# "Death toll in Burlington \[Washington\] shooting rises to 5; gunman at large"
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720
**Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
**Created:** [September 24, 2016, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720 "2016-09-24T12:54:53Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)
#### Post date: [September 24, 2016, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720/1 "2016-09-24T12:54:53Z")
[Shooting in mall north of Seattle](http://www.kiro7.com/news/north-sound-news/authorities-looking-for-active-shooter-after-reported-shooting-at-cascade-mall/449595663)
> **[Five killed in shooting at Cascade Mall; search on for gunman](https://komonews.com/news/local/police-respond-to-possible-shooter-at-cascade-mall)**
>
> BURLINGTON, Wash. -- The FBI has joined the search for an armed man suspected of killing five people in a shooting at Cascade Mall in Skagit County.The shooter remained on the loose Saturday morning. Police don't know his name or his motive....
> [@](#):
>
> The FBI has joined the search for an armed man suspected of killing five people in a shooting at Cascade Mall in Skagit County, the Washington State Patrol says.
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### Author:  [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)
#### Post date: [September 24, 2016, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720/2 "2016-09-24T15:51:23Z")
The halfway point between my house and Seattle (\<75 miles away), thoughthere’s a border in between.
I note that the word “terrorism” hasn’t come up at all in the coverage, even though there’s no apparent motive being revealed.
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### Author:  [@buddha\_david](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buddha_david)
#### Post date: [September 24, 2016, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720/3 "2016-09-24T16:04:39Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#):
>
> I note that the word “terrorism” hasn’t come up at all in the coverage, even though there’s no apparent motive being revealed.
It depends entirely on whether or not this guy’s a self-radicalized ISIS wannabe (terrorism) or a whiny emo Christian teenager (not terrorism.)
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### Author:  [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)
#### Post date: [September 24, 2016, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720/4 "2016-09-24T16:22:25Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#):
>
> The halfway point between my house and Seattle (\<75 miles away), thoughthere’s a border in between.
I’m just south of the border, and go into the office in Seattle twice a week. So I drive by Cascade Mall four times a week.
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### Author:  [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)
#### Post date: [September 24, 2016, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720/5 "2016-09-24T19:46:26Z")
> [@buddha\_david](#):
>
> It depends entirely on whether or not this guy’s a self-radicalized ISIS wannabe (terrorism) or a whiny emo Christian teenager (not terrorism.)
I didn’t know there were of whiny emo Christian teenagers randomly killing people in the name of their god? Were they self radicalized? Is there an emo-christian organization calling for such attacks?
You should give cites for stuff like this so we’re aware of such goings on.
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### Author:  [@yanceylebeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yanceylebeef)
#### Post date: [September 24, 2016, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720/6 "2016-09-24T19:56:40Z")
I’m up in Skagit Valley visiting my mom. My sister and her family and my 4 year old son were at the Target in the mall complex when they started the lockdown. They got out of there just in time. Still looking for the shooter, it’s pretty tense around town. I would not be surprised if there were more shooting vs before this is over.
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### Author:  [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)
#### Post date: [September 24, 2016, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720/7 "2016-09-24T20:30:49Z")
Could the killer be a boyfriend or ex-boyfriend of one of the employees or customers who was killed?
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### Author:  [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)
#### Post date: [September 24, 2016, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720/8 "2016-09-24T20:34:04Z")
I’ve shopped and gone to the movies in that mall countless times.
Until we get the names and such of the victims, no way of knowing if this was terrorism, revenge or just a disgruntled Macy’s shopper.
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### Author:  [@Rushgeekgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rushgeekgirl)
#### Post date: [September 24, 2016, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720/9 "2016-09-24T22:45:51Z")
> [@Magiver](#):
>
> I didn’t know there were of whiny emo Christian teenagers randomly killing people in the name of their god? Were they self radicalized? Is there an emo-christian organization calling for such attacks?
>
> You should give cites for stuff like this so we’re aware of such goings on.
The first one that popped in to my head was Dylann Roof, and the organization is named The Council of Conservative Citizens. I don’t know if it was “in the name of” his god but he used the religious justification to kill black people from what I remember.
Of course I could be wrong. I’m just going by memory here.
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### Author:  [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)
#### Post date: [September 24, 2016, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720/10 "2016-09-24T23:14:03Z")
> [@Rushgeekgirl](#):
>
> The first one that popped in to my head was Dylann Roof, and the organization is named The Council of Conservative Citizens. I don’t know if it was “in the name of” his god but he used the religious justification to kill black people from what I remember.
>
> Of course I could be wrong. I’m just going by memory here.
OK, I’ll bite, what Christian religious justification did he use for attacking a Christian church?
I’m thinking the reason you don’t know if it was in the name of his god is is because it didn’t happen that way.
Which brings me back to the point I was making. Someone jumped in on the 3rd post and injected this nonsense.
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### Author:  [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)
#### Post date: [September 24, 2016, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720/11 "2016-09-24T23:20:35Z")
> [@buddha\_david](#):
>
> It depends entirely on whether or not this guy’s a self-radicalized ISIS wannabe (terrorism) or a whiny emo Christian teenager (not terrorism.)
> [@PastTense](#):
>
> Could the killer be a boyfriend or ex-boyfriend of one of the employees or customers who was killed?
> [@silenus](#):
>
> Until we get the names and such of the victims, no way of knowing if this was terrorism, revenge or just a disgruntled Macy’s shopper.
I’ve heard speculation that it might have been gang-related. Could be, but the targets and location don’t seem right to me. And of course I’ve read comments from people saying, 'He doesn’t look Hispanic! He looks like a Muslim! :eek: ’ A young male shooting people at the make-up counter? Given that there was a recent mass-shooting in Washington by a disgruntled boyfriend, plus that tribal teenager who killed a bunch of his friends a few years ago, I would not be surprised by the boyfriend/ex-boyfriend scenario turned out to be correct.
But right now, all we have is that it was a Hispanic male wearing grey. (I did read that he was seen with a 50-ish bald White man just before the shootings.) No telling why he did it, until he is caught, or at least know who he is.
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### Author:  [@buddha\_david](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buddha_david)
#### Post date: [September 24, 2016, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720/12 "2016-09-24T23:55:38Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#):
>
> I’ve heard speculation that it might have been gang-related. Could be, but the targets and location don’t seem right to me.
The [most recent news](http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/crime/authorities-looking-for-gunman-in-burlington/) is that the victims were four women “ranging in age from teen to seniors.” That literally screams random.
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### Author:  [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)
#### Post date: [September 25, 2016, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720/13 "2016-09-25T00:10:16Z")
No - they might have all worked at the same makeup counter, for example. But who knows.
Also - I’ve heard that another of the victims, a male, has died at the hospital, as well.
> **[Police Search For Gunman Who Killed 5 At Mall In Washington State](https://www.huffpost.com/entry/washington-state-mall-shooting_n_57e66a50e4b0e80b1ba25082?section=)**
>
> Four women were killed in the attack, and a man who was taken to a local hospital with serious injuries died overnight.
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### Author:  [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)
#### Post date: [September 25, 2016, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720/14 "2016-09-25T00:54:40Z")
> [@Merneith](#):
>
> No - they might have all worked at the same makeup counter, for example. But who knows.
>
> Also - I’ve heard that another of the victims, a male, has died at the hospital, as well.
> [Police Search For Gunman Who Killed 5 At Mall In Washington State | HuffPost Latest News](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/washington-state-mall-shooting_us_57e66a50e4b0e80b1ba25082?section=&)
Yes, he died at the hospital, but he is included in the reported death toll of five, along with the four women who died in the mall. There haven’t been any additional deaths reported since the thread was started, this morning.
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### Author:  [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)
#### Post date: [September 25, 2016, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720/15 "2016-09-25T01:19:03Z")
> [@Magiver](#):
>
> OK, I’ll bite, what Christian religious justification did he use for attacking a Christian church?
>
> I’m thinking the reason you don’t know if it was in the name of his god is is because it didn’t happen that way.
[Dylann Roof](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dylann_Roof) was indeed technically a nutty, kinda emo, Christian, white supremacist. But he doesn’t seem to have been of the _religious variety of white supremacist_. He was apparently a member of a bog standard Lutheran church and his virulent racism appears to have been more of a generalized secular variety. He attacked the church because it was full of black people, not because they were the wrong variety of Christian ( far as I can tell ).
There _are_ [religious white supremacists](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Identity), but far as I know they’ve never made a practice of targeting churches. Though never say never, I suppose. With whackadoos, you never know.
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### Author:  [@Buttercup\_Smith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buttercup_Smith)
#### Post date: [September 25, 2016, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720/16 "2016-09-25T02:46:38Z")
Caught!
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### Author:  [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)
#### Post date: [September 25, 2016, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720/17 "2016-09-25T02:52:46Z")
And, since a link is always welcome:
[Suspect in Cascade Mall shooting arrested in Oak Harbor](http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/crime/teen-cancer-survivor-among-mall-shooting-victims-search-for-gunman-continues/)
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### Author:  [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)
#### Post date: [September 25, 2016, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720/18 "2016-09-25T02:59:43Z")
[KOMO 4](http://komonews.com/news/local/sheriffs-office-person-of-interest-arrested-in-cascade-mall-shooting) is identifying the shooting suspect as 20-year-old Arcan Cetin. His Facebook page says he’s from Adana, Turkey.
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### Author:  [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)
#### Post date: [September 25, 2016, 5:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720/19 "2016-09-25T05:57:39Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#):
>
> [KOMO 4](http://komonews.com/news/local/sheriffs-office-person-of-interest-arrested-in-cascade-mall-shooting) is identifying the shooting suspect as 20-year-old Arcan Cetin. His Facebook page says he’s from Adana, Turkey.
What should stand out in the news is that he arrived at the mall without a gun. Where did the gun come from? Was it planted there in advance?
---
### Author:  [@buddha\_david](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buddha_david)
#### Post date: [September 25, 2016, 7:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720/20 "2016-09-25T07:54:29Z")
> [@Magiver](#):
>
> What should stand out in the news is that he arrived at the mall without a gun. Where did the gun come from? Was it planted there in advance?
Reading comprehension check:
> [@KOMO 4 Article](#):
>
> "Surveillance video showed Cetin come into the store unarmed about 10 minutes before the shooting. **Police believe he went back to the car to get the rifle."**
[Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/death-toll-in-burlington-washington-shooting-rises-to-5-gunman-at-large/766720.md?page=2)