# Democracy is dead in Georgia **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 9, 2018, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697 "2018-10-09T15:19:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697/281 "2018-10-16T17:10:49Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > As far as priorities, net tax takers should lose the vote before net tax payers. This means welfare queens and their military brethren should lose their vote at the same time. Yer off yer chain. And worse, you’re not really original either. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697/282 "2018-10-16T17:21:41Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > The right to vote should be restricted whenever possible. I’ll say this for you, you’re direct. None of this “I just want to ensure the validity of each vote” nonsense. ---
**Author:** ![Wolf333](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolf333/32/3460_2.png) [@Wolf333](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wolf333)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697/283 "2018-10-16T17:34:35Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > As far as priorities, net tax takers should lose the vote before net tax payers. This means welfare queens and their military brethren should lose their vote at the same time. Also, many rich people. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![Railer13](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/railer13/32/9742_2.png) [@Railer13](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Railer13)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697/284 "2018-10-16T17:38:29Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > …net tax takers should lose the vote before net tax payers. So all of the Seniors who are subsisting solely on Social Security should be at the top of the “you don’t get to vote list”? Makes perfect sense. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697/285 "2018-10-16T17:56:54Z")
> [@E-DUB](#): > > There needs to be an equivalent of Godwin’s law for stupid sports metaphors. Believe me we _all_ understand how the Elector College works. We learned that in 2000, with a refresher course in 2016. We just feel it an unfair and outmoded institution. Then say that, instead of saying how the President didn’t get a majority of the popular vote. That, at least, would be a arguably relevant data point, although since it’s not going to change, it’s akin to complaining about the weather. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697/286 "2018-10-16T17:57:54Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > …unless a sizable proportion of the populace are being prevented or significantly obstructed from expressing their will by voting, in which case it’s not “representative”. See also: Jim Crow laws (again). Who gets to decide what “significantly,” means in the above? You, assisted by the editorial board of Mother Jones, perhaps? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697/287 "2018-10-16T18:01:34Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > You’re right, the president who won a majority of electoral votes should indeed get to see his or her Supreme Court nominees get hearings and confirmation votes from the Senate. Yes, I agree. And I said it at the time. I’ve said it repeatedly since. The Senate should have given him a vote, and if I had been a senator, I would have voted to confirm him. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697/288 "2018-10-16T18:02:41Z")
> [@Eonwe](#): > > That’s a nice philosophical sentiment, but practically we know that this is false. You cannot infer that, because the government is elected, all governmental actions align with the people’s wishes. Sure you can, because that’s the definition of sovereign power in a representative democratic republic. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697/289 "2018-10-16T18:16:51Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Yes, I agree. And I said it at the time. I’ve said it repeatedly since. The Senate should have given him a vote, and if I had been a senator, I would have voted to confirm him. Well, this demonstrates that you can recognize bad behaviour from Republicans at least SOME of the time. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697/290 "2018-10-16T18:29:30Z")
I think it is fair to say that Jim Crow laws were generally representative of the will of the majority, as well as being legally imposed by a representative democratic republic. ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697/291 "2018-10-16T20:17:16Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Sure you can, because that’s the definition of sovereign power in a representative democratic republic. No, you really can’t. We elect someone. That someone then punches kittens. It does not follow that “it was the people’s will that kittens be punched.” If it did, that would require perfect foresight into all of the things that elected representatives might do and not do. There’s a difference between “our elected officials receive their power from the electorate” and “everything our elected officials do is the will of the people.” If you want to infer that politicians are enacting the “will of the people,” you might be more justified in doing so by considering their votes _after_ the politicians do something as opposed to _before_. When you prevent people from voting, however you close that feedback loop, and prevent yourself from knowing what the “will of the people” is. I think, though, that I’m not telling you anything you don’t know. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697/292 "2018-10-16T22:06:50Z")
> [@Eonwe](#): > > I think, though, that I’m not telling you anything you don’t know. You misspelled _want to_. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2018, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697/293 "2018-10-16T22:12:04Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Then say that, instead of saying how the President didn’t get a majority of the popular vote. That, at least, would be a arguably relevant data point, although since it’s not going to change, it’s akin to complaining about the weather. Why would you want him to say that, when that would simply be a distraction from the conversation… Oh, right, because it would be a distraction from the conversation, and that is the exact reason why you created that irrelevant tangent. Carry on. ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697/294 "2018-10-17T14:24:35Z")
Not directly related to the OP, but an in-kind action: [Afraid that black senior citizens might vote for Democrats, Jefferson County GA officials “felt uncomfortable with allowing senior center patrons to leave the facility in a bus with an unknown third party,” and so asked that those voters not be taken to the polls.](https://politics.myajc.com/news/state--regional-govt--politics/black-senior-citizens-ordered-off-georgia-bus-taking-them-vote/42lZxIGOF1uFo637TEc9jP/) ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697/295 "2018-10-17T16:41:06Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Then say that, instead of saying how the President didn’t get a majority of the popular vote. That, at least, would be a arguably relevant data point, although since it’s not going to change, it’s akin to complaining about the weather. But not winning the popular vote does carry significance beyond that of pointing out how the EC thwarts democracy. It means that persons elected in that fashion can _not_ claim a “mandate” or “the will of the people” or any such bullshit. They have permanent asterisks next to their names. At some level even trump understands this himself, hence the “three million illegal votes” horse hockey he was pushing there for a while. ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697/296 "2018-10-17T18:56:00Z")
> [@Eonwe](#): > > Not directly related to the OP, but an in-kind action: > > [Afraid that black senior citizens might vote for Democrats, Jefferson County GA officials “felt uncomfortable with allowing senior center patrons to leave the facility in a bus with an unknown third party,” and so asked that those voters not be taken to the polls.](https://politics.myajc.com/news/state--regional-govt--politics/black-senior-citizens-ordered-off-georgia-bus-taking-them-vote/42lZxIGOF1uFo637TEc9jP/) I came to post this as well. > [@](#): > > “We knew it was an intimidation tactic,” Brown said Tuesday. “It was really unnecessary. These are grown people.” What the actual fuck? ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2018, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697/297 "2018-10-18T04:11:56Z")
Keeps getting better in Georgia: > [@](#): > > Early voting in Georgia for the 2018 general election just kicked off on Monday, but already the state has rejected close to 600 absentee ballots or applications for an absentee ballot. > > One culprit? > > State laws that require election officials to reject all absentee ballots and absentee ballot applications if they believe that signatures within the voter’s paperwork do not match each other. > > The elections’ officials making these determinations do not have any formal education or training to analyze people’s handwriting, and are not given any unifying instructions on what should constitute a mismatch. It’s left entirely up to them, a layperson. Georgia does not notify voters before their ballots are rejected nor does it provide them an opportunity to contest the determination. > > To throw out someone’s ballot — without any prior notice or chance to appeal — is a clear due process violation. That’s why we, with the ACLU of Georgia, are suing Georgia Secretary of State Brian Kemp and all county registrars on behalf of the Georgia Muslim Voter Project, an organization that will have to divert voter turnout resources into educating the public about the risk of being disenfranchised over handwriting. > > SOURCE: [With 19 Days to Midterms, Georgia Is Rejecting Ballots Over Handwriting](https://www.aclu.org/blog/voting-rights/fighting-voter-suppression/19-days-midterms-georgia-rejecting-ballots-over) ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2018, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697/298 "2018-10-18T05:00:34Z")
Anyone want to bet that there’s a substantial bias in who gets rejected? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2018, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697/299 "2018-10-18T05:08:58Z")
Whats grinding my gears right now is wondering what can be done. We are already seeing levels of brazen insult from Kemp and his minions. The catcher puts on the umpire’s hat and calls the balls and strikes? Huh? Has anyone heard even the flimsiest excuse for this? They are not even blushing, and that worries me. What won’t they do? And what worries me more is thinking that they are pretty sure they are gonna get clean away with it. Say Kemp is a little ahead when the regular ballots are toted up. But the odds are pretty good that all those untidy and disreputable votes in the provisional bag, or whatever category those “held” registrations end up in…suppose he just says, “Fuck you, not gonna count 'em, elections over, I win…” Who can stop him? If a Federal court intervenes, he’ll appeal. If he gets the verdict he wants, we’ll appeal. Supremes don’t _have_ to take the case, or they can genuflect to the sacred principle of state’s rights, and not intervene. Someone please tell me I’m wrong, that they couldn’t openly and transparently steal this election, knowing that it will be found to be legal and Constitutional! Don’t just tell me I’m wrong, tell me why. 'Cause what I see now is a bunch of crooks who aren’t worried about the cops. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2018, 5:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697/300 "2018-10-18T05:55:26Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Who can stop him? If a Federal court intervenes, he’ll appeal. If he gets the verdict he wants, we’ll appeal. Supremes don’t _have_ to take the case, or they can genuflect to the sacred principle of state’s rights, and not intervene. Someone please tell me I’m wrong, that they couldn’t openly and transparently steal this election, knowing that it will be found to be legal and Constitutional! Don’t just tell me I’m wrong, tell me why. > > 'Cause what I see now is a bunch of crooks who aren’t worried about the cops. Waiting for the conservatives on this board to come in and tell you that everything republicans are doing is legal and what you want are extralegal remedies. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democracy-is-dead-in-georgia/822697.md?page=16)