanks to **Tamerlane** for replying in this thread: [Afghan man faces death after leaving Islam for Christianity - The BBQ Pit - Straight Dope Message Board](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=364037) ---
**Author:** ![AskNott](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asknott/32/5790_2.png) [@AskNott](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AskNott)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2006, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-penalty-for-conversion-to-christianity/349478/14 "2006-03-23T19:45:42Z")
[QUOTE=Anne Neville] pssst- **AskNott** - [over here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=364037). [/QUOTE] I just read the 51-post Pit thread **Anne Neville** linked to. Thanks, Anne. It’s very unusual for the Pit; it is almost entirely civil, polite, and thoughtful. I saw one FU and one dipsh, but everything else could have been in Great Debates or IMHO. By the time I read all 51 posts, everything I might have said had already been said, and in some cases, more eloquently than I could have said them. By the way, check out Gary Varvel’s cartoon in the Indianapolis Star. [http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060323/OPINION02/303230001/1093](http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060323/OPINION02/303230001/1093) It’s a then-and-now comparison of religious intolerance in Afghanistan. The pictures are identical. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2006, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-penalty-for-conversion-to-christianity/349478/15 "2006-03-23T20:06:52Z")
[QUOTE=Qadgop the Mercotan] Thanks, but I guess what I’m asking is whether or not apostates generally got executed, or was it sort of tolerated in certains cultures or states. [/QUOTE] As to this specific question, I think in general it just didn’t come up much. **Open** apostasy by any Christian or Muslim as a matter of principle _within the society where the religion they converted to was not in power_ would have been vanishingly rare. Instead what you’d get would be a “defection” to a neighboring power, hence the modern argument that it wasn’t intellectual apostasy per se that was being punished, but rather treason. When such charges were brought in Islamic courts I rather suspect that in most cases they were political in motivation. The ultimate smear tactic. In most places and cases it should have carried the death penalty, but unless brought by the powers that be ( who oddly enough in pre-modern society frequently seemed to triumph in legal matters 😉 ), I imagine they were hard to prove. - Tamerlane