# Definition of a patty melt.. **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 27, 2016, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425 "2016-01-27T23:08:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2016, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425/41 "2016-01-28T16:11:10Z")
> [@Happy\_Lendervedder](#): > > I’m sort of a patty melt junkie. In all my 40 years, I have never come across 1000 Island dressing in, on, or anywhere near my sandwich. Me too. If there’s a choice between a burger and a patty melt, I go for the patty melt. (Unless there’s a chili size on the menu.) In California the melts were as described in the OP and reiterated by me and others. In Seattle I’ve encountered patty melts on sourdough, and containing 1000 Island dressing. I had a patty melt in Bellingham a couple/few weeks ago. It was made in the mandatory way… Except they used one of those industrial, frozen, pre-formed patties that have a weird texture and no flavour. Since this was a diner, I expected better. The onion rings were good though. (I put mustard on my onion rings, BTW.) ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2016, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425/42 "2016-01-28T16:21:55Z")
I really need to stop reading these threads on an empty stomach. All I can think of now is a patty melt. I’m gonna break down and make a trip to the grocery store at lunchtime. My waistline will not thank me. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2016, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425/43 "2016-01-28T16:23:38Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > I really need to stop reading these threads on an empty stomach. All I can think of now is a patty melt. I’m gonna break down and make a trip to the grocery store at lunchtime. My waistline will not thank me. IKR? We have rye bread and American cheese. The corner market is just ⅔ of a mile down the road… ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2016, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425/44 "2016-01-28T16:55:07Z")
Ya know, it looks like the Serious Eats guy is also a fan of [Swiss on his patty melt](http://aht.seriouseats.com/archives/2010/10/the-burger-lab-how-to-make-the-ultimate-patty-melt.html), but ends up splitting the difference in the end with his “ultimate patty melt recipe,” using both that and American. I may have to try this Swiss variation after all, as J. Kenji López-Alt rarely steers me wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2016, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425/45 "2016-01-28T17:22:00Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > Ya know, it looks like the Serious Eats guy is also a fan of [Swiss on his patty melt](http://aht.seriouseats.com/archives/2010/10/the-burger-lab-how-to-make-the-ultimate-patty-melt.html), but ends up splitting the difference in the end with his “ultimate patty melt recipe,” using both that and American. I may have to try this Swiss variation after all, as J. Kenji López-Alt rarely steers me wrong. Seriously. As I mentioned earlier, the best patty melt I’ve ever had had both Swiss and American. Try it. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2016, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425/46 "2016-01-28T17:38:00Z")
Swiss with onions doesn’t sound bad. Swiss without onions changes the character of the sandwich. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2016, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425/47 "2016-01-28T17:48:29Z")
> [@Happy\_Lendervedder](#): > > Seriously. As I mentioned earlier, the best patty melt I’ve ever had had both Swiss and American. Try it. OK, I’ll give it a try, but next time. I only ended up buying deli American for today. And the store, with an entire aisle devoted to bread, only has one brand of rye, S Rosen’s (local company, which actually is good), and no marble rye. Goddammit, does no one eat rye anymore? OK, after mulling the OP over some more, because I’m obsessive about this kind of stuff, you can have a patty melt without grilled onions if you don’t like them, but that is a custom request. The default for me is they are on there. I would be disappointed to order a patty melt and find out they come without the onions because, as I intimated above, the beauty of this dish to me is that combo of cheese + patty + caramelized onions + rye. Now, I may be slightly perturbed if the bread is sourdough. I mean, it’s acceptable, but it’s not the default and should be pointed out. And type of cheese, well, as long as it’s all nice and gooey, I don’t care that much. But lack of onions as a default would be breaking the definition for me. I have spent way too much mental time on this question and not enough actually making myself one for lunch. Off I go… ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2016, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425/48 "2016-01-28T17:52:53Z")
I’ve had patty melts with swiss or American and both are fine but I’ve never had one with both but it sounds good. Also the cheese has to be melted on the patty. [Dead Like Me - Patty Melt - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYCTVlxVx0I) ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2016, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425/49 "2016-01-28T17:53:55Z")
For me the definition of a patty melt is burger, cheese, grilled onion on grilled rye bread. Type of cheese could be cheddar, Swiss or American. Can have 1000 Island dressing on it by the most extreme definition. Anything more than that and it ain’t a patty melt. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2016, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425/50 "2016-01-28T19:05:44Z")
> [@Drunky\_Smurf](#): > > I’ve had patty melts with swiss or American and both are fine but I’ve never had one with both but it sounds good. Also the cheese has to be melted on the patty. > > [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYCTVlxVx0I](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYCTVlxVx0I) Hilarious! Never seen that before. When he got to kraut, I was all like _huh?_ Cook set him straight. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2016, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425/51 "2016-01-28T22:34:34Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > Hilarious! Never seen that before. When he got to kraut, I was all like _huh?_ Cook set him straight. 🙂 It was a good show. About a group of grim reapers. They meet each morning at Der Waffle House to get their daily assignments from the cook. He’s not THE cook. He had reaped the cook-guy\* he is talking to in the kitchen and volunteered to take over for a couple of days until they got a new cook. I think it’s on Netflix. \*That’s why from the waitress’ perspective he is talking to no-one. Only the reapers can see the ghosts. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2016, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425/52 "2016-01-28T22:41:06Z")
For the record, the Patty Melt is a SoCal native…invented at Tiny Nailors. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2016, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425/53 "2016-01-28T23:28:21Z")
Huh, looking online, it seems there are a number of sites that claim Swiss is, indeed, the traditional cheese for a patty melt. Huh. Never seen one like that around here. (Nobody seems to argue about caramelized onions, though.) And some do mention the Thousand Island on the side. Hmm. I just can’t imagine serving an already butter-and-fat laden sandwich which a mayo-based dressing. Talk about gilding the lily. We need contrast, people, contrast! ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2016, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425/54 "2016-01-28T23:50:23Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > Talk about gilding the lily. ::irrelevant hijack:: When ever anyone uses this phrase, I can only ever hear [this](http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/gwar/gildedlily.html)…and now it will be stuck in my head the rest of the day… ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2016, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425/55 "2016-01-29T01:50:06Z")
While the authentic version needs rye (or maybe sourdough), I’m okay with someone at home just making a regular grilled cheese with a patty inside and calling it a patty melt. Onions shouldn’t be optional, but I guess they are in that variety. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2016, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425/56 "2016-01-29T02:09:57Z")
What makes it a patty melt is grilled bread, a hamburger patty, and melted cheese. What makes it a _good_ patty melt is the onions and the right kind of bread (rye is ideal, but sourdough would also work). ---
**Author:** ![TBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@TBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBG)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2016, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425/57 "2016-01-29T02:13:47Z")
It’s a burger served on pieces of toasted bread rather than a bun. That’s it. I’ve never had one served on rye or with grilled onions. Y’all be making rules up. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2016, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425/58 "2016-01-29T02:15:39Z")
> [@TBG](#): > > It’s a burger served on pieces of toasted bread rather than a bun. That’s it. I’ve never had one served on rye or with grilled onions. Y’all be making rules up. Then you’ve never had a patty melt. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2016, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425/59 "2016-01-29T02:36:28Z")
> [@TBG](#): > > It’s a burger served on pieces of toasted bread rather than a bun. That’s it. I’ve never had one served on rye or with grilled onions. Y’all be making rules up. I have to agree with my esteemed colleague **silenus** here. American food afficianado [Ed Levine](http://aht.seriouseats.com/archives/2012/04/ed-levines-5-favorite-patty-melts.html) chimes in on Serious Eats re: the patty melt. > [@](#): > > How do I love patty melts? Let me count the ways. > > A regular burger has, at best, a soft, squishy potato roll as a bun. > A patty melt has buttered and grilled rye toast. Edge to patty melt. > A patty melt MUST have either caramelized or griddled onions; on a regular burger any kind of cooked onions are optional and often not even available. > A patty melt’s crispy rye toast exterior means you don’t have to rely on the burger patty’s exterior for any textural contrast. > I am not saying that a great regular cheeseburger on a fresh potato roll is not a beautiful thing, because it is. What I am saying is that a patty melt is a worthy—dare I say elegant—form of burger. That’s my patty melt story and I’m sticking to it. What poor, backward part of the country are you in where patty melts come neither with griddled onions nor on rye bread? Is there a foundation I can donate to to help? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2016, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425/60 "2016-01-29T02:42:21Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > What poor, backward part of the country are you in where patty melts come neither with griddled onions nor on rye bread? Is there a foundation I can donate to to help? 🙂 > [@](#): > > Originally Posted by TBG > Y’all be making rules up. “Y’all” would point to the southern backward part of the country. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/definition-of-a-patty-melt/744425.md?page=4)