# Dems should confirm Kavanaugh as soon as possible **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [July 10, 2018, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685 "2018-07-10T22:51:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2018, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685/161 "2018-07-13T17:58:50Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > Tanks for what? Trump is the guy who provided more jobs to the community. LOL. The statistics tell us the opposite. > [@](#): > > During Obama, the labor rate, which defines the percent of population actually went down! Its back up under Trump. Have a cite for this? Pretty sure the first sentence is wildly false. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2018, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685/162 "2018-07-13T18:11:32Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > Trump has one of the biggest mouths, and very little filter. What did he ever say that was Racist?. Here’s just a couple of examples - [from two years ago](https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/a-propagator-of-race-hatred-and-violence): > [@](#): > > The language is important: “When somebody called for a moment of silence to this maniac that shot the five police, you just see what’s going on. It’s a very, very sad situation.” > > Then later at the Indiana rally: “The other night you had 11 cities potentially in a blow-up stage. Marches all over the United States—and tough marches. Anger. Hatred. Hatred! Started by a maniac! And some people ask for a moment of silence for him. For the killer!” NONE of this was true, btw. Nobody was marching for Micah Johnson. But Trump spread this complete fabrication that angry blacks in cities all across the country were marching in support of the man who killed five law enforcement officers, and that “11 cities [were] potentially in a blow-up stage,” as if we were about to experience a re-enactment of the way the cities erupted after MLK’s assassination. He was selling a story about how the race war was coming at us, whether we liked it or not. And not the least part of it was true. Hard to be more racist than that. And as Marshall notes in that piece, this was in the wake of Trump’s repeated (and equally bogus) claims that American Muslims across the river in New Jersey celebrated and cheered as the Twin Towers fell on 9/11. Selling race-based fear and hatred. That’s what Trump does. What a genuinely evil man. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2018, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685/163 "2018-07-13T18:16:14Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > During Obama, the labor rate, which defines the percent of population actually went down! The “labor rate”? Which one? [Knock yourself out.](https://www.bls.gov/home.htm) Certainly a rate that “defines the percent of population” doesn’t narrow it down at all. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2018, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685/164 "2018-07-13T18:26:37Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > What evidence? Bring it. This tactic for rebuttal will not work well for you, not in this instance. All the evidence was provided by you, after all. ---
**Author:** ![Ashtura](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ashtura/32/2963_2.png) [@Ashtura](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ashtura)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2018, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685/165 "2018-07-13T18:41:23Z")
Nothing is going to stop Kavanaugh from getting in, as long as republicans want him in. No “disqualifying thing” democrats find. Nothing. Kavanaugh is disqualified by democrats already by virtue of being picked Trump. Republicans will nuke him in if need be, well before November. The only way he doesn’t get in is republicans don’t want him in. And that will only be if he’s viewed as not conservative enough. I’ve looked at Trump’s next picks. Kavanaugh is not a bad choice compared to what you could get. Barrett would be a big FU to democrats. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2018, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685/166 "2018-07-13T19:05:09Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > The surest sign that there is no God is that Trumpies like **Silver Lining** haven’t been struck and killed by lightning yet. That’ll earn you a warning, jayjay. Don’t wish harm on other posters, even sideways. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2018, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685/167 "2018-07-13T19:42:53Z")
> [@Ashtura](#): > > Nothing is going to stop Kavanaugh from getting in, as long as republicans want him in. No “disqualifying thing” democrats find. Nothing. Kavanaugh is disqualified by democrats already by virtue of being picked Trump. Republicans will nuke him in if need be, well before November. > > The only way he doesn’t get in is republicans don’t want him in. And that will only be if he’s viewed as not conservative enough. I’ve looked at Trump’s next picks. Kavanaugh is not a bad choice compared to what you could get. Barrett would be a big FU to democrats. The only way dems stop Kavanaugh from getting in is delaying the vote till after the midterms and then winning back the Senate. Both are a long shot. The dems have a bit of a shot at delay in demanding all of Kavanaugh’s records from when he was Bush’s staff secretary and in the White House counsel’s office. Right now the administration seems to be saying his ~300 legal opinions as a judge are the only relevant documents and do not want to give up the other stuff (which some say may be a million pages of stuff). Dems have precedent for the request on their side. When Elena Kagan was going through the nomination process the reps, led by Jeff Sessions, demanded something similar (and got around 150,000 I think). Not that this precedent will matter to reps even a little bit. Personally I think the Dems are better off letting Kavanaugh in. It is all a bit too much of a long shot to stop him and he is replacing Kennedy who was only barely friendly to liberals in a few narrow circumstances. Then let the republicans explain to their base why Roe is still in place (or rather Casey) even though they hold all the levers of power. Let the scare over Roe rally liberals. If the dems keep Kavanaugh out by the time the midterm rolls around it will only server to rally republican voters. I think we are stuck taking a step back before moving forward on this one. It may take another couple shitty decades to get the swill out but we will get there. [sub]_“I do not pretend to understand the moral universe; the arc is a long one, my eye reaches but little ways; I cannot calculate the curve and complete the figure by the experience of sight; I can divine it by conscience. And from what I see I am sure it bends towards justice.”_ ~Theodore Parker[/sub] ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2018, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685/168 "2018-07-13T21:27:34Z")
I expect the Dems to put up a spirited and forthright objection, but to hold the line against pointless obstruction. Mr K’s record is clear, his reactionary opinions are an open book. I gather that some of those opinions even raise eyebrows among the cramped and constipated Federalist Society, the kind of people who think that little bitch Al Hamilton was too much a populist. These things should be openly discussed and argued, so that we know just exactly what level of horror we can expect. Then pick themselves up, dust themselves off, check for loose teeth. Fighting against money and power is a long war, and we are going to lose battles. Tactic wise, I think he should be closely questioned about Roe. He will evade, and claim to have no set opinion, claim to be open minded. This will convince and assure nobody. Hell, it might infuriate _both_ the pro-life factions and pro-choice. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2018, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685/169 "2018-07-13T21:29:29Z")
If you rush to put him in you lose the opportunity to eliminate him on ethics or character. That is the only realistic scenario for a course of action that favors the dem side over the near term, so you don’t cross it off right at the beginning. If he gets squashed it will be a huge dem win. If you don’t think that’s realistic talk to Mitch McConnell. He knows how to stay in the game. It wasn’t realistic to try and steal a seat either. ---
**Author:** ![TonySinclair](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/49beb7/32.png) [@TonySinclair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TonySinclair)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2018, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685/170 "2018-07-13T23:48:05Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > Certainly a rate that “defines the percent of population” doesn’t narrow it down at all. Typical leftie, refusing to admit that under Trump, the percent of population has gone way up. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2018, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685/171 "2018-07-14T00:28:15Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > This tactic for rebuttal will not work well for you, not in this instance. All the evidence was provided by you, after all. That’s not how it works. You made the claim, you back it up. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2018, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685/172 "2018-07-14T02:35:42Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > Tanks for what? …thanks for all the fish. > [@](#): > > Trump is the guy who provided more jobs to the community. No Trump hasn’t done a damn thing to provide more jobs to the community. > [@](#): > > How is this Trump’s issue alone? This isn’t Trumps issue. This is \*\*your \*\*issue. > [@](#): > > Nothing can change a person in their 50’s that missed out on higher ed, but a President can change the amount of job openings a group with no higher ed can have. We are seeing that now. The African American community is not correctly characterised by people in their 50’s who missed out on higher ed. If you wanted to talk about that particular demographic then you should have said so. And jobs that don’t require a higher education, only require low skill, and which will probably not even give them enough hours to pay them a living wage are not good options for people in their 50’s. I’m nearly 50 myself and my body is already falling apart. These sorts of jobs are painful. And stressful. And they hurt. And you struggle and you can’t get decent healthcare so what you see as a good thing I see as pretty fucking miserable. > [@](#): > > Trump pretty much reversed many XO’s by Obama that helped business. Which ones in particular? Can you point to specific causes and effects? > [@](#): > > He’s not riding his coattails. He’s literally destroying Obama’s coattails. And he is taking the rest of the country down with him. > [@](#): > > Quite the opposite, he’s changing many things. Changing things for the sake of change isn’t necessarily a good thing. Changing them because Obama did it is a pretty fucking stupid thing, and that, by and large, is the reason why Trump is doing what he is doing. > [@](#): > > A reason along with tax cuts for record low unemployment! During Obama, the labor rate, which defines the percent of population actually went down! Its back up under Trump. Cite please. > [@](#): > > So are you saying the poor white or latino people, which outnumber the poor black people are getting a pass? I’m saying exactly what I said. > [@](#): > > If you are able bodied, work hard and play by the rules, you can better yourself and help the next generation. This is a fiction. A fantasy. A cliche. A talking point. A pipe dream. An ideal. In America you can work hard and play by all the rules but find yourself bankrupt and homeless because the insurance company decides not to pay your medical expenses. In America you can break all the rules. Every single one of them. You can lie. You can cheat. You can not pay your contractors. You can slander. You can fucking swear. You can abuse. You can sexually assault. You can cheat on your spouse. And you can get away with all of that and end up the most powerful person on the planet. There are no consequences if you decide to cheat to win. You are rewarded for being an arsehole. That’s the reality of America. > [@](#): > > You could say part of the reason for the community not doing as well as they could is based on family issues, and high school drop out percentages. You could say that, and you have said that. You could say a lot of other things too. What doesn’t change is the text that you wrote that I originally replied too. That the African American community should be grateful that President Trump has instituted a policy that punishes vulnerable people who are escaping literal murderers by locking them in cages and taking away their children. That there is a very good chance that thousands of children will never be reunited with their parents. That those children will suffer. That they should be grateful that these people are no longer allowed in the country so that they could have their jobs instead. These unskilled, low-paying jobs that probably won’t give them enough money to provide them with a living wage. That this is all they deserve. No. This is not a better life. This is a tragedy. This is a disgrace. Its despicable and disgusting and it goes against everything the United States of America is supposed to stand for. Truth. Justice. Freedom. What Trump has done spits in the face of Lady Liberty. > [@](#): > > Well if your so sure, maybe the media they watch can point this out and educate them. Then people can make up their own minds. Why don’t we see much talk there? Hmmmm… The black community don’t need to watch the media to see what is happening to them every single day. They don’t need to be “educated.” They don’t need your propaganda. They simply have to walk out the front door. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2018, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685/173 "2018-07-14T15:00:09Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > Trump is the guy who provided more jobs to the community. I am curious if you are repeating a talking point or if you have any evidence for this. If you do have evidence can you point us to it? Because the data does not seem to support your claim: > [@](#): > > The US is creating a net of about 180,000 new jobs each month. That’s what it did before the tax bill was passed and that’s what it has been doing since. For instance, the number of net new non-farm jobs rose by 148,000 in December, 176,000 in January, 326,000 in February and 103,000 in March, or about 188,000-per month over the four-month period. > > In other words, it is hard to see an economic inflection point during the tax debate or just after Congress passed the new law. Despite high-profile anecdotes that some businesses would hire in the wake of the tax cuts, no big bump in the long-term employment trend has appeared in the data. > > SOURCE: [Girls In Tech: My Teacher Told Me Not To Go Into Robotics And Now I Think I Should](https://www.forbes.com/sites/sap/2018/07/09/girls-in-tech-my-teacher-told-me-not-to-go-into-robotics-and-now-i-think-i-should/#723baf012406) ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2018, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685/174 "2018-07-14T16:27:31Z")
> [@TonySinclair](#): > > Typical leftie, refusing to admit that under Trump, the percent of population has gone way up. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Warm\_blood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/df705f/32.png) [@Warm\_blood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Warm_blood)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2018, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685/175 "2018-07-14T17:06:32Z")
Does OP and others agreeing with him in this thread not realise that Supreme Court judges are on the bench for a lifetime, and thus can make rulings that are not immediately irreversible and can last several generations? This is absolutely not something the Dems should look the other way for. Everything they’ve ever fought for can and will be undone by a court that’s tilted towards right wing sentiments. If they quietly yield to that, then they will prove that is no point in supporting the Democratic Party. Who cares if they alienate independents and “moderate” Dems? The same group of people that either voted for a third party candidate or stayed home during the last election because “both candidates are equally terrible”. Being too concerned with appeasing moderates and centrists is a big part of why they’ve fallen out of favour with their constituents over the past decade. The demographics are shifting and the electorate is becoming younger, more ethnically diverse and increasingly female. Those aforementioned groups of people tend to be unapologetically leftist and demand more progressive policies from the Democrats. So capitulating to right wingers in the name of not rocking the boat is actually the worst thing they could do to guarantee favourable turnout in November. People generally don’t vote Democrat because they want a lite version of the Republicans. ---
**Author:** ![Silver\_lining](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aca169/32.png) [@Silver\_lining](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silver_lining)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2018, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685/176 "2018-07-16T13:12:08Z")
> [@](#): > > iiandyiiii LOL. The statistics tell us the opposite. Unemployment is down under trump. Where they heck are you getting your news? > **[United States Unemployment Rate](https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/unemployment-rate)** > > Unemployment Rate in the United States increased to 3.90 percent in April from 3.80 percent in March of 2024. This page provides the latest reported value for - United States Unemployment Rate - plus previous releases, historical high and low,... > [@](#): > > Have a cite for this? Pretty sure the first sentence is wildly false. I said, " During Obama, the labor rate, which defines the percent of population actually went down! Its back up under Trump. " Your proof See the 10 year chart, where the USA labor rate dived down under Obama. ITs slowly trending up under Trump. > **[United States Labor Force Participation Rate](https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/labor-force-participation-rate)** > > Labor Force Participation Rate in the United States remained unchanged at 62.70 percent in April. This page provides the latest reported value for - United States Labor Force Participation Rate - plus previous releases, historical high and low,... I’m still waiting for you to show me one racist statement made by Trump and saying there were bad people on both sides of a street confrontation proves NOTHING. ---
**Author:** ![Silver\_lining](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aca169/32.png) [@Silver\_lining](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silver_lining)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2018, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685/177 "2018-07-16T13:16:48Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > I am curious if you are repeating a talking point or if you have any evidence for this. If you do have evidence can you point us to it? Because the data does not seem to support your claim: As I correctly stated before, Since trump took office, Un-employment is down from, and the labor rate is back up. > **[United States Labor Force Participation Rate](https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/labor-force-participation-rate)** > > Labor Force Participation Rate in the United States remained unchanged at 62.70 percent in April. This page provides the latest reported value for - United States Labor Force Participation Rate - plus previous releases, historical high and low,... Why some here can’t simply accept facts is a problem. If your Latino or Hispanic their unemployment numbers are near record lows. If Obama did this, he’s get a medal and the news would talk about it 24 x 7. When Trump does this, they hardly mention it. Omission of positive news plagues left leaning voters. You’re rally not watching the news, you’re watching a narrative. ---
**Author:** ![TonySinclair](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/49beb7/32.png) [@TonySinclair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TonySinclair)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2018, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685/178 "2018-07-16T13:40:32Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > As I correctly stated before, Since trump took office, Un-employment is down from, and the labor rate is back up. “Down from” what? The 42% Trump claimed was the real unemployment rate two years ago? That would be considered a jaw-dropping lie from any other President, even W. But with Trump, the lies come so thick and fast that nobody even remembers it. > **[How is the economy really doing](https://money.cnn.com/2017/05/05/investing/trump-economy-report-card-jobs/index.html)** > > President Trump can point to some good economic news since he took over, most notably a healthy job market and continued boom for stocks and housing. But consumer spending has weakened and the trade deficit is still an issue. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2018, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685/179 "2018-07-16T14:15:06Z")
So, **Silver Lining** , you still haven’t clarified which definition of the labor rate you mean, nor even acknowledged that your one attempt at an explanation didn’t make any linguistic sense. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2018, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685/180 "2018-07-16T14:16:19Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > Why some here can’t simply accept facts is a problem. Yes, isn’t it though? > [@](#): > > If Obama did this, he’s get a medal and the news would talk about it 24 x 7. [He did.](https://thetylt.com/politics/unemployment-down-obama-trump-responsible) They didn’t. At least Fox and Breitbart didn’t. > [@](#): > > You’re rally not watching the news, you’re watching a narrative. While whatever you’re watching is reporting facts, right? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-should-confirm-kavanaugh-as-soon-as-possible/817685.md?page=10)