# Diabetes caused by too much sugar? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 20, 2003, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diabetes-caused-by-too-much-sugar/183241 "2003-06-20T18:44:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![iamamoocher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b4bc9f/32.png) [@iamamoocher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iamamoocher)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diabetes-caused-by-too-much-sugar/183241/21 "2003-06-24T03:16:54Z")
senorbeef–This statement left me confused: “Now, the pancreas can only put out so much insulin. As cells become progressively more resistant, there comes a point at which your pancreas physically cannot produce enough insulin to properly affect the cells. You can’t produce enough insulin to regulate metabolic functions. This is when you have type 2 diabetes.” As I understand it Type I is when you can’t produce enough insulin. Type II is when your insulin receptors or cellular down-stream messengers can’t correctly transmit the blood glucose levels to the cell. Don’t type II diabetics have hyper-insulin levels in their blood? There is more than enough insulin circulating, but the cells can’t respond to the blood glucose. ---
**Author:** ![iamamoocher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b4bc9f/32.png) [@iamamoocher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iamamoocher)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diabetes-caused-by-too-much-sugar/183241/22 "2003-06-24T03:26:39Z")
I guess I should have said “enough insulin icirculating” should be relative to levels in non-diabetics. But if you’re type II, would injections of insulin correct the problem? In type I they do, don’t they? But what about type II? ---
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 5:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diabetes-caused-by-too-much-sugar/183241/23 "2003-06-24T05:18:01Z")
Type 2 diabetics start out with normal pancreatic function, but oftentimes their insulin production levels decrease over time until some Type 2s are producing barely any of their own insulin at all. I’m not clear on the reason for this, but it has something to do with either 1) a high glucose environment being toxic to the beta cells, or 2) high demand on the beta cells over a long period of time causing them to “tire out” and die, or 3) some combination of both. Yes, insulin injections will help the problem in a Type 2 diabetic; however, because your cells are still resistant to insulin even though you’re not producing much of your own anymore, the amounts of insulin that a Type 2 diabetic will need to inject are typically much higher than the amount a Type 1 needs. There are oral medications that Type 2 diabetics can take that have various effects. Some force your pancreas to crank out more insulin (although this is obviously only going to work if you still have some beta cell function left), some lessen insulin resistance. A lot of Type 2s will take oral medications in conjunction with insulin to achieve the best blood glucose control. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2003, 9:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diabetes-caused-by-too-much-sugar/183241/24 "2003-06-25T09:33:06Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by iamamoocher \* > \*\*As I understand it Type I is when you can’t produce enough insulin. > Type II is when your insulin receptors or cellular down-stream messengers can’t correctly transmit the blood glucose levels to the cell. > > Don’t type II diabetics have hyper-insulin levels in their blood? > > There is more than enough insulin circulating, but the cells can’t respond to the blood glucose. \*\* Well, they might have “more than enough insulin circulating”, in terms of what a normal person was used, but since their resistance is so high, even an elevated amount can’t accomplish the job. That’s the point I was trying to make. If it’s true that, as someone else said, insulin levels in the blood didn’t vary by diet, then I’m confused. I was under the impression that the amount of insulin released was proportional to the amount of sugars that needed to be processed. ---
**Author:** ![antechinus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/fbc32d/32.png) [@antechinus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/antechinus)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2003, 9:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diabetes-caused-by-too-much-sugar/183241/25 "2003-06-25T09:54:43Z")
Read up on **Syndrome X**. There was a New Scientist article on this a few years ago. IIRC, when the body is exposed to large amounts of sugar, a biofeedback mechanism in the liver is defeated which leads to **insulin resistance** and **increaded blood triglycerides** leading to type 2 diabetes, obesity and increased risk of heat disease. The article is at work and I am at home now - will read it and post more tomorrow. ---
**Author:** ![barbitu8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/839c29/32.png) [@barbitu8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/barbitu8)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2003, 11:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diabetes-caused-by-too-much-sugar/183241/26 "2003-06-25T11:49:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SenorBeef \* > \*\*If it’s true that, as someone else said, insulin levels in the blood didn’t vary by diet, then I’m confused. I was under the impression that the amount of insulin released was proportional to the amount of sugars that needed to be processed. \*\* > [@](#): > > Researchers at Michigan State and colleagues at Harvard and the U. of Alabama compared the insulin levels of almost 12,000 men and women to the number of calories they ate as carbohydrates. Those who took in 60 percent or more of their calories as carbohydrates - grains, fruits, vegetables, dairy foods (which have a carbohydrate known as lactose), even a fair amount of sweets - had no higher levels of insulin circulating in their bloodstreams than people who consumed 40 percent or less of their calories as carbohydrates. And the carb eaters were no heavier. As previously posted. The insulin levels go up after carbs, of course, but they do not stay elevated very long. If antechinus has a post to the contra, I’d like to see it, as the above cite is very recent. ---
**Author:** ![35340](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/3/8baadc/32.png) [@35340](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/35340)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2003, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diabetes-caused-by-too-much-sugar/183241/27 "2003-06-25T15:09:39Z")
So is tehre any link to auto immune disorders and diabetes? Both run in my family and I’ve been diagnosed with an auto immune disorder and insulin resistance (and a hormonal disorder that affects/is affected by the insulin resistance) ---
**Author:** ![antechinus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/fbc32d/32.png) [@antechinus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/antechinus)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2003, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diabetes-caused-by-too-much-sugar/183241/28 "2003-06-26T04:24:16Z")
Summarised New Scientist article, 1 September 2001. **Syndrome X** has been around since it was coined in the 1980’ by Gerry Reaven of Stanford University. Great name for a syndrome eh - he made up in other areas, what he lacks in imagination. Victor Zammit from the University of Ayr, Scotland has found evidence explaining the mechinism for the syndrome in rats. He reckons the same thing happens in humans. Recap: Each time we eat, insulin is released into the bloodstream. Its used to take glucose from the blood into the cells. If glucose hangs around in the blood to much , then it causes damage to the body. In the above article, it says that insulin also stops the liver from releasing fat (powerful fuel) into the blood. This is because the fats are also not a good thing to have hanging around in the blood. They are throttled back because we already have the glucose fuel there. Syndrome X is when this throttling back of the fats into the blood goes wrong - a result of frequent exposure of the liver to insulin for long periods without a decent rest. This is due to **frequent high energy snacks**. In rats, when insulin is present for long periods of time, a metabolic switch that turns off the fats breaks and the insulin stimulates even more release of fats (triglycerides). This sets up a vicious circle, where muscle cells become insulin resistant, more insulin is released so more fats are released etc… Eventually the bodys adipose cells become insulin resistant too. Finally, the excess triglycerides floating around kill off the insulin secreting pancreatic cells. Viola!! - type 2 diabetes. So the upshot is sugary foods could be just as damaging as fats. Recommendation: eat less often, leaving 4-5 hours between meals and cutting out snacks. This gives our body time to recover. Also, eat less fructose and sucrose (which is half fructose). Why fructose - because it is “selectively shunted towards the liver and the formation of fats”. I dont this this contradicts **barbitu8** ’s cite. You need to look at blood triglyceride concentration and insulin resistance in response to high carbohydrate diet. btw 100g chocholate bar has 25g fructose Can of cola has 15 g fructose Teaspoon of sugar (sucrose) has 2 g of fructose Bowl of cereal has 3 gram of fructose. “Insulin stimulation in hepatic triacylglycerol secretion and the etiology of insulin resistance” Victor Zammit et al - Journal of Nutrition, vol 131, p 2074 (2001) ---
**Author:** ![35340](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/3/8baadc/32.png) [@35340](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/35340)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2003, 9:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diabetes-caused-by-too-much-sugar/183241/29 "2003-06-26T09:41:36Z")
So, the way to determine if you have syndrome x or not is eat SFHM (small frequent Healthy meals) and if you start to lose weight, then it’s probably not syndrome X? See, one or two of the women I know with PCOS were supposedly first diagnosed with Syndrome X as well, but they haven’t mentioned it lately and are following an insulin resistant diet (I’m assuming it’s like the diabetic diet, I haven’t read my book yet). ---
**Author:** ![barbitu8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/839c29/32.png) [@barbitu8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/barbitu8)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2003, 9:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diabetes-caused-by-too-much-sugar/183241/30 "2003-06-26T09:54:15Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by antechinus \* > \*\*Syndrome X is when this throttling back of the fats into the blood goes wrong - a result of frequent exposure of the liver to insulin for long periods without a decent rest. This is due to **frequent high energy snacks**. > > So the upshot is sugary foods could be just as damaging as fats. > > \*\* Sure, if you sit around and eat sweets all day, you are asking for trouble, but I don’t think the proper conclusion is that sugary foods can be just as damaging as fats. Well, I agree, but how damaging is that? Not much in moderation. All things in moderation. > [@](#): > > Recommendation: eat less often, leaving 4-5 hours between meals and cutting out snacks. This gives our body time to recover. Also, eat less fructose and sucrose (which is half fructose). Why fructose - because it is “selectively shunted towards the liver and the formation of fats”. Normal eating times are at least 4-5 hours apart. An occasional snack is not going to hurt you. It’s when you snack consistently and persistently that problems occur. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2003, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diabetes-caused-by-too-much-sugar/183241/31 "2003-06-26T14:56:01Z")
That reminds me, actually, when I cut the carbs out of my diet, my blood triglycerides were reduced to 10% (!) of what they were. I _think_ the numbers were the mid-700s vs 70s, although I might be wrong on that. I do remember that they were cut by about 90%. ---
**Author:** ![antechinus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/fbc32d/32.png) [@antechinus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/antechinus)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2003, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diabetes-caused-by-too-much-sugar/183241/32 "2003-06-26T23:23:09Z")
**barbitu8** That right. Back to the OP. JetJaguar, said that s(he) eats “lot of chocolate and candy at work”. Well according to the research, that IS increasing the risk of developing diabetes and heart disease, via syndrome X. Stick to fruit - it contains less fructose than lollies and also contains lots of other goodies. To get your carbohydrates, the research shows that it is better to eat complex carbs such as grains with a lot of fibre and corresponding prolonged release of energy. NOT lollies and softdrinks. And of course exercise. ok im off my soapbox now ---
**Author:** ![barbitu8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/839c29/32.png) [@barbitu8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/barbitu8)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2003, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diabetes-caused-by-too-much-sugar/183241/33 "2003-06-27T00:11:57Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by antechinus \* > \*\*Stick to fruit - it contains less fructose than lollies and also contains lots of other goodies. > > To get your carbohydrates, the research shows that it is better to eat complex carbs such as grains with a lot of fibre and corresponding prolonged release of energy. NOT lollies and softdrinks. > > And of course exercise. > > ok im off my soapbox now \*\* Fruit’s sugar is primarily fructose (which is aka fruit sugar). “Lollies” (which I assume is meant candies) contain primarily glucose. I agree with all the other points. I also believe that fruits are much better than sweets even tho they contain fructose. > [@](#): > > Why fructose - because it is “selectively shunted towards the liver and the formation of fats”. Fructose is shunted towards the liver because it has to be broken down into its constituent sugars, glucose and sucrose. I don’t understand this “formation of fats.” Any excess calories will be stored as fat. I need more verbiage from that link or some other more elucidating info on this matter. IMHO fructose is decidedly better than glucose, unless you are exercising and need more immediate energy, as fructose is not immediately available for energy, having to be broken down first. In fact, fructose is recommended to diabetics for just this reason, as I understand it. ---
**Author:** ![barbitu8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/839c29/32.png) [@barbitu8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/barbitu8)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2003, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diabetes-caused-by-too-much-sugar/183241/34 "2003-06-27T21:54:41Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SenorBeef \* > \*\*That reminds me, actually, when I cut the carbs out of my diet, my blood triglycerides were reduced to 10% (!) of what they were. I _think_ the numbers were the mid-700s vs 70s, although I might be wrong on that. I do remember that they were cut by about 90%. \*\* Many foods containing carbs also contain saturated fates and trans fats, so this effect may have been caused by your cutting that out from your diet. **Mynn** > [@](#): > > So is tehre any link to auto immune disorders and diabetes? Both run in my family and I’ve been diagnosed with an auto immune disorder and insulin resistance (and a hormonal disorder that affects/is affected by the insulin resistance) DM, Type 1, is an autoimmune disorder. Your body attacks the beta cells in your pancreas that produces insulin. ---
**Author:** ![antechinus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/fbc32d/32.png) [@antechinus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/antechinus)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2003, 11:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diabetes-caused-by-too-much-sugar/183241/35 "2003-06-28T11:37:23Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by barbitu8 \* > \*\*Fruit’s sugar is primarily fructose (which is aka fruit sugar). “Lollies” (which I assume is meant candies) contain primarily glucose. > > I agree with all the other points. I also believe that fruits are much better than sweets even tho they contain fructose. > Fructose is shunted towards the liver because it has to be broken down into its constituent sugars, glucose and sucrose. I don’t understand this “formation of fats.” Any excess calories will be stored as fat. I need more verbiage from that link or some other more elucidating info on this matter. IMHO fructose is decidedly better than glucose, unless you are exercising and need more immediate energy, as fructose is not immediately available for energy, having to be broken down first. In fact, fructose is recommended to diabetics for just this reason, as I understand it. \*\* Yes, fruit sugar is fructose, however there is not much of it in fruit compared to the mega fructose hit you get from candies and softdrinks. Fructose is not broken down into glucose and sucrose. Sucrose (eg from candies) is broken down into fructose and glucose. Glucose and fructose are both converted to gycogen in the liver, then once the liver has stored its full capacity of glycogen the energy is then converted to fat, which is then stored in adipoise tissue around the body. My understanding is that fructose is preferentialy converted to fat in the liver over glucose. The reason diabetics eat fructose is that it has to be converted into glucose in the liver, which dampens out the blood sugar (ie glucose) concentration curve. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2003, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diabetes-caused-by-too-much-sugar/183241/36 "2003-06-28T23:32:24Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by barbitu8 \* > \*\*Many foods containing carbs also contain saturated fates and trans fats, so this effect may have been caused by your cutting that out from your diet. > > \*\* Unlikely. I started almost every day with a large bacon and sausage breakfast, and the rest of my eating habits were quite loaded with saturated fat. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diabetes-caused-by-too-much-sugar/183241.md?page=1)