# Diacritic to make U sound like "oo" **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 4, 2009, 6:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diacritic-to-make-u-sound-like-oo/491954 "2009-04-04T06:38:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 8\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2009, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diacritic-to-make-u-sound-like-oo/491954/21 "2009-04-06T17:39:08Z")
Even if you’re right, and the diaeresis/umlaut does change the pronunciation, how can you have any confidence that it will change the pronunciation to the one you want. Consider that you are trying to indicate a pronunciation that would be contraindicated in German orthography, which is the most likely language that an English speaker might know the symbol from. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2009, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diacritic-to-make-u-sound-like-oo/491954/22 "2009-04-06T17:42:23Z")
> [@Ximenean](#): > > It seems to me that German speakers pronounce the umlauted ü differently in some words, such as “München” and “zurück”. In those cases, the “ü” is indeed more like the English vowel encountered in words such as “put”, than the standard rounded “ee” sound. They don’t seem to say a rounded version of “Meenchen” or “tsureek” - instead, it’s more like “Muhnchen” and “tsooruhk”. There are two sounds indicated by _ü_ in standard German. One is [y], which is a rounded \* (“long”). The other is [Y], which is a rounded \* (“short”). ---
**Author:** ![Indistinguishable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/90ced4/32.png) [@Indistinguishable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indistinguishable)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2009, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diacritic-to-make-u-sound-like-oo/491954/23 "2009-04-06T17:52:05Z")
I think that last character should actually be \*. ETA: Hey! The board changed it; that was supposed to be capitalized. I guess it’s trying to parse it weirdly because the brackets initially look like a tag or something… ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2009, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diacritic-to-make-u-sound-like-oo/491954/24 "2009-04-06T22:44:00Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > There are two sounds indicated by _ü_ in standard German. One is [y], which is a rounded \* (“long”). The other is [Y], which is a rounded \* (“short”). As with all other vowels, the quality of the vowel will impact the sound that is made when pronouncing it. A “short” vowel, like a short vowel sound in English, is somewhat less intense than the long vowel sound. ---
**Author:** ![Ximenean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/aca169/32.png) [@Ximenean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ximenean)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2009, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diacritic-to-make-u-sound-like-oo/491954/25 "2009-04-06T23:10:16Z")
But what exactly is a “long” or “short” vowel, anyway? Do phoneticists use such terms? ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2009, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diacritic-to-make-u-sound-like-oo/491954/26 "2009-04-06T23:16:52Z")
No, they don’t generally. That’s why I used quotation marks. ---
**Author:** ![Svejk\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@Svejk\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Svejk_1)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2009, 9:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diacritic-to-make-u-sound-like-oo/491954/27 "2009-04-07T09:45:13Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > > [@Ximenean](#): > > > > It seems to me that German speakers pronounce the umlauted ü differently in some words, such as “München” and “zurück”. In those cases, the “ü” is indeed more like the English vowel encountered in words such as “put”, than the standard rounded “ee” sound. They don’t seem to say a rounded version of “Meenchen” or “tsureek” - instead, it’s more like “Muhnchen” and “tsooruhk”. > > There are two sounds indicated by _ü_ in standard German. One is [y], which is a rounded \* (“long”). The other is [Y], which is a rounded [I] (“short”). That’s right, the ü in \*München \*is not like the one in _zurück_, but neither one of them is supposed to sound remotely like ‘u’ in ‘put’. I find that ‘ee’ approximates ‘ü’ much better (but it is still only an approximation). ETA: Only now do I see that the second I in square brackets is supposed to be capitalized! ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2009, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diacritic-to-make-u-sound-like-oo/491954/28 "2009-04-07T12:39:12Z")
As **Indistinguishable** noted the “I” gets jiggered by the board software. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diacritic-to-make-u-sound-like-oo/491954.md?page=1)