# Define Porn **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 16, 2011, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826 "2011-10-16T16:32:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Bosstrain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Bosstrain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstrain)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826/21 "2011-10-17T16:31:06Z")
Sexual Training Videos :D. So I guess STV is something you watch before getting an STD :dubious:. A great line from a movie (can’t remember which 'cause I never watched it, just saw a comercial for it): girl: Why don’t they ever make a movie about what happens after the romance. boy: They do, it’s called porn. (paraphrasing) The thing about pornography _is_ that so many people have such vast ideas about what it is. For instance, if a person that lived back in the more extreme Victorian era or even someone from just over a hundred years ago saw how people (mainly women) dressed, they’d instantly have a heart attack, they’d view skirts as pornographic. Porn vs pornograhic has almost taken on a different meaning altogether, it’s in reference more to an explicit film or series of pictures while pornograhic is anything that’s considered risque (or at least that’s the way I see it). My thing is that porn sounds like something harsh, softcore is not porn, it’s arousing, but unless it’s intense, someone’s screaming “F me”, and at the end the chic gets a facial, then it’s not porn (sorry for the vivid description - just be gald I didn’t describe what I really consider porn to be :D, that would be borderline softcore I think simply 'cause most porn is like that). I personally think that too many people live sheltered lives, they need to have their minds exposed to some stuff and have their heads removed from their asses. If violence is allowed on the level that it is, then sexuality needs to also be at that same level, either that or get rid of violent movies and games, one or the other. This strange acceptence of gore and shunning of beauty is pure ‘head in the ground’ behavior and it needs to stop…seriously, I’ve had enough with it (“Okay Bosstrain, we already know you despise gore and love sex, enough already, we get the picture dammit” :D). ---
**Author:** ![Lakai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de0a6/32.png) [@Lakai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lakai)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826/22 "2011-10-17T16:49:48Z")
I don’t see why something either has to be porn or not porn. Why can’t it be a little of both? That’s the problem with making a legal definition for pornography (or obscenity). I define pornography as anything that turns me on, and does little else. This is a highly subjective definition, where everyone is going to have a different opinion. We can all agree on “backdoor sluts 9,” but what about a film like **Showgirls**? Some people might watch it and see a movie with sex and no worthwhile story, while others might be entertained by the story without the sex. I think you can have a movie with a worthwhile story and pornographic scenes. It doesn’t have to be one or the other. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826/23 "2011-10-17T16:53:46Z")
> [@Lakai](#): > > … but what about a film like **Showgirls**? …while others might be entertained by the story without the sex. Really? You think that could happen? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826/24 "2011-10-17T17:51:24Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Really? You think that could happen? Hey, some people are entertained by test patterns. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826/25 "2011-10-17T17:58:32Z")
> [@](#): > > Quoth **Evil Captor** : > I think the outer limits of the range might be, “Can I masturbate to it?”… Not at all. There are plenty of things I can’t masturbate to, but which I still recognize as porn, because I know that a lot of _other_ folks masturbate to it. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstrain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Bosstrain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstrain)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826/26 "2011-10-17T18:31:34Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Really? You think that could happen? I’ve never seen Showgirls of course, but in a movie like that the sex is just to add spice (sometimes to distract people from realizing the story sucks though, or so that men won’t get bored and the ladies can watch without complaints from them). ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826/27 "2011-10-17T18:38:11Z")
Anything i hve to quickly change the channel from when the wife and/or kids walk into the room. ---
**Author:** ![shiftless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9c0ed/32.png) [@shiftless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shiftless)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826/28 "2011-10-17T18:55:38Z")
Any media designed to excite the base instincts with no other purpose. Not that there is anything wrong with that. You may define “base instinct” however you like. I’ve seen “food porn” that does nothing other than excite my appetite. Think a Dove chocolate commercial where attractive (and thin) women coo and moan. It doesn’t teach anything and it doesn’t tell a story, it just makes you hungry. I’ve seen what I would call “torture porn.” Movies like Saw I-XX for example or any of a thousand movies where the hero just has to graphically torture a bad guy to get what he wants. Some people must really like watching torture but need to hide it, so they watch movies like that. Maybe you could call it “revenge porn.” Same with sex porn. At one time they had to pretend there was a story. These days they can get away with no story. So, if the point is to excite you sexually, then its porn IMO. Nothing wrong with that. ---
**Author:** ![devilsknew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4da419/32.png) [@devilsknew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/devilsknew)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826/29 "2011-10-17T19:04:50Z")
As far as I can tell, porn seems to be pictures or film of one or more people engaging in sex or a sex act. It might be “kinky sex”, but sex nonetheless. Don’t really understand why there is such a big deal made about porn, unless it’s the inherent voyeurism that is involved, sort of seeing what everybody does behind closed doors and what everybody has under their clothes. Maybe it offends people’s sense of modesty and privacy? ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826/30 "2011-10-17T19:09:18Z")
> [@Bosstrain](#): > > I’ve never seen Showgirls of course, but in a movie like that the sex is just to add spice (sometimes to distract people from realizing the story sucks though, or so that men won’t get bored and the ladies can watch without complaints from them). Watch it and come back and tell me if you think someone could enjoy that movie without the sex. Don’t bother if you’re not interested in the porn aspect, I wouldn’t wish that on my worst enemy. ---
**Author:** ![SCSimmons](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e495f1/32.png) [@SCSimmons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SCSimmons)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826/31 "2011-10-17T20:37:47Z")
> [@shiftless](#): > > I’ve seen “food porn” that does nothing other than excite my appetite. Think a Dove chocolate commercial where attractive (and thin) women coo and moan. It doesn’t teach anything and it doesn’t tell a story, it just makes you hungry. Fuck. Now I’m hungry _and_ fully erect. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstrain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Bosstrain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstrain)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826/32 "2011-10-17T20:52:51Z")
> [@SCSimmons](#): > > Fuck. Yes, that is generally what we’re talking about here…at least media that contains some form of it :D. (couldn’t help myself) ---
**Author:** ![B.Serum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/b.serum/32/14266_2.png) [@B.Serum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/B.Serum)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826/33 "2011-10-17T23:08:03Z")
> [@MyFootsZZZ](#): > > To me it’s what’s specifically made to get people off… While I think this gets at the core of the matter, the only problem I have with this definition is that requires the viewer to know the intentions of the creator. In most examples this is totally obvious, but not always. When a matter is disputed, do we go on the claims of the creator of the piece in question or some appointed group of people to tell us? That gray area is not so minor either: the fields of “erotica” and glamour photography, to name some of the more obvious, are designed (in part) to arouse, but the nature of these works typically have additional qualities going on as well. For that reason, I tend to think that it is more instructive to use “pornographic” as one of a wide toolkit of descriptors to describe a work than an “on/off state” that determines whether it gets slapped with a single label that nullifies all other facets of the work. So to answer the question, I’d tend to be inclined to label something as porn when the attention paid to titillation dwarfs all other factors that are found in varying degrees in “erotica” (craftsmanship, artistic expression, narrative, social commentary, emotional resonance, etc.) That said, I must say that I found “Cum Guzzling Slut Gang Bang 14” stirred me to my soul on so many levels. ---
**Author:** ![gaffa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e68b1a/32.png) [@gaffa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gaffa)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826/34 "2011-10-17T23:19:20Z")
> [@B.Serum](#): > > So to answer the question, I’d tend to be inclined to label something as porn when the attention paid to titillation dwarfs all other factors that are found in varying degrees in “erotica” (craftsmanship, artistic expression, narrative, social commentary, emotional resonance, etc.) “The difference between erotica and pornography is lighting”. - Gloria Leonard ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2011, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826/35 "2011-10-18T00:02:24Z")
I think it was Harry Browne in [_How I Found Freedom in an Unfree World_](http://www.google.com/#hl=en&sugexp=kjrmc&cp=10&gs_id=v&xhr=t&q=how+i+found+freedom+in+an+unfree+world&pf=p&sclient=psy-ab&source=hp&pbx=1&oq=%22How+I+fou&aq=0&aqi=g4&aql=f&gs_sm=&gs_upl=&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.,cf.osb&fp=18037e6ec7b9ae46&biw=1017&bih=570) who defines porn as “…all the sexual things I love to do, when done by somebody else.” Then there was [Tom Lehrer](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pva35TFiBfI): “As the judge remarked the day that he acquitted my Aunt Hortense, ‘To be smut It must be ut- terly without redeeming social importance or…’ the graphic pictures I adore.” 😃 ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2011, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826/36 "2011-10-18T00:07:18Z")
> [@shiftless](#): > > Any media designed to excite the base instincts with no other purpose. Not that there is anything wrong with that. You may define “base instinct” however you like. > > I’ve seen “food porn” that does nothing other than excite my appetite. Think a Dove chocolate commercial where attractive (and thin) women coo and moan. It doesn’t teach anything and it doesn’t tell a story, it just makes you hungry. > > I’ve seen what I would call “torture porn.” Movies like Saw I-XX for example or any of a thousand movies where the hero just has to graphically torture a bad guy to get what he wants. Some people must really like watching torture but need to hide it, so they watch movies like that. Maybe you could call it “revenge porn.” > > Same with sex porn. At one time they had to pretend there was a story. These days they can get away with no story. So, if the point is to excite you sexually, then its porn IMO. Nothing wrong with that. I’ve seen high-end-lifestyle magazines like _Architectural Digest_ characterized as “plutography.” ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2011, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826/37 "2011-10-18T00:09:53Z")
> [@Lakai](#): > > but what about a film like **Showgirls**? Some people might watch it and see a movie with sex and no worthwhile story, while others might be entertained by the story without the sex. Far as I can tell, most people aren’t entertained by that movie \*with \*the sex :). ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2011, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826/38 "2011-10-18T00:58:20Z")
> [@](#): > > That gray area is not so minor either: the fields of “erotica” and glamour photography, to name some of the more obvious, are designed (in part) to arouse, but the nature of these works typically have additional qualities going on as well. “Erotica” is just a fancy word for “porn that I like”. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2011, 6:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826/39 "2011-10-18T06:41:09Z")
> [@Max\_the\_Immortal](#): > > As mentioned by others already, the purpose of porn is to arouse the viewer. It is not a story, despite any nods to propriety that are tacked on. Porn stars collaborate with one another (and the director and crew) to arouse the viewer, not to tell a story. They have more in common with prostitutes, models, or even athletes than they do with actors. That’s not to say that porn star isn’t a legitimate occupation; that’s a discussion for another time. I’m just saying we shouldn’t call them something they aren’t. I’d say that in porn the story is structured around explicit sex, and in support of showing it, versus non-porn where the sex is in support of the story. But, done right, it can be a story in its own right. The story in **Flesh Gordon** made a lot more sense than the story in the de Laurentis **Flash Gordon** and was a lot more fun, even in the non-porn parts. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2011, 7:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826/40 "2011-10-18T07:28:33Z")
I seem to recall that one of Kurt Vonnegut’s characters defined porn and anything related to bodily hair. Does anyone recall the context of this little snippet of memory? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/define-porn/599826.md?page=3)