# Democrat vs. democratic **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 2, 2019, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846 "2019-02-02T17:40:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![shinnen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c77e96/32.png) [@shinnen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shinnen)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846/1 "2019-02-02T17:40:15Z")
In my understanding ‘Democrat’ is a member of a political party, and democratic is an adjective describing a political system. Yet most people refer to the Democrats as democratic, which they surely are, just as are the Republicans. Do I have this wrong? Is the proper name for the political partly “the Democratic Party”? Thanks, … john ---
**Author:** ![Littleman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ccd318/32.png) [@Littleman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Littleman)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846/2 "2019-02-02T17:43:15Z")
Well according to dictionaries democratic is both a system or realting to the democratic party, so I guess it’s meaning is defined by context in that case. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846/3 "2019-02-02T17:46:27Z")
Democrat is a noun and Democratic is an adjective so proper usage says the name of the organization is the Democratic Party. That said, I don’t see it as a huge issue. I wouldn’t have a problem with calling it the Democrat Party. We’ve had organizations like the Free Soil Party and the Constitution Party so using a noun as an adjective in a title is no big deal as far as I’m concerned. But some people feel it is a big issue. They feel that calling it the Democrat Party is an intentional insult and they will protest when it’s done. I feel this is just wasting energy on a trivial issue and that getting people to do so may be the intent behind those who do it. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846/4 "2019-02-02T17:56:52Z")
> [@shinnen](#): > > …most people refer to the Democrats as democratic… > [@Littleman](#): > > Well according to dictionaries democratic is both a system or realting to the democratic party… As a stylistic matter, I think I’d capitalize whenever the adjective relates to the party rather than ideological principles. \*Do you favor the Democratic candidate? Do you support Democratic policies on education? Do you believe in democratic principles, or would we be better off as a monarchy? Was the Democratic primary democratic? \* ---
**Author:** ![engineer\_comp\_geek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/engineer_comp_geek/32/504_2.png) [@engineer\_comp\_geek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/engineer_comp_geek)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846/5 "2019-02-02T17:59:22Z")
Confusingly, the Democratic Party was originally the Democratic-Republican party. It was founded by Thomas Jefferson and James Madison, among others. The Democratic-Republican party fractured a bit in the 1820s, and the modern Democratic Party evolved out of that. You might think that the Republican Party also came out of this fracture, but it didn’t. The modern Republican Party didn’t start until several decades later (1850s) and was formed by abolitionists and former Whig Party members (mostly industrialists who favored modernization, along with supporting protestant religions). Initially, in the U.S. you had the Democrat-Republican Party and the Federalist Party, and a few small parties. After some chaos in the 1820s, it settled down into the Democratic Party and the Whig Party (and again some smaller parties). The issue of slavery split the Democratic Party, the Whig Party collapsed, and after the confusion of the Civil War era, things settled down into the modern Democratic and Republican parties dominating. While people often refer to our entire political system as being democratic, republicanism is also a major part of our political system. From the wikipedia article on republicanism: > [@wikipedia](#): > > Modern republicanism[1] is a guiding political philosophy of the United States that has been a major part of American civic thought since its founding.[2] It stresses liberty and unalienable individual rights as central values, making people sovereign as a whole; rejects monarchy, aristocracy and inherited political power, expects citizens to be virtuous and faithful in their performance of civic duties, and vilifies corruption.[3] American republicanism was articulated and first practiced by the Founding Fathers in the 18th century. For them, “republicanism represented more than a particular form of government. It was a way of life, a core ideology, an uncompromising commitment to liberty, and a total rejection of aristocracy.”[4] Since Jefferson, Madison, et al. chose to name their party after these two principles, and the modern Republican Party also chose to name their party after one of them, there will always be some confusion when talking about both the principles and the parties. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846/6 "2019-02-02T18:04:19Z")
I see Wikipedia has an article on the phrase [“Democrat Party”](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democrat_Party_(epithet)) > [@](#): > > **Democrat Party** is an epithet for the Democratic Party in the United States, used in a disparaging fashion by the party’s opponents. While historical and occasional current usage includes non-hostile appearances (including from within that party), the term has grown in its negative use since the 1940s, in particular by members of the Republican Party—in party platforms, partisan speeches, and press releases—as well as by conservative commentators. While there is grammatical argument regarding the propriety of use of both of the terms, with ending and without, ongoing use of the shortened term for political ends is a source of irritation to members of the Democratic Party. And so, in answer to the OP’s question: Yes, “the Democratic Party” is the proper name for that party. (I suspect, though, that some confusion may be engendered by the fact that “Republican” is both the noun and the adjective for that party.) ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846/7 "2019-02-02T18:05:36Z")
I think the distinction is made by Republicans because they don’t want to be seen to oppose the concept of democracy and their opponents to be synonymous with it. Being “a Democrat politician” sounds more partisan than “a democratic politician”. Still there is worse ambiguity about term Republican. When I see something on my Facebook wall about “a Repubican” it can mean a member of the GOP, someone who wants to abolish the British monarchy, or someone who wants Northern Ireland to leave the UK and join the Republic of Ireland. I have all three kinds of republican on my Facebook wall. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846/8 "2019-02-02T18:15:14Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > As a stylistic matter, I think I’d capitalize whenever the adjective relates to the party rather than ideological principles. On reflection - I think this works fine for Democratic/democratic, because the concept of a democracy (and the corresponding uncapitalized adjective democratic) is quite well defined independent of local party political considerations. I think we can talk of “democratic principles” without reference to party politics. But I don’t think there’s any corresponding meaning for what republic / republican (uncapitalized) would mean outside of party politics - it would depend very much on context. I’m not really sure when (if ever) it would be appropriate to use it uncapitalized. ---
**Author:** ![shinnen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c77e96/32.png) [@shinnen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shinnen)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846/9 "2019-02-02T18:22:06Z")
OK then. I had NO idea these these terms were so controversial and fraught with implications. I think I’ll just leave this one alone:o. Thank you all for your explanations. … john ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846/10 "2019-02-02T18:53:58Z")
In the 1800s, the Democratic Party often referred to itself as the “Great Democracy”. As if they and only they really were what America was all about. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846/11 "2019-02-02T19:56:38Z")
I once got pitted here for saying, ‘People can vote Democrat’. Apparently I was supposed to say they can vote Democratic. In any event, you should call people what they want to be called, so I try to use the right form, but it still doesn’t sound right to me all the time - and it sure feels like someone is going way out of their way to find offense when they complain about it. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846/12 "2019-02-02T20:10:34Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > I see Wikipedia has an article on the phrase [“Democrat Party”](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democrat_Party_(epithet)) > And so, in answer to the OP’s question: Yes, “the Democratic Party” is the proper name for that party. > > (I suspect, though, that some confusion may be engendered by the fact that “Republican” is both the noun and the adjective for that party.) Yeah, well, that’s Wiki, which can be “edited” by anyone. I have been a lifelong Democrat, and I have never heard “Democrat party” as a pejorative. “DemocRAT” (or “Democrat”) yes, and “DemonRat” once, but never just “Democrat”. It does engender some riled up posting here once in a while. IMHO, both are just fine, and “Democrat party” has historical use also. Never let your \*foes \*decide what is and what is not a pejorative or a proper name for your group. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846/13 "2019-02-02T20:12:16Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > I once got pitted here for saying, ‘People can vote Democrat’. Apparently I was supposed to say they can vote Democratic. In any event, you should call people what they want to be called, so I try to use the right form, but it still doesn’t sound right to me all the time - and it sure feels like someone is going way out of their way to find offense when they complain about it. I am fine with either, and since I was actually a candidate once and have likely been a Democrat longer than most here, you are not offended me. The ones who offend me are those who make a big deal out of it. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846/14 "2019-02-02T20:15:13Z")
> [@engineer\_comp\_geek](#): > > Confusingly, the Democratic Party was originally the Democratic-Republican party. It was founded by Thomas Jefferson and James Madison, among others. The Democratic-Republican party fractured a bit in the 1820s, and the modern Democratic Party evolved out of that. Jefferson’s party was the Republican Party. The Republican Party split into the National Republicans and Democratic-Republicans. The Democratic Party evolved from the Democratic-Republicans. My understanding is that modern sources anachronistically apply the name “Democratic-Republican” all the way back to Jefferson as a matter of convenience, to avoid confusion with the Republican Party founded in the 1850s. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846/15 "2019-02-02T21:18:30Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Yeah, well, that’s Wiki, which can be “edited” by anyone. I have been a lifelong Democrat, and I have never heard “Democrat party” as a pejorative. “DemocRAT” (or “Democrat”) yes, and “DemonRat” once, but never just “Democrat”. No, it’s Wikipedia, which is part of the Mediawiki group along with Wikiquote, Wiktionary, Wikimedia Commons, etc. It is a wiki, but it’s not “Wiki”. As long as we’re discussing what to call things. The article is pretty well-sourced, do you dispute them as well? It’s not just something an anonymous person made up and posted online. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846/16 "2019-02-02T21:33:28Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > No, it’s Wikipedia, which is part of the Mediawiki group along with Wikiquote, Wiktionary, Wikimedia Commons, etc. It is a wiki, but it’s not “Wiki”. As long as we’re discussing what to call things. You’re not the first to make this theoretical argument. But the world seems to have settled on the abbreviation, and I’m not really sure why it’s undesirable. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846/17 "2019-02-02T21:56:10Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > You’re not the first to make this theoretical argument. But the world seems to have settled on the abbreviation, and I’m not really sure why it’s undesirable. I wonder if this is a whoosh, and **Atamasama** was trying to draw a parallel between shortening “Democratic” to “Democrat” and shortening “Wikipedia” to “Wiki”? ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846/18 "2019-02-02T22:03:32Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > You’re not the first to make this theoretical argument. But the world seems to have settled on the abbreviation, and I’m not really sure why it’s undesirable. Because it’s GQ on the Straight Dope MB and we don’t want to spread misinformation. Here’s a good explanation of what a wiki is. > **[What Is a Wiki?](https://computer.howstuffworks.com/internet/basics/wiki.htm)** > > The basic idea behind any wiki is very simple: It's a collection of articles that multiple users can add to and edit freely on-line. Learn all about wikis and the communities that keep them alive. Now there is a real web site called Wiki, it’s here: [http://wiki.c2.com](http://wiki.c2.com) It’s the first wiki on the web and the only one with the name Wiki. Just doing my part to fight ignorance. ---
**Author:** ![snoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/43a26b/32.png) [@snoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snoe)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846/19 "2019-02-02T22:17:27Z")
Hendrik Hertzberg had a good piece on “Democrat Party” [back in 2006.](https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2006/08/07/the-ic-factor) Short excerpt: > [@](#): > > There’s no great mystery about the motives behind this deliberate misnaming. “Democrat Party” is a slur, or intended to be—a handy way to express contempt. Aesthetic judgments are subjective, of course, but “Democrat Party” is jarring verging on ugly. It fairly screams “rat.” At a slightly higher level of sophistication, it’s an attempt to deny the enemy the positive connotations of its chosen appellation. During the Cold War, many people bridled at obvious misnomers like “German Democratic Republic,” and perhaps there are some members of the Republican Party (which, come to think of it, has been drifting toward monarchism of late) who genuinely regard the Democratic Party as undemocratic. Perhaps there are some who hope to induce it to go out of existence by refusing to call it by its name, à la terming Israel “the Zionist entity.” And no doubt there are plenty of others who say “Democrat Party” just to needle the other side while signalling solidarity with their own—the partisan equivalent of flashing a gang sign. Interesting facts from the piece: the history of the usage goes back at least as far as the 1940s; Newt Gingrich and Frank Luntz encouraged its use by elected Republicans in the 1990s/2000s (focus tests showed it was effective); George W. Bush was the first president to use it publicly with any regularity; William F. Buckley didn’t like it. The usage is definitely coded as partisan and, well, anti-Democratic (as well as anti-Democrat). Democrats don’t like it, so it’s a dick move, like deadnaming a trans person or addressing Mitt Romney as “Willard.” The fact that it annoys Democrats also makes it irresistible to [a certain type of person](https://ok-cleek.com/blogs/?page_id=18788). ---
**Author:** ![snoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/43a26b/32.png) [@snoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snoe)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2019, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846/20 "2019-02-02T22:20:37Z")
> [@snoe](#): > > Hendrik Hertzberg had a good piece on “Democrat Party” [back in 2006.](https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2006/08/07/the-ic-factor) Short excerpt… The Wikipedia article cited above had basically all the info in Hertberg’s piece, plus much more. His prose is better, though ;). [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrat-vs-democratic/828846.md?page=2)