# Demonology- Are there demons who do whatever they want? Bad and good? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 25, 2016, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844 "2016-09-25T17:35:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844/41 "2016-09-26T04:37:41Z")
> [@Hector\_St\_Clare](#): > > I’d assume he is open to the possibility, but finds the arguments for the nonexistence of demons _unconvincing_, as do I. I find arguments for the nonexistence of the Invisible Pink Unicorn unconvincing also. However I’m rather short on the important thing, arguments for her existence. (Besides pineapple pizza, that is.) Got something better for demons? ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 5:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844/42 "2016-09-26T05:13:42Z")
> [@Onomatopoeia](#): > > No, because as much as you would like them to, demons don’t exist. > . . . > Sounds like you have attached yourself, perhaps unwittingly, to a lot of supernatural mumbo jumbo as a coping mechanism for some possibly unpleasant things that have happened in your life. Past lives, Reiki, archangels, demons; if this is your reality then things are only going to get tougher for you. This is threadshitting. A question challenging the source of the beliefs expressed in the context that such beliefs are contradicted by the traditions regarding demons in Ancient Greek, Muslim, Japanese, or other cultures that expressed a belief in demons is legitimate. A simple denial that such beings exist or an attempt to perform long-distance psych evals on the poster are not appropriate to this discussion. [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 6:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844/43 "2016-09-26T06:59:58Z")
[Gwen](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gwen_Ifill)? Is that you? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 7:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844/44 "2016-09-26T07:07:15Z")
So is a pentagram bigger or smaller than a kilogram? ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 8:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844/45 "2016-09-26T08:04:18Z")
> [@Ifill](#): > > Honesty I just believe what I see or hear for myself We cannot always trust our senses, it’s certainly not uncommon to see and hear things which aren’t there or to misinterpret something as preternatural when in fact there’s a perfectly logical explanation. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 11:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844/46 "2016-09-26T11:13:33Z")
> [@Hector\_St\_Clare](#): > > I’d assume he is open to the possibility, but finds the arguments for the nonexistence of demons _unconvincing_, as do I. It is upon the believers to show evidence for the existence of demons, not the other way around. If one believes hard enough, any evidence to the contrary can be explained away and/or denied. When it comes to belief in demons and the like, one of the problems is that any evidence can be(and very often has through the centuries) dismissed as false evidence-tools of some evil entity. ---
**Author:** ![Onomatopoeia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/onomatopoeia/32/4145_2.png) [@Onomatopoeia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Onomatopoeia)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 11:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844/47 "2016-09-26T11:19:04Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > This is threadshitting. > > A question challenging the source of the beliefs expressed in the context that such beliefs are contradicted by the traditions regarding demons in Ancient Greek, Muslim, Japanese, or other cultures that expressed a belief in demons is legitimate. > > A simple denial that such beings exist or an attempt to perform long-distance psych evals on the poster are not appropriate to this discussion. > > [/Moderating] Understood. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844/48 "2016-09-26T12:49:35Z")
Literally before we can go any further in this discussion, we must define what we mean by the term “demon”. I can’t even tell you if I believe in demons or not unless I know what you mean by that term. And many of the OP’s questions would be answered immediately by a proper definition. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844/49 "2016-09-26T12:54:08Z")
> [@Ifill](#): > > Honesty I just believe what I see or hear for myself So do I. My demons tell me that your demons don’t exist. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844/50 "2016-09-26T13:15:30Z")
To the OP: how do you know it was a demon and not a ghost, fairy, jinn or kami? ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844/51 "2016-09-26T13:22:14Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Literally before we can go any further in this discussion, we must define what we mean by the term “demon”. I can’t even tell you if I believe in demons or not unless I know what you mean by that term. And many of the OP’s questions would be answered immediately by a proper definition. Can you seriously not extrapolate from the OP what kind of demons he is talking about? Hint: It’s not the figurative or metaphorical kind. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844/52 "2016-09-26T13:32:06Z")
To the OP: how can you be certain you were speaking to supernatural beings, as opposed to either a hallucination or someone playing a trick on you? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844/53 "2016-09-26T13:42:55Z")
> [@](#): > > Can you seriously not extrapolate from the OP what kind of demons he is talking about? > > Hint: It’s not the figurative or metaphorical kind. I can figure out _some_ of what he’s talking about. But not enough. For instance, in some conceptions, angels and demons are the same inherent sort of entities, but angels are, by definition, entities of that sort that do good, and demons are, by definition, entities of that sort that do evil. Under that definition, it’s impossible for a demon to do good, because a demon who does good isn’t a demon any more. Other conceptions might allow for some third category of beings of the same basic sort, such that angels always do good, demons always do evil, and beings of the third type (which have a number of different names in different cultures) sometimes do good and sometimes evil. Under that conception, it’s still impossible for a demon to do good, but the entity the OP is interacting with could be one of those third-types. Basically, the OP is claiming to be interacting with an entity. She further claims that the entity she is interacts with is a demon. What does she mean, by identifying him as such? ---
**Author:** ![Latro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@Latro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Latro)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844/54 "2016-09-26T14:28:07Z")
> [@Grrr](#): > > Can you seriously not extrapolate from the OP what kind of demons he is talking about? I would be very surprised if the OP is not a she. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844/55 "2016-09-26T14:44:34Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Basically, the OP is claiming to be interacting with an entity. She further claims that the entity she is interacts with is a demon. What does she mean, by identifying him as such? The OP also claims to have spoken with the Archangel Michael and to possess (as of yet unnamed) psychic abilities. In my opinion, that’s just too much claiming to take at face value, and the OP really needs to start backing up these fantastic claims. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844/56 "2016-09-26T15:49:00Z")
> [@ftg](#): > > When I see a topic like this, I am reminded of [this](https://xkcd.com/1235/) XKCD comic. > > If demons exist, they’ve been keeping _amazingly_ quiet. To the point of background noise. Therefore they would serve no real purpose in life anyway. I think leprechauns have a better chance of being real. > > Why worry about demons when something provably real like the odds of the Earth getting walloped by an asteroid are enough to worry anybody who frets over unlikely things. When I saw your xkcd link I assumed it would be to this one: [xkcd: The Economic Argument](http://xkcd.com/808/). I assumed wrongly. I’m sure controlling (or even influencing) a platoon of demons would be highly profitable. Nobody’s done it. [Now that we’re in GD] Although maybe Trump comes close? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Doubticus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e56c9b/32.png) [@Doubticus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doubticus)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844/57 "2016-09-26T16:03:55Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Angels and demons don’t exist. Not true, it is still in print. You can buy copies here: [Angels & Demons: A Novel (Robert Langdon): Brown, Dan: 9780743493468: Amazon.com: Books](https://www.amazon.com/Angels-Demons-Novel-Robert-Langdon/dp/074349346X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1474905839&sr=8-1&keywords=angels+and+demons+book) ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844/58 "2016-09-26T16:05:55Z")
Have we figured out yet why there might be demons who _don’t_ do whatever they want? Are some of them restricted by the Code of Demon Ethics™, or afraid of retribution by the Archangel Michael? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844/59 "2016-09-26T16:12:21Z")
> [@Grrr](#): > > Can you seriously not extrapolate from the OP what kind of demons he is talking about? > > Hint: It’s not the figurative or metaphorical kind. The OP claims not to follow any particular religion, but also claims to talk with the Archangel Michael(which could lead one to think that her/his demons are Christian-based), and on top of it all claims to have psychic powers. I’m not about to extrapolate _anything_ from that mish-mash until the OP clarifies exactly what she/he claims is going on. ---
**Author:** ![Ignotus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/ecc23a/32.png) [@Ignotus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ignotus)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844/60 "2016-09-26T16:32:41Z")
I believe some Greek philosophers, notably Socrates, used the word _daimon_ in a largely positive sense. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/demonology-are-there-demons-who-do-whatever-they-want-bad-and-good/766844.md?page=4)