# Dictionaries do not win complex debates, you assholes. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 7, 2002, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dictionaries-do-not-win-complex-debates-you-assholes/102322 "2002-04-07T16:16:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dictionaries-do-not-win-complex-debates-you-assholes/102322/41 "2002-04-09T16:42:15Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by tetsusaru \* > \*\*Last time I checked, “useage” was spelt usage. \*\* um, I think that was the point being made. **peep** your two posts in this thread could be seen as ‘joking’ or as rude. Which please? (ie who are you attempting to portray as a hypocrite, and why pick on **Byz** ’s post w/a ‘putz’ smilie? ) you seem to be new here, so I’m willing to listen to clarification. ---
**Author:** ![JeffB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jeffb/32/188_2.png) [@JeffB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JeffB)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dictionaries-do-not-win-complex-debates-you-assholes/102322/42 "2002-04-09T16:56:47Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by peepthis \* > \*\* > **PAGING GAUDERE!** > > Unless you mean an honest-to-god donnybrook has broken out on the SDMB, I believe the word you’re grasping for is “milieu.” Words are power, indeed!:wally \*\* I believe the word that **Byzantine** wanted was the one she used – _melee_ (“a lively contention or debate”) – quite apropos (“to the point or purpose”). Honest-to-god donnybrooks (“heated argument”) are quite common on the SDMB. I don’t think she was refering to the internet environment. [sub]All definitions brought to courtesy of the OED.[/sub] ---
**Author:** ![peepthis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9d8465/32.png) [@peepthis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peepthis)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dictionaries-do-not-win-complex-debates-you-assholes/102322/43 "2002-04-09T17:04:38Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by wring \* > \*\ ***peep** your two posts in this thread could be seen as ‘joking’ or as rude. Which please? (ie who are you attempting to portray as a hypocrite, and why pick on **Byz** ’s post w/a ‘putz’ smilie? ) > > you seem to be new here, so I’m willing to listen to clarification. \*\* Sorry, old timer, but looking at my profile I see I’ve been here only 5 months less than you. I’ll be sure to try harder to be more noticeable from here on out. The “hypocrite” reference was a poke in the ribs to **Fenris** , who in the link I provided (did you bother to check it?) posts just a dictionary definition. And I though it was quite obvious that on **Byz’s** post I was pointing out Gaudere’s Law, which has always been an amusingly ironic in-joke on the SDMB (her vehemence on proper usage made it all the better!). The Wally smiley was for the benefit of people, such as yourself, who might not have understood the joshing nature of the post. Thank you for your forbearance on this matter. ---
**Author:** ![peepthis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9d8465/32.png) [@peepthis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peepthis)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dictionaries-do-not-win-complex-debates-you-assholes/102322/44 "2002-04-09T17:17:38Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by JeffB \* > \*\* > > I believe the word that **Byzantine** wanted was the one she used – _melee_ (“a lively contention or debate”) – quite apropos (“to the point or purpose”). Honest-to-god donnybrooks (“heated argument”) are quite common on the SDMB. I don’t think she was refering to the internet environment.\*\* Sorry to suck up bandwidth, since I didn’t see this post til after I put in the last one. Reading it that way, **Jeff** , I see how melée could be the intended word here (even if not the best word choice, since I’ve always seen it used to mean “a confused struggle; especially a hand-to-hand fight among several people”). If so, :wally to me… ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dictionaries-do-not-win-complex-debates-you-assholes/102322/45 "2002-04-09T17:39:41Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by peepthis \* > \*\* > The “hypocrite” reference was a poke in the ribs to **Fenris** , who in the link I provided (did you bother to check it?) posts just a dictionary definition_\* Although, just to be clear, the definition was intended as a snide comment on the fact that SweatWilly is the king of “Here’s the definition of the word. QED, I win!” Also, if you look at the third defintion, you’ll see it’s not precisely a C&P. Fenris ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dictionaries-do-not-win-complex-debates-you-assholes/102322/46 "2002-04-09T18:21:19Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by peepthis \* > \*\*Sorry, old timer, but looking at my profile I see I’ve been here only 5 months less than you. I’ll be sure to try harder to be more noticeable from here on out… \*\* well, this certainly clears things up for me. I looked at your post count, doesn’t matter to me when you first signed up. I dont’ recall seeing you before, and saw only 400 posts, hence the term ‘relatively new’. which, as you know can mean several different things. I appreciate you clearing up any confusion about your intent. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dictionaries-do-not-win-complex-debates-you-assholes/102322/47 "2002-04-09T18:50:25Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Fenris \* > \*\* > Although, just to be clear, the definition was intended as a snide comment on the fact that SweatWilly is the king of “Here’s the definition of the word. QED, I win!” Also, if you look at the third defintion, you’ll see it’s not precisely a C&P. > > Fenris \*\* ``` I am SHOCKED! Shocked that you would insult my Special Friend when he's not around to defend himself. ``` Before Sweet Willy opened my eyes, I had no clue about the racism of the Smiley. But look at this-😛 ! A Smiley the _exact_ color of Tars Tarkas! Why should he, alone among the Dopers, have a Smiley that matches his skin? ``` As a Jew, I am ashamed to admit that we turn away converts who might not be serious about their committment to Judaism. I can't even look my reflection in the eyes anymore. ``` And, we keep the Middle East conflict going by refusing to abandon our religion and culture! If we would just copy the beliefs of every one around us, this whole thing would end! So I’ll stand by Sweet Willy. It’s just me and him against a vast, racist conspiracy claiming to be motivated by “truth”, “historical facts”, “logic and reason” and a “decent understanding of the English language”. BTW Fenris-I thought that the Great Wolf, like his father, was imprisoned in a cave in Midgard. Wasn’t the roaring of Fenris and the shaking of Loki(when a drop of venokm hits him) supposed to be responsible for earthquakes? Shouldn’t your location be Midgard? Or possibly Midgard-in a cave-bound by Glepnir ? ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2002, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dictionaries-do-not-win-complex-debates-you-assholes/102322/48 "2002-04-09T19:53:36Z")
> [@](#): > > I do not have that at my command in an internet melee. > > PAGING GAUDERE! > > Unless you mean an honest-to-god donnybrook has broken out on the SDMB, I believe the word you’re grasping for is “milieu.” Words are power, indeed! After better than two years combatting ignorance, I think that **Byzantine** selected _le mot juste_ for the situation. (Especially since she usually posts in the Pit, anyway!) And **Doc Cathode** , what do you think we keep **Freyr** around for, if not to defeat **Fenris** at the proper time? ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2002, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dictionaries-do-not-win-complex-debates-you-assholes/102322/49 "2002-04-10T16:22:07Z")
“When I use a word, it means what I want it to mean!” – Humpty Dumpty Sitting on a Wall ---
**Author:** ![Byzantine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/dfb087/32.png) [@Byzantine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Byzantine)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 5:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dictionaries-do-not-win-complex-debates-you-assholes/102322/50 "2002-04-17T05:52:19Z")
peepthis: Someone needs attention! Obviously, you need mine. Look, you worthless peon: that I used, “melee”, in connection with the thought of, “Confused, hand-to-hand fighting in a pitched battle or a violent free-for-all or a tumultuous mingling, as of a crowd,” is correct. Look it up yourself in any dictionary. Oh, wait, that might hurt your pin-point head! That YOU would like me to use the word, “Milieu” is entirely different. Milieu, meaning, “environment, surroundings, center.” Oh wait, your point was that I was the fuck up? Can I get a Pit Vote on this? No, really wait just a moment, WHO fucked up? Me or Johnny Post Lately? Let’s just go back to the point, I mean mine, not the protrusion on peepthis’s head…😉 Let’s all sit back and suck that up. The total bitch for words made a massive mistake and this total newbie “caught” it. Yeah. That’s what happened. I fucked up so bad my head wouldn’t work. And I’m So New It Hurts caught me out. Yeah, that’s what happened. For other neat shit that came from space go to: [GETCLUE.COM](http://GETCLUE.COM). Let me know how you like it. Um, hey look, I’m all for that someone has the wrong dictionary or idea…I don’t know what planet you got yours from. Look it up again and let me and everyone else in the Pit know. Really. I don’t want to sway anyone based on a load of crap. I’m sure you don’t either. If I’m THAT wrong, let the posters weigh in. Let them post up against me. Point out the wrongness of the word and all. No, really. Go ahead. Give post, site, something. Back up the Fuck up. It’ll make his day and mine. Because I don’t think I did. But I’m always open…where or how did I fuck up? Thanks. Best! Byz ---
**Author:** ![peepthis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9d8465/32.png) [@peepthis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peepthis)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 8:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dictionaries-do-not-win-complex-debates-you-assholes/102322/51 "2002-04-17T08:11:35Z")
Hey there, **Byz**! Glad to see it only took you _one whole week_ to compose a riposte! What, was there a waiting list to use the computer at Special Needs Center, or has the syphilis finally rotted all the way through your cerebrum? And what a clever one it was: HOO BOY, I’m sure I speak for us all in saluting your originality in “pointy head” and anti-newbie jokes! Even though, get this, I’ve been here for a while! Only Jack Chick could elicit more “HAW HAWs”! And I still stick by my assertion that “melee” was far from the best word choice; but, hey, I guess I should be proud that you’re finally moving into the wonderful world of multi-syllabism! Way to go, old timer! Cheers! peepthis [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dictionaries-do-not-win-complex-debates-you-assholes/102322.md?page=2)