# Democratic Party Sues Russia, Wikileaks, Trump Campaign **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [April 20, 2018, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792 "2018-04-20T16:43:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2018, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792/1 "2018-04-20T16:43:00Z")
[This is yet another weird story from this, the weirdest timeline](https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/democratic-party-files-lawsuit-alleging-russia-the-trump-campaign-and-wikileaks-conspired-to-disrupt-the-2016-campaign/2018/04/20/befe8364-4418-11e8-8569-26fda6b404c7_story.html?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-main_dnclawsuit-1105am%3Ahomepage%2Fstory&utm_term=.cf9bfa2d3f43): > [@WaPo](#): > > The Democratic National Committee filed a multimillion-dollar lawsuit Friday against the Russian government, the Trump campaign and the WikiLeaks organization alleging a far-reaching conspiracy to disrupt the 2016 campaign and tilt the election to Donald Trump. > > The complaint, filed in federal district court in Manhattan, alleges that top Trump campaign officials conspired with the Russian government and its military spy agency to hurt Democratic presidential nominee Hillary Clinton and help Trump by hacking the computer networks of the Democratic Party and disseminating stolen material found there. It sounds like in some ways the Democratic suit against Nixon presages this lawsuit–but in my lifetime it’s unprecedented. So I’m curious what the folks here, both the informed and the ignorant-but-like-to-pontificate-anyway, think about the suit. 1. What are its chances of success? 2. What are its implications, in matters such as discovery of new data and/or effect on Mueller et al investigations? 3. Why is the Democratic Party really filing it? ---
**Author:** ![dalej42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@dalej42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalej42)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2018, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792/2 "2018-04-20T16:47:34Z")
#3 is all that matters. They’re doing it for fundraising ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2018, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792/3 "2018-04-20T17:07:16Z")
I wonder if there’ll be any additional documents that’ll come to light from this. Probably not, but I can hope… As long as I’m hoping, let’s depose Donald, Julian and Vlad! ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2018, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792/4 "2018-04-20T17:41:37Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > It sounds like in some ways the Democratic suit against Nixon presages this lawsuit–but in my lifetime it’s unprecedented. So I’m curious what the folks here, both the informed and the ignorant-but-like-to-pontificate-anyway, think about the suit. > > 1. What are its chances of success? > 2. What are its implications, in matters such as discovery of new data and/or effect on Mueller et al investigations? > 3. Why is the Democratic Party really filing it? IIRC the DNC got $750,000 out of their lawsuit which is $4 million or so in today’s money. That can be reason enough. ---
**Author:** ![dalej42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@dalej42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalej42)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2018, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792/5 "2018-04-20T18:03:06Z")
This actually reminds me of the frivolous lawsuits the House Republicans filed against Obama. Utterly pointless, but a good way to fire up the base ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Ace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6bbea6/32.png) [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2018, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792/6 "2018-04-20T18:40:58Z")
Yep, this is all about PR. I highly doubt it’ll get past a judge. ---
**Author:** ![jasg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f0a364/32.png) [@jasg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jasg)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2018, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792/7 "2018-04-20T18:41:33Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > [[snip] > 2) What are its implications, in matters such as discovery of new data and/or effect on Mueller et al investigations? > [/snip] IANAL but I think the testimony/depositions would be of great interest to Mueller - at least for those he has already questioned. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Ace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6bbea6/32.png) [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2018, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792/8 "2018-04-20T18:42:54Z")
> [@jasg](#): > > IANAL but I think the testimony/depositions would be of great interest to Mueller - at least for those he has already questioned. A judge has to allow the case to be heard in the first place to get to that point. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2018, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792/9 "2018-04-20T18:52:21Z")
IANAL, but I think this case has merit in the same way the case against Nixon did. Facts are facts, and there are plenty already in the public domain to support the DNC’s filing. However, I also think the case will be stayed pending the results of the Mueller investigation. Meantime, it keeps the issue of Russian interference in the 2016 election front and center for the mid-terms. ---
**Author:** ![dalej42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@dalej42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalej42)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2018, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792/10 "2018-04-20T18:57:23Z")
Like clockwork, a fundraising email from Ton Perez has just shown up in my email, mentioning the lawsuit. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2018, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792/11 "2018-04-20T18:58:25Z")
This is why Democrats end up snatching defeat from the jaws of victory. Millions of people in this country hate Donald Trump, but some of these millions hate a bunch of crying pussies even more. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2018, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792/12 "2018-04-20T23:29:05Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > 1. What are its chances of success? > 2. What are its implications, in matters such as discovery of new data and/or effect on Mueller et al investigations? > 3. Why is the Democratic Party really filing it? I think the most interesting thing is that it doesn’t actually name Donald Trump personally. It goes after friends and associates, like Don Jr and Roger Stone. I think that means the suit is more likely to proceed (not necessarily succeed) because those people aren’t shielded the way government officials are. Obviously, the Russian government is just going to flip them off. Wikileaks however … I can’t help wondering if Ecuador won’t use this as an opportunity to get Julian Assange off their couch. I think there’s enough information already publicly available - for example, Junior’s enthusiasm for Russia’s help in his dad’s campaign and Roger Stone’s curious statements suggesting that he knew what Wikileaks was going to say next - to merit the suit going forward. Also keep in mind that the standard for winning a suit is lower in civil proceedings. The DNC won’t have to prove anything beyond a shadow of a doubt. The point of all this is not fundraising. The chief thing here is that it keeps the legal pressure on the Trump campaign even if Donald fires Mueller. Given a) the overall squirreliness of Trump’s associates and b) the way his legal team is already overstretched, this is going to make Donald’s life harder. If this suit goes through, internal Trump campaign documents become discoverable evidence. This is a major problem heading into the re-election. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2018, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792/13 "2018-04-21T01:17:11Z")
They might also be hoping to get some key figures to make statements under oath, which could either be useful in their own right, or eventually lead to perjury charges. Or possibly both. Maybe even a “You can’t handle the truth!” moment. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2018, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792/14 "2018-04-21T01:37:17Z")
It does exactly the wrong thing at the wrong time. It politicizes the legal/criminal investigation into the Trump crime family. The average person doesn’t give a toss about Russia and collusion; they just want more opportunity for economic growth. The president has been linked to economic growth in the mind of the average Ameritard over the last few decades. If the economy’s good, Trump wins and he could strangle someone on live TV and nobody would care. If the economy’s bad, he could feed children in Africa on live TV and nobody would care - they’d want him out even before the end of his term. It’s that simple, folks. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2018, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792/15 "2018-04-21T02:01:30Z")
> [@Johnny\_Ace](#): > > A judge has to allow the case to be heard in the first place to get to that point. What process are you anticipating that would allow a judge to block a civil suit? ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2018, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792/16 "2018-04-21T02:02:31Z")
Seems smart to me. Trump can pardon people, but he can’t stop a civil suit. It just seems like a third front, after the federal and state level charges. ---
**Author:** ![USCDiver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uscdiver/32/354_2.png) [@USCDiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/USCDiver)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2018, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792/17 "2018-04-21T02:08:24Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > What process are you anticipating that would allow a judge to block a civil suit? According to one of my attorney friends on Facebook, the defendants move to dismiss and the Judge agrees. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2018, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792/18 "2018-04-21T02:44:42Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > 1. What are its implications, in matters such as discovery of new data and/or effect on Mueller et al investigations? > 2. Why is the Democratic Party really filing it? As for (2), the implications of discovery would potentially be wide-ranging, if it ever got that far, because the Republicans would feast. The DNC has thus far always refused to submit its hacked server to outside examination, but now it would be forced to do so. Discovery would further be allowed into the particular details of the DNC’s decision not to allow outside scrutiny, since it has put the retention of Crowdstrike directly into issue. Also, the allegations about Veselnitskaya put Fusion GPS into issue, which would mean discovery into all of the dealings with Russian (government) sources by them and Steele on behalf of the DNC. So as to (3), I clearly think the plaintiffs don’t actually want the suit to go anywhere. It seems instead like an attempt to revive the Russia allegations (in a libel-proof forum) before the 2018 election. This in turn suggests that they don’t foresee Mueller’s investigation yielding anything big, or else there wouldn’t be a need to open a second front. (One can even go full-on conspiratorial and posit that Mueller’s team has leaked to them that nothing big is forthcoming). ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2018, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792/19 "2018-04-21T02:51:39Z")
Moreover, if the suit were to survive a motion to dismiss and go to discovery, the defendants then have every incentive to countersue over the retention of Steele and the creation of the dossier. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2018, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792/20 "2018-04-21T03:24:14Z")
If it comes down to a question of character, Steele vs Stone, I know how I’d place my bets. The RNC has nothing but table-pounding. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democratic-party-sues-russia-wikileaks-trump-campaign/812792.md?page=2)