# Dems, what is the plan for 2018/2020? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [January 10, 2017, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839 "2017-01-10T22:22:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Pearl\_Clutching\_Provocateur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Pearl\_Clutching\_Provocateur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pearl_Clutching_Provocateur)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839/101 "2017-01-17T03:11:55Z")
In all seriousness, what was wrong with Martin O’Malley? I was surprised he did so poorly. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839/102 "2017-01-17T05:07:42Z")
Had to look him up, but don’t see the problem. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2017, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839/103 "2017-01-19T06:03:33Z")
I don’t think Martin O’Malley can live down the mass arrests back in Baltimore. He’d have a really hard time with some major components of the coalition. Remember how the Clinton camp tried so hard to paint Bernie Sanders as a racist? It’s actually a lot easier with O’Malley. I say this as someone who likes O’Malley, and appreciated how hard he tried to run as a serious progressive. I would wish him luck, but I can see why he can’t get nominated. ---
**Author:** ![ultimate11](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/49beb7/32.png) [@ultimate11](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultimate11)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2017, 6:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839/104 "2017-01-19T06:10:23Z")
2018? Throw out Bruce Rauner and re-elect democrats. If I was living in Chicago, I’d do something in 2019 to throw out Rahm Emanuel, but I can’t, sadly (I live in the 'burbs). 2020? If Trump does well he’ll get my vote, but if he does poorly, I’ll vote him out. Same plan for 2018 with the rest of the ballot. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2017, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839/105 "2017-01-21T01:29:22Z")
I am convinced that Democrats can win once trump and “trumpism” self-destruct, which seems almost inevitable providing that we are fighting in the same universe of voters as today. Therefor our primary goal should be to resist any and all Republican attempts at narrowing the electorate to keep themselves in power. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2017, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839/106 "2017-01-21T02:54:07Z")
That’s not much of a plan though. Both parties win, but both parties don’t get to enact their agenda. Sure, it’s very likely we’ll see a Democratic President in 2020, and almost certain that we’ll see one in 2024. But what does that mean? a Democrat in the White House whose only purpose is to slow down Republican progress because Republicans still control Congress and a majority of state governments? And even if Democrats win majorities like they had in 2008, do they enact their agenda and just get their asses kicked two years later and then have it all undone, or do they actually start appealing to enough voters to make their agenda enduring? Any dumbass party can win in our system, it’s like a stopped clock. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2017, 5:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839/107 "2017-01-21T05:29:37Z")
I think the idea has to be to win state legislatures. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2017, 7:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839/108 "2017-01-21T07:26:39Z")
One thing’s for certain: Democrats will have sky-high turnout in 2018/2020. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2017, 10:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839/109 "2017-01-21T10:28:55Z")
High Democratic turnout is never a certainty. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2017, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839/110 "2017-01-21T13:31:52Z")
BTW, a good piece of advice from two up and coming Democrts: > [@](#): > > Pick your movie analogy: People want more Jay Bulworth, less Tracy Flick. It often took a village of Clinton advisers just to produce one tweet; Trump pulls out his Android smartphone and lets loose. “Do your own social media for crying out loud. That authenticity is important,” New Jersey Senator Cory Booker advises. Democrats aren’t going to turn into Trump clones, dashing off grammatically challenged 140-character tirades at 3 a.m., but their politicians are trying to unlearn how to be politicians. > > “Everybody who’s in elected office, who wants a future in this space, whatever you are, be it,” Atlanta’s Reed says. “Anybody can win right now. But I’ll tell you who will definitely lose: a fraud [http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/01/democrats-trump-administration-wilderness-comeback-revival-214650](http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/01/democrats-trump-administration-wilderness-comeback-revival-214650) ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2017, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839/111 "2017-01-21T17:16:03Z")
So, a “fraud” cannot win. Good! Have we your word on that, something we can rely on? ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2017, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839/112 "2017-01-21T22:21:11Z")
The 2018 election outcomes could cause the Democrats to think the country is more right-leaning than it is. As of now, the most probable outcome for 2018 is that the Democrats will lose a few Senate seats, gain a few House seats, and gain a few governorships, and the overall election will be a mixed-results draw. However, given that Senate races typically command more attention than other races, it could easily be interpreted as a Republican win. The only reason for the loss in the Senate is that 2018 is an exceptionally bad map for Democrats - many seats in Trump-won red states. But Democrats might take the election outcome to mean that they need a centrist/conservative Democrat for 2020. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2017, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839/113 "2017-01-22T02:06:42Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > So, a “fraud” cannot win. Good! Have we your word on that, something we can rely on? Trump isn’t really a fraud, in that even his fans know who he is. Trump voters supported him despite his flaws, whereas Clinton voters felt compelled to defend the indefensible. One thing that would help, since base behavior does make a difference, is to stop carrying water for fraudulent candidates. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2017, 11:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839/114 "2017-01-23T11:19:57Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I’m just curious what makes you think Stewart “is actually an honest guy”. My impression of the Daily Show is that they got rather famous for deceptive editing and taking quotes out of context, not exactly hallmarks of honesty. So, why do you think Stewart is “honest”? I think you’re confusing Jon Stewart with Sean Hannity here. But if you’ve got examples, bring 'em. > [@](#): > > Trump isn’t really a fraud, in that even his fans know who he is. Trump voters supported him despite his flaws, whereas Clinton voters felt compelled to defend the indefensible. That is some spin you’ve got there. Trump’s lies and corruption are just good ol’ honest flaws, but Clinton’s considerably less overt dishonesty is “indefensible”. Got it. Meanwhile, one of those two had multiple actual court cases for fraud. I’m just suggesting that maybe there’s a small clue there that your characterization of The Donald as “not really a fraud” may not be entirely accurate. > [@](#): > > One thing that would help, since base behavior does make a difference, is to stop carrying water for fraudulent candidates. Good advice. I recommend it to you. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2017, 12:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839/115 "2017-01-23T12:07:31Z")
Did anyone on this board ever say even once that Trump was an honest guy? How many on the other hand not only tried to portray Clinton as honest, but even tried to use statistics to do it? That’s a special kind of ignorant. Or it could have been old fashioned water carrying. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2017, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839/116 "2017-01-23T12:50:22Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Did anyone on this board ever say even once that Trump was an honest guy? How many on the other hand not only tried to portray Clinton as honest, but even tried to use statistics to do it? That’s a special kind of ignorant. Or it could have been old fashioned water carrying. Many, many folks have asserted that Trump is a “straight talker” or similar, and that he lies less than his critics (Obama, Clinton, or others). I’m not sure if any liberal Dopers have “tried to portray Clinton as honest”, but many have (rightfully) tried to demonstrate that she’s less dishonest than Trump or some other Republicans. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2017, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839/117 "2017-01-23T13:44:03Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Many, many folks have asserted that Trump is a “straight talker” or similar, and that he lies less than his critics (Obama, Clinton, or others). I’m not sure if any liberal Dopers have “tried to portray Clinton as honest”, but many have (rightfully) tried to demonstrate that she’s less dishonest than Trump or some other Republicans. Conversely, some Dopers have persistently insisted that Clinton was fundamentally dishonest even in instances where the evidence did not support that conclusion. I’m not quite sure what the opposite of “water carrying” is - “poisoning the well”, perhaps? ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2017, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839/118 "2017-01-23T14:37:54Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Many, many folks have asserted that Trump is a “straight talker” or similar, and that he lies less than his critics (Obama, Clinton, or others). I’m not sure if any liberal Dopers have “tried to portray Clinton as honest”, but many have (rightfully) tried to demonstrate that she’s less dishonest than Trump or some other Republicans. The word I chose to use was “blunt”, since straight talk can imply truth, but that’s just people using sloppy language rather than actually believing Trump is an honest man. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2017, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839/119 "2017-01-23T14:45:20Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > The word I chose to use was “blunt”, since straight talk can imply truth, but that’s just people using sloppy language rather than actually believing Trump is an honest man. No, I think a lot of them thought he was speaking truth to power, or something like that. Many of them thought that his slander of immigrants as rapists and criminals was true; that his fact-free bigoted slanders of Obama were true; that his claims about Muslims cheering 9/11 in NJ was true; etc. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 3:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839/120 "2017-01-24T03:36:44Z")
In some ways he was, whichi is part of his appeal. The political class actually has been getting wealthier while the rest of us languished. Their victories have not actually been our victories. He even pointed out that DC has grown wealthier and wealthier while the rest of the country stagnates by comparison. That does not make him an honest person, we all know he’s a liar. But even liars say true things. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dems-what-is-the-plan-for-2018-2020/776839.md?page=7)