# Did any Star Trek episode have a character with no job? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 5, 2016, 7:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913 "2016-12-05T07:40:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2016, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913/121 "2016-12-08T21:06:31Z")
> [@Balthisar](#): > > Isn’t Picard’s brother a vigneron? No, he’s human, just like his brother. What? ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2016, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913/122 "2016-12-08T21:21:24Z")
> [@bump](#): > > I always wondered how that could be so though. Bear with me through a bit of fan-wankery / thinking out loud. > > I always assumed the replicators were a direct outgrowth of transporter technology [SNIP] Behold: [The Transtator!](http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Transtator) I blame the Iotions. They wanted too big of a piece of the action, and they cornered the replication recipe market, setting us up for their **House of Pies in Space** start ups all over the Federation that sell non replicated foodstuffs. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2016, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913/123 "2016-12-08T21:46:16Z")
If replicators are so freakin’ good, why are there still cargo bays on starships and, indeed, dedicated cargo transports plying the Galactic trade routes? Clearly, some non-replicated commodities must still be in demand, and ways of paying for them must continue to exist. Otherwise, bulk storage and shipment would be a tremendous waste of resources, especially space, energy, and time. ---
**Author:** ![Cartoonacy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/848f3c/32.png) [@Cartoonacy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartoonacy)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2016, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913/124 "2016-12-08T21:51:05Z")
Wikipedia says: > [@](#): > > A replicator works by rearranging subatomic particles, which are abundant everywhere in the universe, to form molecules and arrange those molecules to form the object. For example, to create a pork chop, the replicator would first form atoms of carbon, hydrogen, nitrogen, etc., then arrange them into amino acids, proteins, and cells, and assemble the particles into the form of a pork chop. > > This process requires the destructive conversion of bulk matter into energy and its subsequent reformation into a pre-scanned matter pattern. In principle, this is similar to the transporter, but on a smaller scale. However, unlike transporters, which duplicate matter at the quantum level, replicators must be capable of a large number of different materials on demand. If patterns were to be stored at the quantum level, an impossible amount of data storage (or a set of original copies of the materials) would be required. To resolve this, patterns are stored in memory at the molecular level. > > The drawback of doing so is that it is impossible to replicate objects with complicated quantum structures, such as living beings, dilithium, or latinum. In reality, living beings and/or cited elements are not necessarily more complex on a quantum level; the putative ‘extra complexity’ is used an in-universe function to head off questions such as ‘why can’t Starfleet replicate people?’ In the TNG episode “Allegiance”, aliens used their version of replicators to create a Picard impostor. Additionally, read/write errors cause a number of single-bit errors to occur in replicated materials. Though usually undetectable to human senses, computer scanning can be used to reveal these discrepancies, and they may explain the frequent complaint (by some gourmets and connoisseurs) that replicated food and beverages suffer from substandard taste. The gist of it is, if you have an original object on hand (as with the transporter), a replicator can scan it and make an exact duplicate. But storing the structures of an unlimited number of objects at a quantum level is impractical, so the replicator data banks just store approximations of common objects and recipes. No citations, though, so I don’t know how much of this is Roddenberry-canon and how much is fan speculation. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2016, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913/125 "2016-12-08T21:51:13Z")
Well, all it takes is a little ding on the hull and something goes offline. I imagine it makes sense to have important things available even if the replicators go offline. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2016, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913/126 "2016-12-08T21:58:08Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > If replicators are so freakin’ good, why are there still cargo bays on starships and, indeed, dedicated cargo transports plying the Galactic trade routes? > > Clearly, some non-replicated commodities must still be in demand, and ways of paying for them must continue to exist. > > Otherwise, bulk storage and shipment would be a tremendous waste of resources, especially space, energy, and time. Fanwank: Replicated food is important, because you need it every day. Food replicators can be small. But the replicator has to be bigger than what it is making. To replicate furniture, for example, you need a bigger machine. Furniture is not as important as food, so they don’t have large, high capacity furniture replicators in every house. If you are one of the slackers, the layabouts, the lilies of the field, you just use your holodeck for furniture. No one mistakes holodeck matter for the real thing. And someone has to ship all those replicators!:smack: Plus, don’t forget that replicated items need to get their mass from somewhere. Either the machine is converting bulk raw material into what is being replicated, or it is turning pure energy into replicated items. On a Starship, you have access to the warp drive; on earth, whatever limitless power source they have. But on some colony? Maybe they don’t have the power, so stuff has to be shipped. ---
**Author:** ![dzeiger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/46a35a/32.png) [@dzeiger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dzeiger)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2016, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913/127 "2016-12-09T02:34:30Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Plus, there’s the other time when they mention how it can’t handle tomato soup right. I think O’Brien says it. My fanwank for that is that the replicator perfectly duplicates tomato soup, but that’s like getting a can of Campbell’s soup–the same thing every single can, but it’s not the same soup you mom makes. If you knew the differences between Campbell’s and your mom’s recipe, you might be able to program the replicator to get it the same, but you don’t–so you end up thinking “I think he had more basil,” trying that, but it’s still not quite the same. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2016, 11:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913/128 "2016-12-09T11:03:03Z")
… So, in other words, replicators aren’t really that great after all. Their possibilities are severely restricted by a number of factors. ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2016, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913/129 "2016-12-09T15:09:03Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > Fanwank: > > Replicated food is important, because you need it every day. Food replicators can be small. But the replicator has to be bigger than what it is making. > > To replicate furniture, for example, you need a bigger machine. Furniture is not as important as food, so they don’t have large, high capacity furniture replicators in every house. I dunno. Transporters don’t need any mechanicals on the receiving end. (Although they have implied in a couple TNG episodes that the transporter process is somehow “better” if there is…) Maybe all you need is the control unit connected to a transporter-like pad, and you don’t actually need to have an enclosure big enough to entirely surround the object being replicated. (Maybe having an enclosure is a safety feature, so that people are reminded not to place things, like body parts, in the materialization area.) ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2016, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913/130 "2016-12-09T18:32:10Z")
Yes, “transporter/replicator” technology is fun to fanwank, and not that difficult, since the basic concepts are not difficult to understand (as opposed to warp drive engines, which are just technobabble for “going faster than light, which really cannot be done, but there’d be no show without it, so who knows or cares exactly how they work!?”). I think the limiting factors would have to be 1) availability of energy/raw material for producing the items, and 2) availability of detailed patterns to use for replication. Even among chocolate afficianados, there is not always consensus about what is truly good chocolate. So clearly Deanna Troi is simply not impressed with chocolate that is replicated, because it doesn’t ever meet her particular imagined idea of “real” chocolate. And Riker was never smart enough to buy her a birthday present consisting of the replication pattern for Altairian Dream Chocolate. ---
**Author:** ![Quimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/22d042/32.png) [@Quimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quimby)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2016, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913/131 "2016-12-09T19:53:10Z")
Something called an “Industrial replicator” has been mentioned in episodes so there probably is something to the theory that not all replicators are created equal. ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2016, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913/132 "2016-12-10T06:12:59Z")
> [@Quimby](#): > > Something called an “Industrial replicator” has been mentioned in episodes so there probably is something to the theory that not all replicators are created equal. Now, I’m sure that there’s an Amendment to the Federation Charter that ensures replicators equal protection of the laws. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2016, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913/133 "2016-12-12T21:02:11Z")
> [@DSYoungEsq](#): > > Even among chocolate afficianados, there is not always consensus about what is truly good chocolate. So clearly Deanna Troi is simply not impressed with chocolate that is replicated, because it doesn’t ever meet her particular imagined idea of “real” chocolate. And Riker was never smart enough to buy her a birthday present consisting of the replication pattern for Altairian Dream Chocolate. That makes sense; I could see someone getting kind of tired of having the exact same hamburger/chocolate bar/burrito/etc… every single time they had a hamburger, no matter how good it is. I wonder if there’s maybe some kind of hybrid; like culinary replicators that replicate raw steaks, veggies, etc… and then trained culinary staff actually produce food out of them. Or whatever intermediate level they choose; maybe they replicate a pie crust in a pan, and then fill it with whatever fillings they make. Or maybe they replicate flour, and sugar, and then add water and real yeast, and make bread. This way the ship would be able to recycle sewage, etc… into replicatable raw material, but not have to go through the intermediate steps of purifying, growing crops, etc… ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2016, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913/134 "2016-12-12T21:06:14Z")
Though this thread does make me want to see a scene where the ship arrives to rescue people, one of the crew asks one of the rescued people what s/he does for a living and the person laughs and says 'This is the Federation. I don’t have to do jack! I’m improving myself by having fun and seeing the universe!" 😃 ---
**Author:** ![galen\_ubal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/galen_ubal/32/4440_2.png) [@galen\_ubal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/galen_ubal)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2016, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913/135 "2016-12-12T23:00:11Z")
> [@bump](#): > > That makes sense; I could see someone getting kind of tired of having the exact same hamburger/chocolate bar/burrito/etc… every single time they had a hamburger, no matter how good it is. > > I wonder if there’s maybe some kind of hybrid; like culinary replicators that replicate raw steaks, veggies, etc… and then trained culinary staff actually produce food out of them. Or whatever intermediate level they choose; maybe they replicate a pie crust in a pan, and then fill it with whatever fillings they make. Or maybe they replicate flour, and sugar, and then add water and real yeast, and make bread. > > This way the ship would be able to recycle sewage, etc… into replicatable raw material, but not have to go through the intermediate steps of purifying, growing crops, etc… Actually, I’d say there’s pretty good odds of that. Remember the galley in _Star Trek VI_? I don’t have the scene handy, but as I recall there was any number of ingredients (a whole turkey?) sitting around in there. It had to come from somewhere, and I can see it being more likely from a replicator than frozen stores. It was the scene where they’d searched for the boots, and were wondering why they hadn’t been phasered out of existence. Valeris pulled a phaser from a wall locker (?!), vapourised a pile of dough, and all kind of alarms went off. Security arrived quite smartly, as I recall. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2016, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913/136 "2016-12-12T23:07:55Z")
> [@galen\_ubal](#): > > Actually, I’d say there’s pretty good odds of that. Remember the galley in _Star Trek VI_? I don’t have the scene handy, but as I recall there was any number of ingredients (a whole turkey?) sitting around in there. It had to come from somewhere, and I can see it being more likely from a replicator than frozen stores. In Kirk’s day, provisions were synthetic (“Charlie X”) or reconstituted (“Arena”), and there was enough food to feed 430 people for five years (“Mark of Gideon”) stored in bulk in the outer areas of the primary hull (_ **The Making of Star Trek** _). Dumbwaiters everywhere, yes (“Tomorrow Is Yesterday”), but no fancy food replicators. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2016, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913/137 "2016-12-12T23:10:27Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > Though this thread does make me want to see a scene where the ship arrives to rescue people, one of the crew asks one of the rescued people what s/he does for a living and the person laughs and says 'This is the Federation. I don’t have to do jack! I’m improving myself by having fun and seeing the universe!" 😃 This makes the most sense for me as to what the culture of the Federation is: They’re all pro-am, or “professional amateurs”, in that they’re primarily doing what they do out of a sense of self-actualization and personal fulfillment, but they’re doing it, and are as a matter of course expected to do it, up to a professional level of quality, if not better. Because our culture has an interesting equivocation: It uses “professional” to mean both “I got paid” and “I did a good job”, and “amateur” to mean both “I did it because I love doing it” and “I did a shit job”, and is very, very resistant to disambiguating those terms. Parts of our culture _want_ people to knee-jerk reflexively assume the work of professionals is good, the work of amateurs is shoddy, and, therefore, the only work which is truly worthwhile is work you get paid for in monetary terms. The Federation would not have that at all. ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2016, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913/138 "2016-12-12T23:24:20Z")
This non-Trekkie got up to about post 80 and realised I couldn’t wade through any further so I’ll just say from my super vague memory from the old show that there was some white furry thing with a unicorn horn that I doubt would’ve gotten taken on by the crew as, say, a holodeck repairman, or sick bay masseur. There were also those menacing little “na, na, na-na, na” hammer-wielding fuckers (“bam-bam!” IIRC) whom I’d wager wouldn’t even have cut it as parallel-universe chimney sweeps. (And I only remember that because of one of my pet peeve actors of the 70s - yes: Micheal J. Pollard.) ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2016, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913/139 "2016-12-12T23:32:33Z")
> [@Eddie The Horrible](#): > > This non-Trekkie got up to about post 80 and realised I couldn’t wade through any further so I’ll just say from my super vague memory from the old show that there was some white furry thing with a unicorn horn that I doubt would’ve gotten taken on by the crew as, say, a holodeck repairman, or sick bay masseur. A mugatu. Not likely that they would take one on, since they were both vicious and poisonous. :eek: ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2016, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913/140 "2016-12-12T23:38:25Z")
> [@Quimby](#): > > Something called an “Industrial replicator” has been mentioned in episodes so there probably is something to the theory that not all replicators are created equal. Anyone care to calculate and compare the amounts of energy needed to replicate things on an industrial scale and to manufacture them conventionally? This includes harvesting, mining, refining, and everything else required to produce raw materials. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-any-star-trek-episode-have-a-character-with-no-job/773913.md?page=8)