# Dex: premature closing? **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [July 3, 2009, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804 "2009-07-03T12:44:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![ashman165](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8e8cbc/32.png) [@ashman165](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ashman165)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2009, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804/41 "2009-07-04T21:51:14Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > I have only one question, really. When did you and I fall out? I know that, due to various badly prescribed medications and general assholery, I have been hard to tolerate on many occasions. But I’ve been here ten years, and I’m outspoken. The point I’m making is that my memory is a bit like swiss cheese. I cannot recall when I first pissed you off or why, but there has to be something that hit you like a brick in the face because your screeds against me have been waaaaaay over the top, complete with searching for past transgressions (which is itself an exercise in great patience and frustration). If I contacted you by PM, is there any chance we could work things out? Apparently it wasn’t that great of an undertaking. =P If it helps, when you PM him, just drop my name. It’ll count for something, I’m sure. _liberally distributes hugs all around_ ---
**Author:** ![LurkMeister](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/3da27b/32.png) [@LurkMeister](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LurkMeister)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2009, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804/42 "2009-07-04T22:05:46Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > If I said, “Giraffe is the only poster who gets away with breaking rules,” I would intend it as a jab at you. Perhaps _you_ would, but I would be more likely to intend a remark like that to be a jab at the people who are supposed to be enforcing the rules. Pointing out that rules are being selectively enforced\* does not necessarily imply that the person who benefits from this is being insulted. Stating that someone expects or demands special treatment is another issue entirely, but I do not presume to know what other people mean when they make statements that are open to multiple interpretations. I can’t even read people’s minds when I’m in the same room with them, so I certainly wouldn’t try to do so when reading a pos5 on a message board. \*I would like to point out that I mean this in a purely hypothetical sense. I am not taking sides on the “ **Liberal** gets special treatment” issue, but merely making an observation that the intent of a statement can be interpreted in more than one way. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2009, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804/43 "2009-07-04T22:06:25Z")
> [@ashman165](#): > > Apparently it wasn’t that great of an undertaking. =P I had something I was trying to find this morning, and I mistakenly left out an “r”. I think I was searching for “treasure”. I realized my mistake as soon as I hit submit, but the software nevertheless told me that I could not search again for 300 seconds. (Five minutes.) So, I walked out to the back deck, watered the calibrachoas, went down to the barn to see if I could find the long handle shovel (I couldn’t), and then came back to try again. _Still_ had 72 seconds left. […sigh…] ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2009, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804/44 "2009-07-04T22:09:11Z")
> [@LurkMeister](#): > > Perhaps _you_ would, but I would be more likely to intend a remark like that to be a jab at the people who are supposed to be enforcing the rules. Pointing out that rules are being selectively enforced\* does not necessarily imply that the person who benefits from this is being insulted. Stating that someone expects or demands special treatment is another issue entirely, but I do not presume to know what other people mean when they make statements that are open to multiple interpretations. I can’t even read people’s minds when I’m in the same room with them, so I certainly wouldn’t try to do so when reading a pos5 on a message board. > \*I would like to point out that I mean this in a purely hypothetical sense. I am not taking sides on the “ **Liberal** gets special treatment” issue, but merely making an observation that the intent of a statement can be interpreted in more than one way. That certainly makes sense. Interpretation is so difficult that, in order to explain my faith in Great Debates, I’ve launched a whole series of threads, 80% of which are intended for nothing more than discussing how I define terms. So, I can see what you mean. ---
**Author:** ![ashman165](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8e8cbc/32.png) [@ashman165](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ashman165)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2009, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804/45 "2009-07-04T22:28:22Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > I had something I was trying to find this morning, and I mistakenly left out an “r”. I think I was searching for “treasure”. I realized my mistake as soon as I hit submit, but the software nevertheless told me that I could not search again for 300 seconds. (Five minutes.) So, I walked out to the back deck, watered the calibrachoas, went down to the barn to see if I could find the long handle shovel (I couldn’t), and then came back to try again. _Still_ had 72 seconds left. […sigh…] Maybe if you’d spent that last 72 seconds searching for the shovel, your report back to us would have been different. =P ---
**Author:** ![Seven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Seven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Seven)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2009, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804/46 "2009-07-05T00:23:18Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > If I said, “Giraffe is the only poster who gets away with breaking rules,” I would intend it as a jab at you. Ahh. But I didn’t word it like that. If I said “You are a total and complete douche that gets away with more shit than others because the mods often look away” - that would be a jab at you. If I said “You are a rules driving troll who expects the board to conform around him”.. that would be a jab at you. But I didn’t say those things. I said _this place_ (meaning the dope) makes rules around you. This is a jab at the dope. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2009, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804/47 "2009-07-05T01:39:38Z")
1. It’s not hard to find old posts of Liberal’s that show behavior that it seems to me would, given the pattern and frequency, have caused warnings if not outright bans. And I’m not the only one who can/has found long lists of them: From a mod: [See posts 86-88](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=409789). And [From a poster](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=2998087&postcount=4) Note the lack of overlaps between the two lists of meltdowns/tantrums/drama/hijacks/overreactions. Two people, ~5 years apart, each with long lists of Liberal troublemaking. There have been so many times he’s quit, melted down, left the boards, etc that they’re everywhere. It’s not like I’m searching for a needle in a haystack here. Hell, just do a search by name, look at the threads where he’s posted multiple times, especially the closed ones, and about 1 in 10 will have some kind of Liberal-centered drama. It’s constant, on-going and the board’s reaction seems to me to be different for this than any other poster. 2) Regarding the call for 'working things out" A) It’s not about Liberal and me, it’s about the board and Liberal. B) Even if it was between him and me, I’ve heard this song sung before and I know the final aria. [All three quotes come from this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=409789) but there are plenty of other examples: > [@](#): > > You are the only one who knows why this means so much to you. I can understand why you don’t like it, but I cannot understand why you stirred up so much shit over it. If all you wanted to do was express your opinion, you could have done that in one post. If all you wanted to do was understand why I did what I did, you could have asked. But I won’t be dragged from the back of your wagon while you use me as “Exibit A” in your morality parade. > > If at any point you wish to calm down and discuss this rationally one on one and by-god-listen, I’ll be happy to accomdate you. By e-mail or whatever you wish. 1. Note the “Why are you doing this to me” motif? Sound familiar? 2. This was addressed to **What\_Exit** who buried the hatchet and Liberal later turned on like a rabid animal, making up lies and disparaging his character in a cross-board feud. > [@](#): > > Is there anything that will bury that hatchet? One problem I’ve always had is born of a certain social naivity, which itself is born of early childhood withdrawal due to racial prejudice and abuse from a sibling — and that is that I cannot always effectively gage what will and will not hurt someone. Sometimes I hurt intentionally, because I’m mad or because I feel threatened. In your case, my intention was not to hurt, it was to edify, but it fell flat all the same. To know that you’re still angry is a revelation. And I sincerely apologize. Having left you angry for so long over so little is reprehensible on my part. To Twickster, who Liberal savaged after Twickster posted a self-deprecating thread where she was teasing herself about wanting to watch a TV show after spending a number of nights with a very sick friend. Liberal (after this ‘apology’) later tried to pass off his attack as an “oh-ho-ho, it was satire!” or something similar (I can’t find that one) > [@](#): > > Yes, I am to blame for my part in our falling out. There is no question of that. Nothing would please me more than making amends with you. If it takes an apology, I can muster a good 'un. (And no, I won’t pay you any money. ) But short of drawing blood, I’m willing to do whatever you think is necessary to bury this hurt. We might as well make something considered good by all come out of all this. To EddyTeddyFreddy after a…bizarre (there’s no other word for it) attack on her from out of the blue. I don’t know what the end result was–if he’s turned on her yet or not. Even if he hasn’t, it’s still the same pattern. [And one other I ran across:](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=2623918&postcount=1) > [@](#): > > I’m not going to put up any links or anything, but in a recent parody thread of mine, I offended you. I made you to feel that I thought you were stupid, and that I was smarter than you. I was paying so much attention to making sure that the thread was properly paralleled that I ran roughshod over you and your concerns. > > I am truly sorry from the bottom of my heart. And I want you to know what I really think of you. I think you’re a bright and witty contributor to Straight Dope, and I think some of your posts are the best I’ve seen in my three years here. > > I know that my passion can make me come across as unfeeling, but I’m not. When I break someone’s spirit as I did yours, my own heart is broken until I can make amends. > > I’m also not as intelligent as you make me out to be. If I were, then my company would be making a lot more money than it is. Besides, I’m one of the few Dopers without a college education, so I’m probably in the lowest ten-percentile anyway. > > I do apologize. And I’ll carve a special place for you in my memory so that I don’t hurt you again. So I don’t want to play that game. There are many MANY other examples of these “apologies” and in most cases case, Lib turns on the person doing it. So, no. I’m not play that game. But back on topic and away from Liberal again, it doesn’t seem to me that this kind of incredibly disruptive behavior over the years should have been tolerated by the mods for so long–certainly Otto was nowhere near as disruptive. Nor was Lissner and both were banned. I really do think there’s substance to the notion that the mods are looking at Liberal perhaps with blinders on, seeing only the latest meltdown and maybe not seeing the bigger pattern of his incredibly disruptive behavior. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2009, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804/48 "2009-07-05T01:50:29Z")
Oops–And [another ‘apology’](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=8410399&highlight=reconcile#post8410399), this time to TubaDiva who he later went on to make ‘fat jokes’ (“Tubbydiver” or similar) about. ---
**Author:** ![crypto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b3f665/32.png) [@crypto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crypto)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2009, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804/49 "2009-07-05T02:07:31Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > I have only one question, really. When did you and I fall out? I know that, due to various badly prescribed medications and general assholery, I have been hard to tolerate on many occasions. But I’ve been here ten years, and I’m outspoken. The point I’m making is that my memory is a bit like swiss cheese. I cannot recall when I first pissed you off or why, but there has to be something that hit you like a brick in the face because your screeds against me have been waaaaaay over the top, complete with searching for past transgressions (which is itself an exercise in great patience and frustration). If I contacted you by PM, is there any chance we could work things out? Why don’t you put this crap in a PM straight away to the poster and leave the rest of us out of it? You can’t. I’ve read so many of your pleas for understanding and where things went wrong, it’s starting to look like a cut and paste. And before you ask, please, don’t send me a PM. I don’t want to be your buddy. SFP PS. I agree with **Seven**. This place bends over backwards for you. Why is a mystery, but it can’t be denied. The SDMB has its reasons, but the only one I can come up with is that your presence generates a lot of traffic. Their board, their rules. I won’t see your reply unless someone quotes it, so please save the rest of the board the trouble and ignore this post. ---
**Author:** ![C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b2d939/32.png) [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/C_K_Dexter_Haven)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2009, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804/50 "2009-07-05T02:41:28Z")
I will discuss this with the other mods, but we long long ago had a guideline (etiquette, politeness, good manners but not a Rule) that, outside the Pit, we call everyone by their name and not by some nick-name or made-up name or pun on their name or anything else. The basic idea was that most nick-names and puns and such are meant as personal insults. I think this was one of those things that slipped by the wayside over time, and I don’t think it got embodied in our current listing. We’ll bring it up for moderator discussion. ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2009, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804/51 "2009-07-05T02:44:51Z")
So if I call \*\*Elucidator \*\*“luci” now I’m going to get in trouble? I won’t even ask what fate will befall me should I be so unwise as to refer to Mod \*\*Twickster \*\*as “Twix” or you as “Dex.” Perish forfend. And anyone who doesn’t spell out all eighty-three letters of my user name will presumably be in deep doo-doo, too. Am I insulting “Deep-Fried” by failing to use the elaborate symbols in his user name? ---
**Author:** ![C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b2d939/32.png) [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/C_K_Dexter_Haven)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2009, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804/52 "2009-07-05T02:51:34Z")
Oh, please. I brought it up for discussion. There’s clearly a difference between (hypothetical example) me calling you PRR to save space, and me calling you something like “pseudo rubber rubber” to imply that you’re hypocritical. Basically, I don’t mind being called “Dex” but others DO seem to mind being called by nick-names or pun-names. I’m just raising the question, since **Fenris** listed several people who presumably didn’t like being called by a distortion of their screennames. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2009, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804/53 "2009-07-05T02:58:35Z")
> [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](#): > > Basically, I don’t mind being called “Dex” but others DO seem to mind being called by nick-names or pun-names. I’m just raising the question, since **Fenris** listed several people who presumably didn’t like being called by a distortion of their screennames. Well, in fairness, Kel being called Karl, and VC03’s new name of TLDR(etc) being hosed, were, I think, mostly honest mistakes. Long and complicated usernames are going to get mangled from time to time. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2009, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804/54 "2009-07-05T03:47:38Z")
> [@Seven](#): > > I said _this place_ (meaning the dope) makes rules around you. This is a jab at the dope. My error, then. And my apology for misinterpreting you. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2009, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804/55 "2009-07-05T03:59:09Z")
> [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](#): > > Basically, I don’t mind being called “Dex” but others DO seem to mind being called by nick-names or pun-names. I’m usually called “Lib”, and have been since my first few weeks here. Doesn’t bother me a bit. In fact, I like it. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2009, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804/56 "2009-07-05T04:03:47Z")
Oops! Looks like I should have waited for the Pit to refer to **ashman165** as “noob.” I grovel. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2009, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804/57 "2009-07-05T14:34:12Z")
> [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > I won’t even ask what fate will befall me should I be so unwise as to refer to Mod \*\*Twickster \*\*as “Twix” … As long as you’re not doing so in order to compare me unfavorably to a candy bar, I’m okay with it. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![SkipMagic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skipmagic/32/20706_2.png) [@SkipMagic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SkipMagic)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2009, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804/58 "2009-07-05T18:13:58Z")
> [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > I won’t see your reply unless someone quotes it, so please save the rest of the board the trouble and ignore this post. Outside of the Pit, please do not let others know who is on your ignore list. If you want to Pit another poster, go ahead; but leave it out of ATMB. ---
**Author:** ![sailor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a587f6/32.png) [@sailor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sailor)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2009, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804/59 "2009-07-05T19:10:42Z")
> [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](#): > > I will discuss this with the other mods, but we long long ago had a guideline (etiquette, politeness, good manners but not a Rule) that, outside the Pit, we call everyone by their name and not by some nick-name or made-up name or pun on their name or anything else. The basic idea was that most nick-names and puns and such are meant as personal insults. > > I think this was one of those things that slipped by the wayside over time, and I don’t think it got embodied in our current listing. We’ll bring it up for moderator discussion. And [I am not allowed to say “regards Shodan”](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11285597&postcount=99) because that is another poster’s name. So, I cannot use a variation and I cannot use the actual name. Even in the pit. Is that bullshit or what? ---
**Author:** ![crypto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b3f665/32.png) [@crypto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crypto)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2009, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804/60 "2009-07-05T22:58:41Z")
> [@SkipMagic](#): > > Outside of the Pit, please do not let others know who is on your ignore list. If you want to Pit another poster, go ahead; but leave it out of ATMB. Noted: Apologies to you and the Board. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dex-premature-closing/501804.md?page=4)