# Democrat Obstructionism **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 23, 2015, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455 "2015-02-23T23:01:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2015, 10:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455/201 "2015-02-25T10:12:32Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Even if McConell introduces a clean bill, so what? It’s not likely to pass in the House. Which - just so we’re clear about this - would _not_ be Democratic obstructionism. ---
**Author:** ![BigAppleBucky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigapplebucky/32/178_2.png) [@BigAppleBucky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigAppleBucky)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2015, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455/202 "2015-02-25T13:38:12Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > Okay, I’ll bite. From whence do you get the lies and bigotry you spout? Were you born that way, or is it a choice? Frankly, when you sound just like Sean Hannity, we are going to conclude that you either get your opinions from him or you are one of his writers. Maybe your pimp comes into the room and repeats them to you after having them received from his source, that is, Fox News. In any event, if you look like a duck, walk like a duck and quack like a duck, don’t get huffy when we conclude that you are a duck and probably fuck like a duck. Personally I like ducks, particularly in confit. To be fair, it might not be Faux News, it could be hate radio or even the NY Post. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2015, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455/203 "2015-02-25T13:51:41Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > And it really is a useful custom for a new administration to continue defending a lawsuit. It’s all about continuity. Nobody wants a new administration to flush everything down the toilet the minute it gets in office. Well, by that logic, should the Obama administration have defended DOMA? ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2015, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455/204 "2015-02-25T14:01:22Z")
Not flushing _everything_ down the toilet is not the same as not flushing _anything_, and DOMA was a turd. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2015, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455/205 "2015-02-25T14:11:38Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Not flushing _everything_ down the toilet is not the same as not flushing _anything_, and DOMA was a turd. I’m not smart on these matters, but might it also have been the case that DOMA was a turd that might have been upheld? Let’s say you’re a new president defending a case that you personally disagree with. You could drop the case altogether and declare a moral victory, but what if you were 99% confident that your side was going to lose the case. Wouldn’t it make sense to allow the case to continue its way through the court system so that you’d lose and the precedent would then be set? (This may be a fanwank, I’m just throwing it out there.) ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2015, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455/206 "2015-02-25T14:16:14Z")
In that particular case, no - the government had already lost at the trial and intermediate appellate levels so its decision to withdraw the appeal to SCOTUS _would_ have created precedent. Of course, in the end Congress decided to pursue the appeal itself so we ended up with a ruling on the merits anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2015, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455/207 "2015-02-25T14:24:23Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > No, they didn’t originate the policy, and that was not my implication. > > If the Obama Administration didn’t agree with the policy, why did they go before the SCOTUS to defend it? As you said, they didn’t have to. OK. Would you say that the Obama administration was somehow _unique_ in this regard, then, or _unusual_ in the number of unanimous Supreme Court decisions that cut against the position taken as a party or as amicus? See, from my point of view, what you did was mirror a favorite tactic of the idiot Left: they post some screed about Republicans, it’s pointed out that Democrats do the same thing, and then they either shriek “Tu quoque,” like a retarded parrot – inasmuch as they seldom understand exactly what a _tu quoque_ argument is – or they piously invite the starting of another thread, because THAT one is only about the Republican sin. When these idiot leftists do that, they either don’t know, or conveniently ignore, that the clear implication of phrasing the criticism that way is that the sin is alleged to be uniquely or unusually concentrated with Republicans – the implication is that by naming Republicans, it is they, and not so much Democrats, responsible for whatever ill is being criticized. And then they react with baffled anger when this assumption is questioned. Now, as I say, because the SDMB is a generally lefty community, I see this most often as a leftist tactic, and I sometimes delude myself into the belief that the tactic itself somehow arises from leftist belief or practice, or from some moral flaw that places in a leftist the need for intellectual honesty lower than it does for people on the right. But “delude,” is the correct word. That’s obviously completely false, and while I admit I comfort myself with that illusion from time to time, it’s quite simply a stupid illusion to hold. So I suppose some thanks are due you for reminding me that it’s not a flaw of ideology, but of foolishness. Your point was misplaced. Called on it, you have doubled down on the foolishness instead of doing the right thing. You were wrong: the Obama administration has suffered no unusually significant number of rebukes by a unanimous Supreme Court. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2015, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455/208 "2015-02-25T14:28:38Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > How is it possible to “bleat a RW media talking point” when I don’t consume RW media? If you’ve come to your idiotic conclusions on your own then that’s even worse. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2015, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455/209 "2015-02-25T15:21:27Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Why the sudden love of “administrative policy”? I’m quite sure you didn’t agree with it from 2001-2009. > > Even if McConell introduces a clean bill, so what? It’s not likely to pass in the House. Swing and a miss. Twice. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2015, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455/210 "2015-02-25T15:31:27Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Are the Food Network, C-Span, and Days of our Lives (shut up!) part of the RW media? No, but the blogs and websites that feed you your talking points are. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2015, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455/211 "2015-02-25T15:43:00Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > How would you know what media I consume? Jerk. I would genuinely like to know- what is the source of your information? Where do you get your news? What are your favorite news sites and which do you think most trustworthy? Which sites do you read, if any, that you disagree with and/or think are untrustworthy? ---
**Author:** ![DJ\_Motorbike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/90ced4/32.png) [@DJ\_Motorbike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DJ_Motorbike)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2015, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455/212 "2015-02-25T15:51:59Z")
I hope no resolution can be found. Fuck the DHS. Shut the fucker down forever. With any luck Harry Reed and Mitch McConnell kill each other over it. How much better could it get? Gridlock is a wonderful thing. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2015, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455/213 "2015-02-25T15:57:58Z")
I know everyone hates the DHS, but it does serve some pretty important functions. Like, I dunno, controlling all points of entry to the country. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2015, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455/214 "2015-02-25T16:02:45Z")
DHS gets a bad rap because everyone hates the TSA and the current implementation of the Border Patrol. The Secret Service may have proven themselves inept lately but I don’t think they need to get shut down. The US Coast Guard seems like a stand up organization, and the various immigration and customs offices are probably necessary. Unfortunately, I heard that something like 80% of all DHS employees are considered essential, so even if they’re shut down the TSA and Border Patrol will continue to operate. So will ICE, the Secret Service, and the Coast Guard. All of those folks will have to work without pay, even the ones we like, and the shutdown will only affect poor office schlubs who we probably have no beef with. ---
**Author:** ![DJ\_Motorbike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/90ced4/32.png) [@DJ\_Motorbike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DJ_Motorbike)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2015, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455/215 "2015-02-25T16:05:12Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > I know everyone hates the DHS, but it does serve some pretty important functions. Like, I dunno, controlling all points of entry to the country. They suck at that job. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2015, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455/216 "2015-02-25T16:20:47Z")
> [@Steve\_MB](#): > > Spin Fail. > > Reality: The Republicans (who are in charge, and thus fully responsible for what happens) keep having snit fits and attaching poison pills to DHS funding bills. I don’t know what poison pills you are talking about but I’m going to take a wild guess that its either repealing Obamacare, tax cuts or abortion (they kind of gave up on gay marriage a while ago). ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2015, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455/217 "2015-02-25T16:32:27Z")
> [@DJ\_Motorbike](#): > > They suck at that job. So, open borders are better? ---
**Author:** ![DJ\_Motorbike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/90ced4/32.png) [@DJ\_Motorbike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DJ_Motorbike)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2015, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455/218 "2015-02-25T16:38:58Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > So, open borders are better? Um. Yeah, that’s what we have now. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2015, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455/219 "2015-02-25T16:39:24Z")
Um. No. ---
**Author:** ![DJ\_Motorbike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/90ced4/32.png) [@DJ\_Motorbike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DJ_Motorbike)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2015, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455/220 "2015-02-25T16:54:00Z")
> [@andros](#): > > Um. No. Oh, so there aren’t millions of people here illegally. Good, then I suppose this whole amnesty business isn’t important. The Democrats can stop blocking passage of the bill then. DHS has done its job. There are no open borders. There is nobody to give amnesty to. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-obstructionism/713455.md?page=12)