# Debate: You can't say anything "of substance" on this board **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 4, 2023, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312 "2023-02-04T19:35:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2023, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312/141 "2023-02-06T15:52:28Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > Not trying to argue with you, I just want to humbly defend the Pit, because I think it serves useful purposes. There are certainly elements of nastiness here, but there are also perfectly civil discussions like this one and many others like it, the only difference from the rest of the board being the ability to speak more freely which some of us actually find refreshing. It certainly hasn’t turned into a cesspool of all-around nastiness as you seem to imply would happen, and I’d respectfully point out that you yourself find the Pit useful enough that you obviously read it and have posted in it at least a dozen times. No argument there. But there are some rules even in the pit, and I would argue that the culture of the rest of the board has a lot of influence there as well. Most of the time, the people who get jumped on in the pit are those who double down on the stupid or repulsive arguments that got them there in the first place. It’s highly predictable that way. If you are unwilling to stand corrected, the Dope can be a very unpleasant place. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2023, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312/142 "2023-02-06T15:52:34Z")
I think E is the nominative, like he or she. Em is the objective, like him or her. And, there’s one that’s possessive. I have a hard time following that poster’s posts sometimes. I wish E would give up on that quixotic quest and just go with “they”, “them”, “their”. > [@MrDibble](#): > > My daughters have never said “bruh” in their lives. I’m utterly shocked that your kids in South Africa use different slang than some American kids. Here’s my shocked face: 😲 ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2023, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312/143 "2023-02-06T16:05:03Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > It’s fortunate, then, that I never thought and never said that “patriarchal forces are the natural order”. It was implicit in you suggesting that the status quo _is_ the natural order. > [@wolfpup](#): > > And ISTM that throwing around this “patriarchy” tangent is both ridiculous and totally misses my point. Convenient that the major underpinning of my argument represents a tangent for you… > [@wolfpup](#): > > First of all, this is not 1950, it’s the 23rd (or 24th, if you prefer) year of the 21st century.[…]at least half a century out of date. Oh, I forgot we won over patriarchy… silly me, I must have imagined the overturn of Roe v. Wade. The forces of patriarchy still control women’s _actual_ bodies, and you’re dumb enough to think _language_ is out of their reach? One of us _is_ “beyond ludicrous”, but it’s the one currently residing in Cloud Cuckoo Land You were better off just dropping out of this discussion, like you _said_ you were doing a while ago, remember? > [@wolfpup](#): > > The point that I’m making – and the distinction that I’m drawing – is between language change that arises as the result of undirected evolution such as gradual shifts in meaning of words and phrases, and language change that is directed by vested interests that is, in effect, a form of artificial language engineering. There’s no such thing. That a group is open and active in changing, in no way renders it any more sinister or less “natural” than some underground or “spontaneous” changes - like those _aren’t_ as driven by politics and social forces. Unless the agents calling for language changes are robots, it’s “beyond ludicrous” to privilege one kind of language change over any other as somehow more legitimate or more authentic. It’s linguistic hipsterism, and it’s stupid. > [@wolfpup](#): > > What am I supposed to call it now, a “differently-abled” phone or printer? “Hamstrung” conveys the idea quite well - better than “crippled”, because hamstringing is deliberate, like the software/hardware practice. “Crippled” can be deliberate, congenital or accident. > [@wolfpup](#): > > the idea that a person with disabilities would be offended by the use of the word “crippled” to refer to an IBM line printer strikes me as absurd. And yet there _are_ people with disabilities who _do_ object to that usage. But fuck their “absurd” feelings, amirite? > [@wolfpup](#): > > to those of us **who tend to be conservative about artificially imposed changes to language**. Aah, language Luddites. Well, I don’t give a fig for that, since the distinction being drawn is bullshit that favours entrenched power systems. Fuck that noise. > [@RitterSport](#): > > I’m utterly shocked that your kids in South Africa use different slang than some American kids. “[Bru](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/bru#English)”, though, is perfectly valid SA slang - _for a dude_. Its usage tracks very closely with bro, bra, brah or bruh. Except, apparently, with some young American girls. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2023, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312/144 "2023-02-06T16:09:25Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Not too long ago I got busted for not knowing a word was “bad” and here I am again not knowing a word (worse…a letter) that may be fraught with problems. > > Is there a list of these words/phrases/letters we are all supposed to refer to? Can you just explain the thought process that goes into making a post like this? I mean, do you honestly think there’s a fucking list out there, and that you have to be liberal enough to be on the mailing list, and if you’re not you just get shat on until you can figure it out by trial and error? Or maybe, just maybe, you could do a little introspection and realize that if you need a list to explain to you how not to be an asshole, the problem is with you, not with society? This post probably comes across harsher than you really deserve. But this is such a common comment in this sorts of threads, and I’ve never fucking understood the mindset. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2023, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312/145 "2023-02-06T16:15:11Z")
And to actually address YOUR sentiment in a meaningful way, @Whack-a-Mole, this is the healthy, adult way to look at things: > [@puzzlegal](#): > > By the way, despite my misgendering people, I’m still friends with all these people. Accidental misgendering isn’t some horrible sin. It’s like being clumsy and bumping into people. It’s annoying to the person affected, of course. It’s something to attempt to avoid of course. But no one thinks you are a horrible person so long as you try.) ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2023, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312/146 "2023-02-06T16:15:48Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > Or maybe, just maybe, you could do a little introspection Or they could just read the thread they’re performing their performative preemptive bad language martyrdom play in, where the word in question has _already_ been explained. But then we wouldn’t all know how pants-shittingly terrible they find the prospect of accidentally saying the wrong thing, would we? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2023, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312/147 "2023-02-06T16:16:51Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Is there a list of these words/phrases/letters we are all supposed to refer to? > > If this is too much a hijack let me know and I will start another thread. This comes across as entirely too petulant. Was that your intention? Did you feel petulant when writing this? ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2023, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312/148 "2023-02-06T16:17:16Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > Can you just explain the thought process that goes into making a post like this? Sure. I got crucified for using a word a few weeks ago. My use of the word was proper and in line with its definition but it carried some baggage I was unaware of. Many suggested it was near impossible I could be ignorant of its usage but I was. A few others chimed in that they were ignorant too. And now I see a letter…one of only 26…that has baggage using it? I keep getting in trouble with this stuff. Things I would have NO idea are potential trouble. I was truly shocked when I got busted for using a “bad word” that I literally had no idea was bad. I am fairly well read but somehow I keep missing this stuff. So yeah, I want a list. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2023, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312/149 "2023-02-06T16:18:52Z")
Jesus, you’re still smarting over uppity? That is some special kind of fragility you got there. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2023, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312/150 "2023-02-06T16:18:54Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > I got crucified for using a word a few weeks ago Wow! That’s horrible! Are you still up there? How’d you get a hand loose to post to a message board? How much battery is left on your phone? Do you need help? ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2023, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312/151 "2023-02-06T16:19:52Z")
What? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2023, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312/152 "2023-02-06T16:20:29Z")
“Crucified”? Come on, dude. You’re being absurd. Get over yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2023, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312/153 "2023-02-06T16:21:17Z")
A little hyperbole is too much for you? You’re being absurd. Get over yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2023, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312/154 "2023-02-06T16:21:56Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > A little hyperbole is too much for you? Get over yourself. If you respond to mild criticism as if you’re the son of god being tortured to death, it gets in the way of meaningful conversation. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2023, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312/155 "2023-02-06T16:27:07Z")
(FYI: Jesus was not the only person crucified…just letting you know.) ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2023, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312/156 "2023-02-06T16:27:07Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > A little hyperbole is too much for you? You’re being absurd. Get over yourself. Here’s how a rational, functioning adult responds to criticism, when it is pointed out that something they said could be offensive: > [@puzzlegal](#): > > By the way, despite my misgendering people, I’m still friends with all these people. Accidental misgendering isn’t some horrible sin. It’s like being clumsy and bumping into people. It’s annoying to the person affected, of course. It’s something to attempt to avoid of course. But no one thinks you are a horrible person so long as you try.) Here is how you respond to criticism, when it is pointed out that something you said could be offensive: > [@The SDMB needs to have a banned words list](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-needs-to-have-a-banned-words-list/978494): > > In a thread in IMHO about the new Martin Luther King statue in Boston I used the word “uppity.” @puzzlegal put in a mod note saying: I had NO idea that this word had racist baggage associated with it. NONE AT ALL. If you want to say I am stupid…fine. I really did not know. I use the word so rarely I cannot remember ever using it before. Context. Context, context, context. There is no reading of what I wrote that is racist. Instead, the mod saw “a word that is naughty” and pounced … ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2023, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312/157 "2023-02-06T16:27:45Z")
Yup. I think that was a really good thread. Indeed, I think it goes to the OP as a thread where many were saying something “of substance” on this message board. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2023, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312/158 "2023-02-06T16:28:04Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > (FYI: Jesus was not the only person crucified…just letting you know.) Good grief. My days of not taking you seriously have apparently only just begun. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2023, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312/159 "2023-02-06T16:29:56Z")
crucified; crucifying [Synonyms of _crucify_](https://www.merriam-webster.com/thesaurus/crucify) [transitive verb](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/transitive) 1 **:** to put to death by nailing or binding the wrists or hands and feet to a cross 2 **:** to destroy the power of **:** [MORTIFY](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/mortify) crucify the flesh 3 a **:** to treat cruelly **:** [TORMENT](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/torment) b **:** [PILLORY sense 2](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/pillory) **_crucified_ in the press** (bolding mine) Where is Jesus? ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2023, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312/160 "2023-02-06T16:37:37Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > > [@MrDibble](#): > > > > My daughters have never said “bruh” in their lives. > > I’m utterly shocked that your kids in South Africa use different slang than some American kids. Here’s my shocked face: 😲 I hang out with a lot of college students and 30-something’s. I’ve never heard them say “bruh”. That’s because the people i hang out with include a lot of trans and non-binary people, and they try to avoid gendered language for unspecified people. And “bruh” is pretty obviously gendered. My connections are via a liberal university in the northeast. I’m not surprised if kids in another part of the country use different slang. I’d be surprised if other kids who hang out in communities with a lot of people who tend to get hurt by gendered language use “bruh”, though. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/debate-you-cant-say-anything-of-substance-on-this-board/979312.md?page=9)