# Dick and Richard **URL:** \ **Category:** Cecil's Columns/Staff Reports\ **Created:** [August 7, 2011, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dick-and-richard/591870 "2011-08-07T21:42:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 7\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![indi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/f475e1/32.png) [@indi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/indi)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2011, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dick-and-richard/591870/1 "2011-08-07T21:42:31Z")
The French and the Norse resided together and mangled each others pronunciation. Richard would be pronounced by the Norse as ichhhard, because they had a dickens of a time trilling their tongues similar to their french counterparts. I suppose in today’s vernacular, this is more embarrassing. But returning to the Middle- Ages, abbreviations were also rampant and Rich, pronounced almost as errichhh evolved to richt and this had many positive, at that time, connotations. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2011, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dick-and-richard/591870/2 "2011-08-07T21:58:18Z")
Is [this](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2030/what-came-first-dick-or-dick) what you’re referring to? ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2011, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dick-and-richard/591870/3 "2011-08-07T22:09:55Z")
> [@indi](#): > > The French and the Norse resided together and mangled each others pronunciation. Richard would be pronounced by the Norse as ichhhard, because they had a dickens of a time trilling their tongues similar to their french counterparts. I suppose in today’s vernacular, this is more embarrassing. But returning to the Middle- Ages, abbreviations were also rampant and Rich, pronounced almost as errichhh evolved to richt and this had many positive, at that time, connotations. Can you give any readable cites as to your assertions? I’d love to see them. ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2011, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dick-and-richard/591870/4 "2011-08-11T21:20:14Z")
I always figured we got Dick out of Richard the same way we got Peggy out of Margaret: British fondness for shortening and rhyming names. Like so: Margaret -\> Margie -\> Maggie -\> Meggie -\> Peggy Richard -\> Rich -\> Rick -\> Dick ---
**Author:** ![Capitaine\_Zombie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e95f7d/32.png) [@Capitaine\_Zombie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capitaine_Zombie)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 6:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dick-and-richard/591870/5 "2011-08-12T06:52:02Z")
> [@indi](#): > > The French and the Norse resided together and mangled each others pronunciation. Richard would be pronounced by the Norse as ichhhard, because they had a dickens of a time trilling their tongues similar to their french counterparts. I suppose in today’s vernacular, this is more embarrassing. But returning to the Middle- Ages, abbreviations were also rampant and Rich, pronounced almost as errichhh evolved to richt and this had many positive, at that time, connotations. More than dubious, the Norman dialect is very close to the French spoken at that time. I mean I can read it and understand large parts of it, I cant do that with Occitan. By the time the Normans gathered their armies to invade England, they were culturally very close to the French. ---
**Author:** ![Floater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/dc4da7/32.png) [@Floater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Floater)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2011, 10:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dick-and-richard/591870/6 "2011-08-12T10:24:02Z")
> [@samclem](#): > > Can you give any readable cites as to your assertions? I’d love to see them. So would I. Norse had actually two _r_ sounds, one similar to present English _r_, used at the end of words and one rolling, like Scottish _r_-s. The velar _r_ sound produced by the back of the tongue that is used in present French is a speech impediment that became a fashion some time in the 17th century (I think). ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2011, 7:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dick-and-richard/591870/7 "2011-08-13T07:56:29Z")
> [@indi](#): > > The French and the Norse resided together and mangled each others pronunciation. Richard would be pronounced by the Norse as ichhhard, because they had a dickens of a time trilling their tongues similar to their french counterparts. I suppose in today’s vernacular, this is more embarrassing. But returning to the Middle- Ages, abbreviations were also rampant and Rich, pronounced almost as errichhh evolved to richt and this had many positive, at that time, connotations. Yeah, that’s why the Norse alphabet is called the unic alphabet and their doomsday agnaok.