Deconstructing "The Breakfast Club"

Cafe Society
61

I loved the movie as a kid. First saw it when I was about 11. My school never had cliques like the ones averred to in TBC, but I could still recognised the individuals in the film. I can still see them now, as a teacher.

These days I’m slightly more sympathetic to Vernon, the teacher, in some ways, but less in others. (I rewatched the film a couple of years ago).

How would the kids have changed after this experience? Well, change doesn’t always have to be immediate. Quite often, someone will admit they’re wrong about something but take a long time to actually change their behaviour because of it.

OTOH, there was sex involved, and that’s a bloody big motivation when you’re 17 years old (guess at their ages).

Andy and Allison might well have got together at least for a while. Yeah, he probably liked her more at the end because she was pretty, but also because, as he said, ‘I can see your face.’ He wasn’t focusing on the clothes or the hairstyle per se, but on the fact that he could see her face. Not that shallow for a teenage boy, really.

His father probably wouldn’t have been that bothered, unless it meant that Andy spent less time training. Alison could have turned into a hopelessly needy GF who took him away from his training, or she could have been perfect for him - so unused to attention that she let him train as much as he wanted. It didn’t seem like he hated wrestling, only the pressure.

For the rest, the changes would have come about a year or two or even more later. Hell, even just saying ‘hi’ in the corridors would have been a change, from the sounds of it. You can’t underestimate the impact of small changes in behaviour - like distracting your friends who are intent on teasing the smart kid, even if you can’t bring yourself to say ‘he’s my friend’ due to one morning in detention together.

Maybe I’m alone in this, but I liked ALL of the characters in TBC. As a kid I watched it repeatedly and tried to fit myself into the jock, the princess etc moulds. Alison’s character fitted me best, or perhaps Brian’s, with a definite dose of Bender, but I wasn’t exactly far away from the others either.

An aside: in British English, Bender means ‘gay person’ (usually male). The first time I heard his name called in the film I thought he was being derided. Later in the the film, I realised it was just a name, but it still grated on me every time it was said.

62

I’ll cure your feelings of loneliness, I saw it as an adult and hated every moment of it. I thought it was shallow and boring, if I wanted to watch spoiled kids bitch about their rotten lives, I’d have become a school councillor.

I was closer to Ally Sheedy’s character but even I would have taken a WIDE berth around her in the halls.

63

I was Allison. Still am. Ended up marrying a jock, too.

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fuzzypickles: Please note that Trillionaire’s post was from 2005. You’ve resurrected an almost-four-year-old thread. I don’t think Trillionaire is still active on the boards, so he/she will probably never see your comment.

pulykamel: You’re responding to eleanorigby’s post from 2005; she’s still active, but I have no idea whether she’ll read a four-year-old thread to see your comment.

Everyone: Some of the forums here have rules about reviving ancient threads, for exactly this reason. In Cafe Society, we normally don’t care much, so long as the additional comments are on-topic; however, please be aware when you are resurrecting a long-dead thread that you can’t really expect discussion to resume with the same people.

65

For the record, the scene where Claire asks Vernon for change for a fifty was not in the original cut of the movie, and neither was a later scene showing Vernon beating up a vending machine that stole his money. I’ve only seen them on cable. Vernon was more of a one-dimentional authority figure in the original cut.

66

When I first watched this movie, I saw nothing in it that had any connection to my own life. I though it was a ridiculous, fantastical and embellished portrayal of high schoolers, for the simple reason that I did not think any students in high school had any kind of capability for self-analysis comparable to that demonstrated by the characters in the film, and even if they did privately, they wouldn’t have the social confidence to actually sit around talking about it. I thought the whole foundation of the movie was hokum. In real life, the students would have just sat there silently, writing their essays and not talking to each other at all. There weren’t many burnout type guys like Bender at my high school but I’ve had my fair share of experiences with those types; generally, when out of their element, they are silent and affectless, not rowdy and mean.

67

When I first watched TBC, I was a teenager and loved it.

My parents had just obtained a VCR and they asked what movies we’d like to see, so naturally my brother and I insisted on TBC.

My Dad watched it with us and was disgusted. He rooted for, and agreed with, Dick Vernon the whole movie. When Vernon goes off on Judd Nelson with his ‘You want to see something funny? Take a look at him in 5 years, and then see how goddamn funny he is!’ line, I could hear my Dad muttering ‘He’s right. He’s absolutely right.’

My brother and I of course thought Dad was a typical out-of-touch adult buffoon who didn’t get it, much like the characters in the movie spend the whole time insisting that their parents actually are.

But then I watched it again about 5 years ago, at age 35+ and with two kids. And of course, I had turned into my father at that point. I couldn’t stand the petty entitlement of the kids, and how they portrayed all parents and authority figures as hypocritical, overbearing losers. And how they wantonly destroyed school property, which undoubtedly would require a new bond issue in the next round of elections to pay for. Out of my wallet.

What’s worse, at about the same time I watched ‘Meet the Parents’ with a friend of mine and spent the whole time rooting for, and agreeing with, Robert de Niro’s father character. Ben Affleck WAS a loser. He DID lie throughout the whole movie. That in itself would have turned me off to him instantly, if he wanted to marry one of my daughters.

So in summary…Get a haircut, get off my lawn, and for God’s Sake - turn down that noise you call rock-and-roll music! Now!

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I would love to see a sequel where each of them is seen bringing a child to that same scenario, the child being the exact opposite of each of them and seeing how their kids interact with each other.

69

I liked the movie. Yes, the characters were cliche’s. Yes, the teacher was over the top, but not really, because I’ve had a few teachers who were just as bad or worse. But that’s what movies are sometimes. It doesn’t mean that there isn’t a message.

I’d like to point out that this isn’t always an option. I spent five years in a rural public school where guys like Bender were in charge, and it was a fucking nightmare. If anything, Bender was an understatement. He was far more articulate and self-aware than the majority of those headcases, many of whom would have physically assaulted Brian on instinct as soon as Vernon left the room, which, by the way, he would never do in that school. I imagine that quite a few white guys currently gracing the halls of some maximum security gen pop grew up in that sort of environment. I was a stereotypical Brian, and those five years were easily the hardest period of my life. The army was a distant second.

But back to my point. In those sorts of places, the Brians of the world have to be careful. They can’t flaunt it or they’ll get hurt. I’m not talking about their feelings. I’m talking about their safety. In a weird way, it was good for me. I was forced to toughen up and learn how to fight. I got into sports and fitness and got out of my shell. Of course, intellectualism went by the wayside until after I graduated from a different and much more laid back high school, but I believe I’ve caught up. And I’m usually able to not take the minor stuff in life very seriously. But I can still see where Brian was coming from. I can even see where Bender was coming from.

I’m no bleeding heart liberal, but was Vernon right to publicly humiliate a kid less than half his age? Was he right to challenge him to a fight? One didn’t do anything to help the situation, and the other was actually illegal. No, Vernon wasn’t right. I’m currently on a track to teach, and I don’t plan to take any more shit from kids than I absolutely have to, but if I were to even think about losing it like that by letting an idiot like Bender get under my skin (which, I might add, was exactly what Bender was trying to do), I’d know it was time to quit.

I think you’re missing the point of the movie. The kids walked into Saturday school with an air of entitlement. They left a little bit humbled and more broad-minded. Again, sometimes the movie has to portray stereotypes to make a point; it’s under no obligation to include all sides of an argument, especially when it’s trying to tell us something pertinent.

70

Of course. My post was somewhat tongue-in-cheek.

I’ll admit the closet challenge scene was a little disturbing. But what Vernon was doing was what anybody should do, in my opinion, with a loudmouth bully who is actually terrified inside.

Bender mouthed off to him in front of the other kids to show them how ‘tough’ he was, and how willing he was to stand up to authority. But in reality he wasn’t willing to stand up to authority at all. He was doing it to show off.

If he was he really as tough as he thought he was, he would have taken Vernon on in the closet. But Vernon called his bluff and Bender shriveled. I’d like to think that Vernon knew this all along, and actually had no intention of ever fighting him. That’s why he gave him the first shot at his chin, uncontested.

‘That’s what I thought. You’re a gutless turd.’

Vernon was spot on with that remark. He won the battle without ever having to fire a shot.

I thought that was the point that Hughes was trying to make. That while Bender talked tough, it was really to cover up a lot of painful insecurity inside.

God knows I’m not suggesting that teachers physically threaten troublesome students. Or maybe I am. I’m not really sure, to be honest. I went to a private school as a small child where the teachers were allowed to whack the kids if they got out of line. And not many kids got out of line, if ever. The one time I saw a kid mouth off to the teacher he got his ass whacked 10 times with a ping pong paddle. It never happened again.

Go Dick Vernon! Go! You rule, man! And Carl, too!

71

Oh . . . OK, so a high school student acting like a kid and challenging authority (which I agree was stupid and wrong in the circumstances), while breaking rules and acting like a dipshit is wrong.

But an experienced grown-up teacher who presumably knows better and who is supposed to set an example physically threatening said student, who has grown up in an abusive environment and is emotionally unstable is fine? Especially when Bender never physically threatened the teacher? Let me repeat: Vernon made the situation worse, not better. Also, keep in mind that Bender’s problems went way beyond mouthing off to teachers. In the real world, had one of your private school teachers tried to hit a real life Bender with a ping pong paddle or anything else, well . . . They’d have had to import that proctologist from Geneva. And I wouldn’t have felt much sympathy for that teacher.

Suspend Bender. Expel Bender. Report Bender’s parents to CPS. But don’t physically threaten Bender like a high school hood. That’s wrong. And kind of stupid when you reflect on Columbine.

72

You know why Bender was terrified on the inside? Because he was physically abused at home. A teacher’s job in that situation is to reach out to the kid, and get him some help, not be another dickhead man who threatens to hurt him and gets away with it. He may look grown up, but he is a CHILD, and it’s the teacher’s responsibility to look out for all the kids, including the ones who piss you off and have problems.

Yep, and part of a teacher’s job is knowing how to handle kids like that without losing your shit and going down to their level. It’s called being the adult in that situation. When you let a kid like that get to you, you lose.

Maybe he was just a pragmatist and knew that Vernon would lie, as he stated he would. He’d say Bender attacked him and Bender would get suspended or expelled, and then his father would kick the living shit out of him. Vernon abused his power in threatening a child. So no, there was no percentage in Bender taking on Vernon. He would lose no matter what he chose. Vernon’s behavior is unconscionable.

He won a battle with an abused teenager. Yay! What an inspirational and worthwhile victory.

Indeed, with the additional point that Vernon was an asshole who had issues of his own and probably shouldn’t be working with kids, if he’s so easily provoked and resorts to petty bullying and threats, esp. on kids who have very real emotional issues. Obviously Vernon is an insecure person who lacks the coping skills to deal with kids in a productive way. Yes, Bender is a pain in the ass with lots of problems and bad behavior. Rise above it or get into another career field.

:rolleyes: The only place Dick Vernon should be going is to the unemployment office.

Don’t lump Carl in with Vernon.

73

Wow. You guys are taking this pretty seriously.

Fortunately for Vernon, since he’s in a public school system he’s probably tenured and belongs to a union. So anything short of a human sacrifice with one of the kids in the library won’t get him fired anyway. He’ll just get put on ‘paid administrative leave’, or something like that, and get re-assigned to other duties.

74

It’s a subject that’s dear to my heart. The teaching profession, not the movie, though the movie is too.

You know what? Sadly, you’re probably right. I’m not even being sarcastic. I’ve seen teachers behave the way Vernon does, and they tend to get away with it. It pisses me off, because they make it hard for the rest of us to do our jobs and be trusted by kids like Bender.

75

No kidding, with all the schools that have been shot up, I get a little sensitive when someone tells me that it’s OK for a teacher to emotionally abuse and threaten a problem child, especially since I will more than likely be spending a year or two in front of a high school classroom.

Not to mention the fact that it’s wrong!