# Deaths that sort of define a person **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 13, 2023, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999 "2023-07-13T19:14:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2023, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999/101 "2023-07-14T02:58:29Z")
> [@Toxylon](#): > > Out of the popular 90’s fare, I find Nirvana’s music to stand the test of time the best (and I never was a fan as such): they really made classics. This has nothing to do with Cobain’s death, and the music would be played regardless, I think. Dude wrote strong, memorable melodies, that’s for sure. ---
**Author:** ![Tibby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tibby/32/17030_2.png) [@Tibby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tibby)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2023, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999/102 "2023-07-14T03:15:04Z")
Cleopatra ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2023, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999/103 "2023-07-14T03:33:12Z")
Derek Bentley Timothy Evans Ruth Ellis Three controversial cases that helped abolish the death penalty in the UK. Bentley and Evans were innocent, and Ellis arguably should have received clemency. ---
**Author:** ![Jay\_Z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Jay\_Z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jay_Z)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2023, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999/104 "2023-07-14T04:51:36Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > I think of it as just a sad ending to a very defining life. I remember her movie roles and the stories of her life. She was a highly recognized superstar before her death. However, as time goes by it is her death that more and more people will remember. Her movies are old, conspiracy theories about her death abound. I suppose eventually anyone who doesn’t die of natural causes may only be defined by their death at some point in the future. She’s still one of the most recognizable images. That image has nothing to do with her death. The ones where the person is only famous because of how they died don’t belong on the list. Garry Hoy, Kitty Genovese. This thread is about famous people who died. They weren’t famous. ---
**Author:** ![Tatterdemalion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/43a26b/32.png) [@Tatterdemalion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tatterdemalion)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2023, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999/105 "2023-07-14T05:05:47Z")
> [@Si\_Amigo](#): > > Elvis died on the toliet. Was big news at the time. King falls from throne. Lisa Marie Presley just died of complications of weight loss surgery. That will define her, I think. ---
**Author:** ![Tibby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tibby/32/17030_2.png) [@Tibby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tibby)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2023, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999/106 "2023-07-14T05:20:10Z")
…and of course Gaius Julius “_Ides of March_” Caesar ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2023, 9:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999/107 "2023-07-14T09:01:19Z")
Harvey Milk ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2023, 9:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999/108 "2023-07-14T09:40:40Z")
Peter Gusenberg, Frank Gusenberg, Albert Kachellek, Adam Heyer, Albert Weinshank, Reinhardt Schwimmer, and John May. I was just watching a movie about the circumstances surrounding their deaths. They were the victims of the St. Valentine’s Day Massacre. The first five were members of Bugs Moran’s North Side Gang. ---
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2023, 10:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999/109 "2023-07-14T10:03:52Z")
> [@ZipperJJ](#): > > Princess Diana? I was going to say this, but on reflection, I don’t think so. She certainly had a famous death, but I think her fame in life surpasses it ---
**Author:** ![Jay\_Z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Jay\_Z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jay_Z)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2023, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999/110 "2023-07-14T12:23:34Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > Peter Gusenberg, Frank Gusenberg, Albert Kachellek, Adam Heyer, Albert Weinshank, Reinhardt Schwimmer, and John May. I was just watching a movie about the circumstances surrounding their deaths. These are famous people? ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2023, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999/111 "2023-07-14T12:42:49Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > Buddy Holly I’d say Buddy Holly is still more known as an artist than a crash victim. The other musicians on the plane however the Big Bopper and Richie Valens are definitely defined by the fact that they died on a plane with Buddy Holly. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2023, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999/112 "2023-07-14T12:46:13Z")
> [@Tibby](#): > > and of course Gaius Julius “_Ides of March_” Caesar I’d still say he’s better known as well Caesar (I mean its not like his literal name is used to mean someone who got stabbed), though being stabbed probably comes a close second. Slightly more obscure but the [Gracchi](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gracchi_brothers) probably count as the OP ---
**Author:** ![dirtball](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dirtball/32/18772_2.png) [@dirtball](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dirtball)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2023, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999/113 "2023-07-14T12:47:35Z")
Emmett Till would have to qualify here. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2023, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999/114 "2023-07-14T12:50:39Z")
Other recent victims of political assassinations probably count: Salvador Allende Patrice Lumumba Mohammad Mosaddegh I’d challenge you\* to name any one of their political actions or policies other than their assassinations. - by “you” I mean average person not on the Dope, your average doper could probably give a thesis on their political policies 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2023, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999/115 "2023-07-14T12:54:46Z")
[Moderating] OK, that’s your reaction to the mod note? I wasn’t sure before, but I am now: This is an official Warning for unnecessary crudeness. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2023, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999/116 "2023-07-14T12:58:04Z")
Great White guitarist [Ty Longley](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ty_Longley) is definitely more known as a victim of the Great White nightclub fire than a musician. ---
**Author:** ![Tibby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tibby/32/17030_2.png) [@Tibby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tibby)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2023, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999/117 "2023-07-14T12:58:16Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > I’d still say he’s better known as well Caesar (I mean its not like his literal name is used to mean someone who got stabbed), though being stabbed probably comes a close second. I dunno, when I think of Julius, the image that comes to my mind first is that of a gang of street thugs coming at a middle-aged man with shivs. And when I think of Cleopatra, [this image](https://i.pinimg.com/736x/d2/8a/ba/d28aba91f8646af067ba44be826b3cd6--betty-white-beautiful-people.jpg) comes to mind. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2023, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999/118 "2023-07-14T13:02:06Z")
Cleopatra, maybe. But my first association with ol’ Gaius is “Veni, vidi, vici”. Both the speech, and the conquests it was referencing. Next after that is probably the crossing of the Rubicon. ---
**Author:** ![songsoflovetrouble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9dc877/32.png) [@songsoflovetrouble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/songsoflovetrouble)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2023, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999/119 "2023-07-14T13:06:25Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > I don’t think this is true. There are few deaths more embarrassing than “autoerotic asphyxiation”, I can’t imagine anyone makes that up. Are drugs sometimes involved? No doubt. But it would be called a drug death if that was what actually killed them. Michael Hutchence was the one discussed above, that was a suicide where his ex-girlfriend thought she could get some money from the press by concocting the autoerotic asphyxiation story. Almost the exact same thing happened with David Carridine. I’m sure there have been some cases of “people involved in weird sexual behaviors taking no precautions and hanging themselves from curtain rods instead of doing it in a safer way, accidentally killing themselves, and then having former girlfriends who coincidentally need money reveal for purely altruistic reasons that they had always been into autoerotic asphyxiation despite no one else ever hearing about it” but the vast majority of the time that’s not what it actually is. The list of “people in denial about overdoses” is almost too long to count but two celebrities that come to mind are Brittany Murphy and her “toxic mold” problem and Mitch Hedberg and his “congenital heart defect.” ---
**Author:** ![Tibby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tibby/32/17030_2.png) [@Tibby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tibby)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2023, 1:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999/120 "2023-07-14T13:08:56Z")
True, but the assassination of Caesar triggered civil wars that eventually led to the end of the Roman Republic and the rise of the Roman Empire. A pretty momentous occasion. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/deaths-that-sort-of-define-a-person/986999.md?page=7)