# Derleth, You May Be Beyond Help **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 23, 2007, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633 "2007-08-23T13:19:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![scotandrsn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a4c791/32.png) [@scotandrsn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scotandrsn)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2007, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633/1 "2007-08-23T13:19:39Z")
In [this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=433817) about “official” causes of death, and why people aren’t listed as dying of “old age” anymore, but rather some other cause, **Brian Ekers** [opined](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=8908463&postcount=11) , > [@](#): > > It’s the same reason “nuclear weapon” has largely displaced “atomic bomb.” The latter has no pizazz. You [hijacked](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=8908707&postcount=13) with, > [@](#): > > An atomic bomb is one made of something like TNT or fertilizer: The reactions that make the ‘boom’ go on between atoms, or more precisely their electron shells. A nuclear weapon is one made with plutonium or uranium: The reactions that make the ‘boom’ go on between atomic nuclei, and the electron shells don’t matter at that point. > > Any other usage is pure ignorance. This is science, not English. Suspecting a whoosh, I [facetiously pointed out](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=8908753&postcount=14) the “ignorance” of Grolier Encyclopedia, who define [atomic bomb](http://www.grolier.com/wwii/wwii_atom.html) thusly: > [@](#): > > Atomic Bomb > > ATOMIC BOMB, also known as the atom bomb or fission bomb, a weapon whose explosive power originates from the fission of atomic nuclei. When the nucleus of a heavy atom, such as uranium-235, is split, a certain amount of mass disappears and an equivalent amount of energy is released. This is the energy that powers an atom bomb. On a pound-for-pound basis, the U-235 in an atomic bomb can release on the order of one million times as much energy as TNT. To which [your response](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=8908764&postcount=16) was: > [@](#): > > Point being? Now perhaps you are simply in a jaunty mood and are playing semantic games. I have been grandly whooshed, congratulations! Confess thy trollish behavior, be healed and forgiven, and let us be reconciled. But I suspect otherwise. Do you really not know that the type of bomb you describe is properly termed “chemical”, by the accepted definition of that term as it relates to particle-scale interaction? Or that the term “atomic bomb” has referred to fission weapons since their earliest conception? Can you read the definition by those with a vested financial interest in publishing verifiable fact and not notice a strong discrepancy between their definition and yours? Now, I’m a teacher, I’d like to see your ignorance fought, but there’s a reason I choose not to work with the mentally handicapped. Get thee to a library before your own cause of death is listed as, “lone, strangled neuron firing desperately into the void finally gave up and expired.” ---
**Author:** ![Jodi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/7feea3/32.png) [@Jodi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jodi)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2007, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633/2 "2007-08-23T13:55:32Z")
[The Tick] Oh, science . . . . boring . . . .interest . . . fading . . . .[/The Tick] ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2007, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633/3 "2007-08-23T14:01:28Z")
You’ve got him dead to rights…unless, as you said, it’s nerd humor. Since before the atomic (nuclear) weapon was invented, the term “atomic” was used in conjunction with nuclear reactions. Perhaps the invention of more powerful multi-stage fusion bombs (Hydrogen or H-bombs) has caused confusion? Those still use a fission core made from plutonium or uranium to start their destruction (tritium is then injected into the fission explosion to produce the fusion blast), so I assume it’s safe to call them atomic weapons as well. Fertilizer bombs use Ammonium Nitrate, which might sound vaguely like “Atomic” if one wasn’t paying attention. Kids, don’t try any of this at home. Sailboat ---
**Author:** ![OneCentStamp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/13edae/32.png) [@OneCentStamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OneCentStamp)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2007, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633/4 "2007-08-23T14:07:17Z")
He had to have been joking. How could someone not know what an atomic bomb is? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2007, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633/5 "2007-08-23T14:07:41Z")
Cool! I made my Instant Cream of Wheat this morning with an atomic weapon, which vibrates the atoms inside so they move incredibly fast, otherwise know as a tea kettle. ---
**Author:** ![Ponder\_Stibbons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ponder_stibbons/32/343_2.png) [@Ponder\_Stibbons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ponder_Stibbons)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2007, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633/6 "2007-08-23T14:11:16Z")
[QUOTE=kidchameleon] Cool! I made my Instant Cream of Wheat this morning with an atomic weapon, which vibrates the atoms inside so they move incredibly fast, otherwise know as a tea kettle. [/QUOTE] Sounds like a WMD to me. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2007, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633/7 "2007-08-23T14:24:48Z")
[QUOTE=Ponder Stibbons] Sounds like a WMD to me. [/QUOTE] A Weapon of Morning Deliciousness? ---
**Author:** ![Autumn\_Almanac](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d26b3c/32.png) [@Autumn\_Almanac](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Autumn_Almanac)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2007, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633/8 "2007-08-23T14:58:07Z")
[QUOTE=Otto] A Weapon of Morning Deliciousness? [/QUOTE] This is why I love this place. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2007, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633/9 "2007-08-23T15:23:36Z")
> [@](#): > > As a final note, the ‘atom bomb’ is probably a misnomer - the energy released from the detonation of an atom bomb is not due to an ‘atomic reaction’, but due to a ‘nuclear reaction’, where the nuclei are broken up. So, ‘nuclear bomb’ is the better way of referring to it. > **[What is the difference between atomic and nuclear physics?](https://www.physlink.com/education/askexperts/ae327.cfm)** > > Ask the experts your physics and astronomy questions, read answer archive, and more. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2007, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633/10 "2007-08-23T15:28:38Z")
[QUOTE=Liberal] > **[What is the difference between atomic and nuclear physics?](https://www.physlink.com/education/askexperts/ae327.cfm)** > > Ask the experts your physics and astronomy questions, read answer archive, and more. [/QUOTE] Answered by: Yasar Safkan, Ph.D. M.I.T., **Software Engineer** , Istanbul, Turkey [Appeal to Authority](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_authority) ---
**Author:** ![straight\_man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/straight_man/32/3027_2.png) [@straight\_man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/straight_man)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2007, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633/11 "2007-08-23T16:53:14Z")
[QUOTE=Fear Itself] Answered by: Yasar Safkan, Ph.D. M.I.T., **Software Engineer** , Istanbul, Turkey [Appeal to Authority](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_authority) [/QUOTE] Actually, AFAIK, Dr. Safkan is technically correct that “nuclear” is more accurate, and it was perfectly reasonable for **Liberal** to post a link – but it’s not the point. Whether it’s a bad term or not, “atomic bomb” is a term that is very specifically synonymous with “nuclear bomb”. But yeah, it seemed like **Derleth** was just being a wiseass, with all the obnoxiousness that implies. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2007, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633/12 "2007-08-23T17:15:16Z")
OK, as I posted in the GQ thread: > [@](#): > > Science isn’t a popularity contest and it isn’t decided by High Nabobs. I’ve explained my terminology. Can anyone offer a cogent explanation for calling a nuclear bomb an ‘atomic bomb’? And no, “we’ve always done it that way” is not a cogent explanation. BTW, I do believe this is my very first pitting. ---
**Author:** ![Enginerd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/bcef8e/32.png) [@Enginerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enginerd)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2007, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633/13 "2007-08-23T17:20:25Z")
“We’ve always done it this way” takes a back seat to “so people know what the hell you’re talking about.” ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2007, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633/14 "2007-08-23T17:24:22Z")
[QUOTE=Derleth] OK, as I posted in the GQ thread:And no, “we’ve always done it that way” is not a cogent explanation. BTW, I do believe this is my very first pitting. [/QUOTE] Have you ever heard of the term ‘splitting the atom’? ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2007, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633/15 "2007-08-23T17:33:47Z")
[QUOTE=Derleth] OK, as I posted in the GQ thread:And no, “we’ve always done it that way” is not a cogent explanation. [/QUOTE] Show me one cite where “atomic bomb” is used to describe a convention explosive weapon. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2007, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633/16 "2007-08-23T17:36:12Z")
Most of you posting so far aren’t getting it. **Enginerd** has the best response so far, for simple pragmatic reasons, but it still is an inaccurate and sloppy use of the language. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2007, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633/17 "2007-08-23T17:39:36Z")
[QUOTE=Derleth] ..it still is an inaccurate and sloppy use of the language. [/QUOTE] Which has never been a good reason to abandon widely accepted and understood terminology. ---
**Author:** ![Crotalus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crotalus/32/41_2.png) [@Crotalus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crotalus)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2007, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633/18 "2007-08-23T17:41:37Z")
Does anyone remember the US Atomic Energy Commission? I think the Father of the Atomic Bomb, Robert Oppenheimer did some work on it after WWII. We all get it. I don’t think I’m alone in understanding you perfectly, and thinking you’re a pedantic ass. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2007, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633/19 "2007-08-23T17:41:51Z")
[QUOTE=Otto] A Weapon of Morning Deliciousness? [/QUOTE] There’s a “eats stupid food for breakfast” joke in there somewhere…oh, are we done with that now? Rats. And now we’ve got the science nerds arguing… ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2007, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633/20 "2007-08-23T17:58:01Z")
[QUOTE=Fear Itself] Answered by: Yasar Safkan, Ph.D. M.I.T., **Software Engineer** , Istanbul, Turkey [Appeal to Authority](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_authority) [/QUOTE] Appeal to Wikipedia. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/derleth-you-may-be-beyond-help/416633.md?page=2)