# Democrats Moving Left vs. GOP Moving Right **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [May 26, 2016, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725 "2016-05-26T03:42:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![DerekMichaels00](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f14d63/32.png) [@DerekMichaels00](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DerekMichaels00)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2016, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725/1 "2016-05-26T03:42:29Z")
Some have debated which has happened more; I would sadly say the former. Democrats have moved much farther left from 2009-now than the GOP has moved right, in both issues and actual demeanor. Democrats used to not have major pols talking about “white privilege,” used to not let Israel-haters into its political mainstream (and the support level for Israel was similar to the nation as a whole), used to not allow communist/socialists into the mainstream, or shouted down the debate on transgenderism either. Sure, the GOP has maybe moved right on gun rights, and maybe immigration, but that’s about it. They’ve largely moved away from hardline positions like on gay marriage and criminal justice reform. I bet there could be interesting opinions here about this oft debated topic. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2016, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725/2 "2016-05-26T03:57:40Z")
> [@DerekMichaels00](#): > > Some have debated which has happened more; I would sadly say the former. Democrats have moved much farther left from 2009-now than the GOP has moved right, in both issues and actual demeanor. Democrats used to not have major pols talking about “white privilege,” used to not let Israel-haters into its political mainstream (and the support level for Israel was similar to the nation as a whole), used to not allow communist/socialists into the mainstream, or shouted down the debate on transgenderism either. Sure, the GOP has maybe moved right on gun rights, and maybe immigration, but that’s about it. Hah, good one, it is not just “about it” for the Republicans, I think you are ignoring what is that the Republicans are willing to get in bed with by embracing Trump at the levels they are showing now. > **[How the US Went Fascist: Mass Media Make Excuses for Trump Voters –...](https://billmoyers.com/story/how-the-us-went-fascist-mass-media-makes-excuses-for-trump-voters/)** > > The rise of Donald Trump to the presumptive Republican standard bearer for president in 2016 is an indictment of, and a profound danger to the American republic. The Founding Fathers were afraid of the excitability of the voters and their... > [@](#): > > How the US Went Fascist: Mass Media Make Excuses for Trump Voters > > Trump’s racism and xenophobia violates America’s core beliefs — yet the media and many Americans are okay with it. > > **The notables have been shown to be useless. Donald Trump should have been kicked out of the Republican Party the moment he began talking about violating the Constitution. The first time he hinted about assaulting the journalists covering his rallies, he should have been shown the door. When he openly advocated torture (“worse than waterboarding”), he should have been ushered away. When he began speaking of closing houses of worship, he should have been expelled. He has solemnly pledged to violate the First, Fourth and Eighth Amendments of the Constitution, at the least. If someone’s platform is unconstitutional, it boggles the mind that a major American party would put him or her up for president. How can he take the oath of office with a straight face? The party leaders were afraid he’d mount a third-party campaign. But who knows how that would have turned out? Someone with power needs to say that Trump is unacceptable and to define him out of respectable politics, the same way David Duke is treated (Trump routinely retweets Duke fellow-travellers).** > > Then there is the mass media. As Amy Goodman has pointed out, corporate television has routinely pumped Trump into our living rooms. They have virtually blacked out Bernie Sanders. Trump seems to have connived to have 10 or 15 minutes at 7:20 every evening on the magazine shows. Chris Matthews of Hardball obligingly cut away to Il Duce II’s rants and gave away his show to him on a nightly basis. > > Not long ago, extremely powerful television personalities and sportscasters were abruptly fired for saying things less offensive than Trump’s bromides. Don Imus was history for abusive language toward women basketball players. But Trump’s strident attack on Megyn Kelly as a menstruating harridan was just allowed to pass. Jimmy “the Greek” Snyder was fired by CBS for saying African-Americans were ‘bred’ to be better athletes. But Trump issued a blanket characterization of undocumented Mexican labor migrants as rapists, thieves and drug dealers. Of course this allegation is untrue. > > I watched the Nevada caucus coverage on MSNBC and was appalled at the discourse. **One reporter tried to assure us that Trump voters were not actually voting for racism and bullying politics, they were just upset. But polling in South Carolina demonstrated that Trump voters were significantly to the right of most Republicans on some issues. In South Carolina, 38 percent of Trump voters wished the South had won the Civil War, presumably suggesting that they regretted the end of slavery.** (Bold added) ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2016, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725/3 "2016-05-26T04:14:49Z")
The Republicans stake out a position as far to the right as they can. Seeing as how often they lose because they are wrong it’s no surprise that they move slowly to the left. It’s not possible to determine the direction of the Democrats, they are in chaotic motion all the time. For every special interest group of oppressed victims/terrorist they support there’s a banker getting a tax break from them. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2016, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725/4 "2016-05-26T04:41:36Z")
Democrats took a pretty big swing to the right during Clinton’s two terms. It was practical; it was how Clinton got elected. Obama did not move significantly to the left, but pretty much maintained the Clinton line. He might (or might not) have wanted to govern more to the left, but the GOP refused to work with him in any way, whatever, so a lot of important things have gone completely unaddressed. Hillary Clinton won’t move very far left either; she, too, will hang in the Bill Clinton zone. Bernie Sanders promised far more than he could conceivably have delivered; even were he elected, he would be able to get nothing through Congress. So it’s center-right for the foreseeable future. The OP is full of prunes. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2016, 6:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725/5 "2016-05-26T06:54:29Z")
Democrats became more militarily hawkish. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2016, 8:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725/6 "2016-05-26T08:25:25Z")
> [@DerekMichaels00](#): > > Some have debated which has happened more; I would sadly say the former. Democrats have moved much farther left from 2009-now than the GOP has moved right, in both issues and actual demeanor. The big difference from 2009 is that Obama’s wised up that the Republicans in Congress are never going to work with him and acted accordingly. Thus the insanity of a “grand bargain” that would have gutted entitlements in exchange for cosmetic tax increases has been dropped. Maybe that’s moving left, I’d say it’s getting some testicular fortitude. > [@](#): > > Democrats used to not have major pols talking about “white privilege,” who care > [@](#): > > used to not let Israel-haters into its political mainstream (and the support level for Israel was similar to the nation as a whole), Such as? Who are the Israel haters? > [@](#): > > used to not allow communist/socialists into the mainstream, [Frank Zeidler](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Zeidler), [Vito Marcantonio](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vito_Marcantonio), and the [SDUSA](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Democrats,_USA) all would like to have a word with you. > [@](#): > > or shouted down the debate on transgenderism either. Again I’d like to note you have a more prejudiced views against trans individuals then Donald Trump. > [@](#): > > Sure, the GOP has maybe moved right on gun rights, and maybe immigration, but that’s about it. Well you know except for everything else. > [@](#): > > They’ve largely moved away from hardline positions like on gay marriage and criminal justice reform. In other words, trivial issues highly suspectible to being influenced by the zeitgeist. > [@Velocity](#): > > Democrats became more militarily hawkish. Compared to George McGovern maybe but the liberal internationalism of the Clintons and Obama is in the tradition of FDR, Harry Truman, Kennedy, LBJ, and Scoop Jackson. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2016, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725/7 "2016-05-26T12:29:02Z")
> [@DerekMichaels00](#): > > Some have debated which has happened more; I would sadly say the former. Democrats have moved much farther left from 2009-now than the GOP has moved right, in both issues and actual demeanor. Since pretty much all of your criticism of the Democratic party and President Obama has been based on fantasies and/or bigotry, I strongly disagree. > [@](#): > > Democrats used to not have major pols talking about “white privilege,” Democrats used to try to appeal to white supremacist voters, too. > [@](#): > > used to not let Israel-haters into its political mainstream (and the support level for Israel was similar to the nation as a whole), What Israel-haters? Cite? > [@](#): > > used to not allow communist/socialists into the mainstream, Most of the domestic policies (like single-payer health care and higher minimum wage) advocated by Bernie have been in the Democratic mainstream for decades. > [@](#): > > or shouted down the debate on transgenderism either. Yes, the Democratic party has decided to take the non-bigoted position on transgender issues. > [@](#): > > Sure, the GOP has maybe moved right on gun rights, and maybe immigration, but that’s about it. They’ve largely moved away from hardline positions like on gay marriage and criminal justice reform. They’ve moved right on religious bigotry and even religious suppression (supporting a ban on Muslims entering the country, and much higher support for outlawing Islam), on religious issues like prayer in school and teaching evolution, on foreign policy (refusing to negotiate with any opponents about anything ever), on abortion (not even for rape or incest), as well as in tone in the way they talk about Obama (birtherism, accusations of treason, etc.). ---
**Author:** ![inscrutable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/a88e4f/32.png) [@inscrutable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/inscrutable)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2016, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725/8 "2016-05-26T13:04:13Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Since pretty much all of your criticism of the Democratic party and President Obama has been based on fantasies and/or bigotry, I strongly disagree. > > Democrats used to try to appeal to white supremacist voters, too. > > What Israel-haters? Cite? > > Most of the domestic policies (like single-payer health care and higher minimum wage) advocated by Bernie have been in the Democratic mainstream for decades. > > Yes, the Democratic party has decided to take the non-bigoted position on transgender issues. > > They’ve moved right on religious bigotry and even religious suppression (supporting a ban on Muslims entering the country, and much higher support for outlawing Islam), on religious issues like prayer in school and teaching evolution, on foreign policy (refusing to negotiate with any opponents about anything ever), on abortion (not even for rape or incest), as well as in tone in the way they talk about Obama (birtherism, accusations of treason, etc.). It’s a stretch to define ‘striving to preserve and defend traditional Judeo-Christian American Values’ as “bigotry”. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2016, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725/9 "2016-05-26T13:11:32Z")
When “traditional Judeo-Christian American values” gets pretzel - bent into “fuck those transgender cry babies,” among other compassionate “Christian views,” that stretch gets a little shorter. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2016, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725/10 "2016-05-26T13:19:07Z")
> [@inscrutable](#): > > It’s a stretch to define ‘striving to preserve and defend traditional Judeo-Christian American Values’ as “bigotry”. Denigrating trans people is bigotry; denying that transgender is a real thing is bigotry; defending discrimination against trans people is defending bigotry… I’m not convinced that those things are part of “traditional Judeo-Christian American values” (though I’m not very clear on the precise definition of that phrase, anyway – does it include the very American (though, thankfully, far less influential and widespread now than in the past) tradition of white supremacy?). ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2016, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725/11 "2016-05-26T13:20:01Z")
> [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](#): > > Such as? Who are the Israel haters? He means Obama. He’s been given evidence repeatedly to counter his view that Obama hates Israel, but he keeps making this claim anyway. > [@inscrutable](#): > > It’s a stretch to define ‘striving to preserve and defend traditional Judeo-Christian American Values’ as “bigotry”. Given that the only “religious freedom” all those “religious freedom” bills the Republicans have been pushing is the freedom to discriminate against others, it’s not remotely a stretch. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2016, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725/12 "2016-05-26T13:53:56Z")
> [@DerekMichaels00](#): > > Some have debated which has happened more; I would sadly say the former. Democrats have moved much farther left from 2009-now than the GOP has moved right, in both issues and actual demeanor. This could be true: if you mean that on a scale of -100 to +100 the Democrats have moved from -20 to -22 but the Republicans have only moved from +98 to +99. > [@inscrutable](#): > > It’s a stretch to define ‘striving to preserve and defend traditional Judeo-Christian American Values’ as “bigotry”. It’s more definitional than a stretch. I’ve read a lot of American history. You should as well. It’s eye-opening as well as depressing. ---
**Author:** ![inscrutable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/a88e4f/32.png) [@inscrutable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/inscrutable)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2016, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725/13 "2016-05-26T14:12:19Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > This could be true: if you mean that on a scale of -100 to +100 the Democrats have moved from -20 to -22 but the Republicans have only moved from +98 to +99. > It’s more definitional than a stretch. I’ve read a lot of American history. You should as well. It’s eye-opening as well as depressing. Bad things happened in the past, so we need to burn this sucker down and rebuild it. Preach that to the millions of immigrants and minorities who have chosen to embrace assimilation and capitalism, therefore becoming quite successful… ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2016, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725/14 "2016-05-26T14:15:26Z")
> [@inscrutable](#): > > Bad things happened in the past, so we need to burn this sucker down and rebuild it. > > Preach that to the millions of immigrants and minorities who have chosen to embrace assimilation and capitalism, therefore becoming quite successful… The post you responded to is not in conflict with the ideals of assimilation and capitalism in any way whatsoever. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2016, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725/15 "2016-05-26T16:09:01Z")
In Congress, its not even [close.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/06/02/this-astonishing-chart-shows-how-republicans-are-an-endangered-species/) ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2016, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725/16 "2016-05-26T16:27:40Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > Hah, good one, it is not just “about it” for the Republicans, I think you are ignoring what is that the Republicans are willing to get in bed with by embracing Trump at the levels they are showing now. > > [How the US Went Fascist: Mass Media Make Excuses for Trump Voters – BillMoyers.com](http://billmoyers.com/story/how-the-us-went-fascist-mass-media-makes-excuses-for-trump-voters/) > (Bold added) I don’t think Trump is a step to the right. He is a step towards Making America Great Again (AKA the first step towards the implosion of the Republican party that is now just partisan for partisanships sake. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2016, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725/17 "2016-05-26T16:30:14Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > What Israel-haters? Cite? It depends on how you define Israel hater. Derek seems to define it as anyone that doesn’t suck Netanyahu’s cock as he gets off the plane. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2016, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725/18 "2016-05-26T16:31:16Z")
> [@inscrutable](#): > > It’s a stretch to define ‘striving to preserve and defend traditional Judeo-Christian American Values’ as “bigotry”. Sometimes it can be the same thing. ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2016, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725/19 "2016-05-26T17:08:03Z")
I think Democrats will only move to the left to the same extent as the general public does. My main example for this is the recent progress in rights for people who are gay and transgendered. When it comes to things like economic policy and overall governing philosophy, however, it’s not going to happen. Bernie Sanders is demonstrating why Democrats won’t move significantly to the left. We’re not willing to let the fringe take over the party the way the way the far right did to the Republicans with the Tea Party. The reason is simple. Republican voters are willing to loose with candidates like Sharon Angle. Democrats, at least the older ones, remember what happened when the party went with true liberals (Mondale and Dukakis). The best that Bernie and the far left can do is fracture the party enough to cost moderates like Clinton a shot at winning. There is no way that they can start a Democratic version of the Tea Party with any success on Election Day, I just don’t see that happening. ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2016, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725/20 "2016-05-26T18:52:09Z")
Loose should have been lose in my above post ������ [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/democrats-moving-left-vs-gop-moving-right/755725.md?page=2)