# Declawing: a big round of applause to West Hollywood **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 23, 2003, 8:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410 "2003-01-23T08:55:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![GOM](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/5f9b8f/32.png) [@GOM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GOM)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2003, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410/81 "2003-01-25T18:07:19Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by erislover \* > \*\*Neither of those are criteria for a maiming. A person whose arm I put through a wood chipper would still be able to live a healthy happy life without pain. It is still a maiming. > > What is it with this word that is so intolerable? \*\* I’m not sure it’s intolerable. I think it’s inaccurate. The person you describe in your example clearly will have reduced function. Major loss of function in fact. A cat that has been declawed does not show any signs of reduced function. They jump fine. They walk fine. They essentially do all the normal cat things except destroy furniture. Once declawed they cannot defend themselves very well, so they should never be allowed outside. Some people keep their cats inside at all times. I think calling it maiming is overkill. .02 P.S. I have never declawed any of my cats, and probably never will. I have had a lot of cats over the years. ---
**Author:** ![Rico](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rico/32/3582_2.png) [@Rico](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rico)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2003, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410/82 "2003-01-25T19:53:22Z")
Folks, I think there is one point that a lot of you have missed: [The City of West Hollywood is only 1.9 square miles!](http://www.losangelesalmanac.com/topics/Cities/ci86.htm) :rolleyes: If a person wants their cat declawed. they can WALK out of the city anad get it done. This is another example of a useless, ineffective law. It’s symbolic only. Oh yes, and IMHO no cat should be declawed, even though Duffy has shredded my hands a few times in play. I’m simply amazed by the number of people that believe this is going to make any difference in the grand scheme of things. ---
**Author:** ![erislover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/71e660/32.png) [@erislover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/erislover)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2003, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410/83 "2003-01-25T20:21:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by GOM \* > **I’m not sure it’s intolerable. I think it’s inaccurate. The person you describe in your example clearly will have reduced function. Major loss of function in fact. A cat that has been declawed does not show any signs of reduced function. They jump fine. They walk fine. They essentially do all the normal cat things except destroy furniture.** If declawing a cat does not reduce any amount of functionality, then it really is unnecessary surgery, wouldn’t you say? A man with only one arm doesn’t show reduced functioning by that reasoning: he can drive, he can eat, he can scratch his nose. He jumps fine. He walks fine. > [@](#): > > Once declawed they cannot defend themselves very well, so they should never be allowed outside. So there _is_ a loss of function! Huh. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2003, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410/84 "2003-01-25T20:38:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by DrDeth \* > \*\* So, yes, I’d say that declawing is not nessesarily “wrong & evil”, but it is something that should not be done routinely, but only in a few special cases. However, too many families just do it without considering more humane alternatives. \*\* I agree with this too. However, my family has had two declawed cats, both siamese. One of them was one of our many “rescued” cats. Before we took him in he’d been abused then abandoned (and abused some more by people on a constuction crew who though it was fun to throw hammers at him. He was minus a fang from that. We got him from the guy on the crew who took the cat away from them.), and was very timid, though very loving. His previous owners had declawed him. The problem was that our other house cat _hated_ him. She was a lot bigger than him, and weighed twice what he did. She decided that it would be fun to scratch him bloody every chance she got. She even demonstrated a new trick, and learned to open door latches so she could go after him. So we had a delemia on our hands. Did we give our poor rescued cat to the shelter, where he would probably been put down due to his advantanced age and not great health, or did we declaw the other cat so she couldn’t hurt him as much? We opted to have her declawed as well. Once she was clawless they no longer fought; they actually became best buddies. We hated to have it done, but it seemed to be the only good solution at the time (had those claw sheaths been around then we probably would have gotten them instead). I wouldn’t declaw another cat, but I don’t regret that we had it done to that particular cat and I can see other cases where it might be better for the cat than being tossed out. YMMV ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2003, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410/85 "2003-01-25T21:30:53Z")
by SC\_Wolf: > [@](#): > > My ex-roomate’s siamese became dramatically overweight overweight after he had her spayed. It’s my understanding that this is fairly common. How much of a negative effect on quality of life do those extra pounds have? Do the health benefits of disease prevention outweigh the health risks of obesity? Cats who have been spayed/neutered do have a higher propensity for putting on pounds. However, that problem can be avoided by feeding the cat reasonable amounts and a proper diet. My spayed kitty keeps pretty trim because I make sure her intake equals her output. This is something any owner should do. Obesity _does_ affect quality of life. But spaying/neutering does not automatically equal a fat cat. In fact, my sister has a spayed female that is down right skinny no matter how much she eats. ---
**Author:** ![tracer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tracer/32/20578_2.png) [@tracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tracer)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2003, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410/86 "2003-01-26T01:37:55Z")
If your cat feels defenseless with its claws removed, couldn’t you just give it a light saber for its birthday or something? ---
**Author:** ![GOM](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/5f9b8f/32.png) [@GOM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GOM)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2003, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410/87 "2003-01-26T18:51:22Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by erislover \* > \*\*1. If declawing a cat does not reduce any amount of functionality, then it really is unnecessary surgery, wouldn’t you say? > > A man with only one arm doesn’t show reduced functioning by that reasoning: he can drive, he can eat, he can scratch his nose. He jumps fine. He walks fine. > > 1. So there _is_ a loss of function! Huh. 😉 \*\* 1. No. I would say it is sometimes necessary but I was rushing my post and worded my sentence poorly, as I often do. Declawing reduces the cat’s capability to inflict destruction on furniture, which I suspect is the primary reason the surgery is done. I have not done a scientific survey on this point. It’s only my opinion. 2. A man with two arms who suddenly loses one will definitely show major reduced function. If he used to enjoy playing baseball, football, the piano or the guitar he would now fairly and accurately described as maimed. A cat with no front claws is not maimed, imo. 3. hahaha Ya got me there! ---
**Author:** ![GOM](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/5f9b8f/32.png) [@GOM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GOM)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2003, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410/88 "2003-01-26T18:58:41Z")
This thread makes me sad. I just realized that I should have declawed one of my previous cats. He was very powerful and would beat up all the other cats in the neighborhood. He even chased away his own brother, who was a beautiful gentle cat. Funny thing about this bully cat is that he was very gentle with a kitten we had at the same time. He would protect him and teach him how to fight, almost in the way a mother cat would do. Perhaps I should have declawed him. Maybe it would have helped. But I’ve never done it to a cat so I never even considered that option at the time. Live and learn… ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2003, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410/89 "2003-01-27T01:35:23Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by zwaldd \* > \*\*I know what a henway is, but what’s a half-cat? \*\* Okay, I know it’s driving you crazy, **zwalddp** , that nobody’s asked you, so I’ll relieve the tension for you: How much does a henway? Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2003, 6:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410/90 "2003-01-27T06:39:19Z")
I suppose it’s an issue of priorities. The single most important factor affecting feline mortality is whether the cat is an indoor, indoor/outdoor, or outdoor cat. “The average life expectancy of an outdoor cat is just two to five years, while an indoor cat may survive for 17 or more years.” [http://www.co.lane.or.us/Animals/indoorCat.htm](http://www.co.lane.or.us/Animals/indoorCat.htm) To the (modest) extent that removing kitty’s toenails is more likely to persuade the owner to keep it indoors, this surgical procedure may very well save kitty lives. But, I must admit, I care little about kitty welfare. What I care more about is the massive damage to the environment caused by non-native species, of which cats are prime perpetrators. [http://www.nana.asn.au/n2-cats.htm](http://www.nana.asn.au/n2-cats.htm) Therefore, anything that can keep the kitties locked up is a good thing in my book. ---
**Author:** ![Mothchunks](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a587f6/32.png) [@Mothchunks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mothchunks)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2003, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410/91 "2003-01-27T15:28:55Z")
How would you like your fingertips cut off to make you furniture-safe? ---
**Author:** ![zwaldd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a9adbd/32.png) [@zwaldd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zwaldd)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2003, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410/92 "2003-01-27T17:33:32Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by DanielWithrow \* > \*\*How much does a henway? \*\* :smack: ---
**Author:** ![xenophon41](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xenophon41/32/253_2.png) [@xenophon41](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xenophon41)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2003, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410/93 "2003-01-27T18:48:31Z")
And “why did the chicken go to the other side of the road?” ---
**Author:** ![erislover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/71e660/32.png) [@erislover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/erislover)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2003, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410/94 "2003-01-27T19:19:29Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by GOM \* > \*\*If he used to enjoy playing baseball, football, the piano or the guitar he would now fairly and accurately described as maimed. \*\* But only then? So a cat who used to enjoy scratching things and stretching out his little digits by digging in claws would be fairly and accurately described as maimed, right? And a guy who didn’t do anything which required two arms wouldn’t be maimed, is that right? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2003, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410/95 "2003-01-27T19:40:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by zwaldd \* > \*\*:smack: \*\* (sorry, **zwaldd** – sometimes I’m a right bastard 🆒) Daniel ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2003, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410/96 "2003-01-27T22:25:29Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by elfkin477 \* > \*\*I agree with this too. However, my family has had two declawed cats, both siamese. We hated to have it done, but it seemed to be the only good solution at the time (had those claw sheaths been around then we probably would have gotten them instead). I wouldn’t declaw another cat, but I don’t regret that we had it done to that particular cat and I can see other cases where it might be better for the cat than being tossed out. YMMV \*\* Well, elfkin & azael- if the world consisted of reasonable dudes who made educated choices like the 3 of us- then laws like these would never even be considered. Of course- you’ll never know that you made the ONLY “right decision”. However- you considered it, weighed the alternatives, and made an informed choice that considered the cat’s welfare & happiness also. That’s all we can do as responsible pet owners. So- yes, you did right. I have never had to declaw a cat- I hope I never have to. But I recognize that sometimes it has to be done. I haven’t had an “outside” or “indoor/outdoor” cat for decades. When I did, we were in rural neighborhood, with little traffic, and it was safer for cats to be outside. Still, 1 out of the 3 cats we had got killed by a car. I likely will not let any cats out again- however, I suppose if I bought a farm for retirement, a few cats kept primarily as outdoor “rodent control” might be a possibility. So- in general I say NO to declawing & outdoor cats. But I keep an open mind. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2003, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410/97 "2003-01-28T01:45:49Z")
Traffic is hardly the only risk that cat face outdoors. Other animals such as dogs, racoons, foxes and other cats can attack them. They are more exposed to diseases such as rabies, feline leukemia, distemper, and feline immunodeficincy virus. Vaccines are not 100% effective and there is no vaccine for FIV. Then there are parasites such as worms, ticks, mites, and fleas. Exposure to pesticides, rodenticides and antifreeze poisons and kills thousands of outdoor cats each year. Cats are maimed and killed in traps set for furbearing animals. It’s a scary world out there. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2003, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410/98 "2003-01-28T01:57:15Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Mothchunks \* > \*\*How would you like your fingertips cut off to make you furniture-safe? \*\* I do not accept the analogy. I believe that you are anthropomorphizing. No biggie, though. Other posters have observed that, following a declawing procedure done when the cat is young, the cat did not appear to lead an unhappy or stressed life. Similarly for flowbark, following his circumcision as an infant. So, unless you can observe enhanced suffering associated with declawing, I say snip away. And keep the cat indoors, where it won’t prey upon birds, lizards, and various native species. \* - (Farm cats a separate issue). ---
**Author:** ![sezyou](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b77776/32.png) [@sezyou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sezyou)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2003, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410/99 "2003-01-28T02:23:21Z")
I understand that West Hollywood is passing a law making male cat circumcision illegal now also. Can’t be maiming those kitties! ---
**Author:** ![tracer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tracer/32/20578_2.png) [@tracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tracer)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2003, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410/100 "2003-01-28T02:38:18Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by DanielWithrow \* > **How much does a henway?** What’s a [segway](http://www.segway.com/)? About 80 pounds. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/declawing-a-big-round-of-applause-to-west-hollywood/150410.md?page=6)