# Did Barack Obama choose to put his middle name on the ballot? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 15, 2019, 8:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258 "2019-09-15T08:53:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2019, 8:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258/1 "2019-09-15T08:53:13Z")
Bill Maher and Michael Moore made a bet about this on HBO on Friday night. I would have predicted that Bill’s contention, that it was not his choice, was correct. A couple outlets are reporting that Maher lost the bet, but it appears they are basing that only on Michael Steele having said on the program that Michael Moore was right. I don’t think that’s definitive, and by the time they got to the Overtime segment on YouTube they said they were still investigating it—so clearly they didn’t take his word for it either. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2019, 10:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258/2 "2019-09-15T10:33:00Z")
Which ballot? There were 51 of them, two times each, counting only the general elections. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2019, 10:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258/3 "2019-09-15T10:42:49Z")
Sure, so any and all of them. I suppose Moore voted in Michigan? ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2019, 10:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258/4 "2019-09-15T10:53:57Z")
He was just “Barack Obama” in Ohio in 2012, and his running mate was simply “Joe Biden.” Likewise, his opponent was “Mitt Romney,” not “Willard Mitt Romney.” ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2019, 11:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258/5 "2019-09-15T11:06:51Z")
I did a search on the 2008 presidential ballot. I didn’t look at all of them, but all of the ones I found just said Barack Obama, no middle name. Candidates have wide latitude over how they want their names to appear on the ballot. They may use nicknames if they so choose. Biden used the name Joe on the ballot, and Mitt Romney used his nickname on the 2012 ballot instead of his first name of Willard. I couldn’t find any ballots that had Barack Hussein Obama on them. That doesn’t mean it didn’t appear on at least one of them, but Obama did have the choice to leave it off, which seemed to be the crux of the bet. And it looks like I was ninja’d by **Lord Feldon**. Curses! ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2019, 11:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258/6 "2019-09-15T11:06:58Z")
In the Texas Senate race last year, the candidates were listed as “Ted Cruz” and “Beto O’Rourke,” so candidates there obviously get a good deal of leeway in choosing how their names appear. Obama didn’t use his middle name there either. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2019, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258/7 "2019-09-15T12:36:44Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Sure, so any and all of them. I suppose Moore voted in Michigan? No, first we need to establish that his middle name _did_ show up on a ballot, then we can discuss whether or not that would have been by choice. As we can see by the responses so far, the facts haven’t even been established. Not having watched the show, how did it go down – Michael Moore made the claim that Obama chose to put his middle name on the ballot? If so, that puts Maher in a pickle – if he’s not familiar with the story, does he challenge the fact, or does he pivot? It sounds like he pivoted – he took Moore at his word that Hussein was on a ballot, and then decided that it must not have been by choice. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2019, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258/8 "2019-09-15T12:46:47Z")
Hopefully someone can confirm my memory. I thought that battle was fought long before Obama. My memory from childhood was that Jimmy Carter had to fight to keep his name as Jimmy instead of James Earl Carter on all ballots. It was established that candidates could choose how their name appears. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2019, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258/9 "2019-09-15T15:08:02Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Sure, so any and all of them. I suppose Moore voted in Michigan? [Michigan Presidential ballot 2012](https://www.alamy.com/stock-photo-detroit-michigan-an-absentee-ballot-in-the-2012-us-presidential-election-46810265.html) [Michigan primary ballot 2012](http://media.mlive.com/elections_impact/photo/sample-ballotpng-b788a39d462ff56e.png) But Moore actually lives in New York. [New York presidential ballot 2012](http://www.usabilityinciviclife.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/2008_Queens_President.png) It was the same in 2008. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2019, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258/10 "2019-09-15T15:46:44Z")
As far as I am aware, the practice either by law or regulation is that at lesst part of the name on the ballot and the name the candidate uses in their publicity be the same; at least in the jurisdiction I am most familiar with it is required by law that their legal surname (in this example, Obama) be on the ballot. On a more practical sense, there’s also the factor that most politicians will seek to make their styling of their name for campaign purposes to be short and straight Word1 Word2. Notice in that earlier linked Michigan primary ballot: \*nobody \*put in their middle initials/maiden names – nor did those using nicknames parenthesize them behind their legal given name: it was just Buddy or Newt, for instance. President 41 campaigned as “George Bush” rather than George H W Bush, and it was his son who campaigned as “George W” to mark the difference because there was a George Bush already. ---
**Author:** ![dalej42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@dalej42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalej42)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2019, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258/11 "2019-09-15T16:18:44Z")
I do remember George W Bush had his middle initial on the ballot. Which makes sense because George H. W. Bush was still alive in 2000 and 2004 and was also eligible to be elected president. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2019, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258/12 "2019-09-15T17:42:23Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > No, first we need to establish that his middle name _did_ show up on a ballot, then we can discuss whether or not that would have been by choice. As we can see by the responses so far, the facts haven’t even been established. Not having watched the show, how did it go down – Michael Moore made the claim that Obama chose to put his middle name on the ballot? If so, that puts Maher in a pickle – if he’s not familiar with the story, does he challenge the fact, or does he pivot? It sounds like he pivoted – he took Moore at his word that Hussein was on a ballot, and then decided that it must not have been by choice. Yes, precisely. Sure looks to me like Maher wins this, despite the premature declaration to the contrary by Deadline and at least one other outlet. Unless Moore tries to weasel out on the technicality that it’s null and void because “Hussein” didn’t appear at all. But then he has to admit that he was totally wrong about his original claim. ---
**Author:** ![nate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nate/32/13085_2.png) [@nate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nate)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2019, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258/13 "2019-09-15T18:32:17Z")
In Bama, our former governor had his name legally changed to “Dr. Robert Bentley” in order for “Dr.” to appear on the ballot. There was an attack ad during the primaries (the only competitive races in Alabama) mocking him for this. So there seems to be at least some restrictions on how your name appears on a ballot. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2019, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258/14 "2019-09-15T21:22:18Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > … [New York presidential ballot 2012](http://www.usabilityinciviclife.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/2008_Queens_President.png) Obama-Biden appear twice on that ballot; McCain-Palin three times. And these five options all appear before the other five. (I thought the orderings were usually randomized.) Is that ballot typical? Are separate tallies reported for the separate selections? ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2019, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258/15 "2019-09-15T21:38:35Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Obama-Biden appear twice on that ballot; McCain-Palin three times. And these five options all appear before the other five. (I thought the orderings were usually randomized.) Is that ballot typical? Are separate tallies reported for the separate selections? I believe New York lists parties in order of their vote percentage in the previous election. Yes, tallies are reported separately in order to establish the size of the party’s share. ---
**Author:** ![JeffB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jeffb/32/188_2.png) [@JeffB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JeffB)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2019, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258/16 "2019-09-16T05:24:49Z")
I think the bet was actually about whether candidates have a choice about how their names appear on the ballot, not specifically whether Obama choose to have his middle name listed. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2019, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258/17 "2019-09-16T05:38:21Z")
> [@JeffB](#): > > I think the bet was actually about whether candidates have a choice about how their names appear on the ballot, not specifically whether Obama choose to have his middle name listed. No, I just listened to it again and transcribed it. Here you go: > [@](#): > > MAHER: If you’re telling me that Obama put “Hussein” on the ballot purposely to get votes, we will have to have that discussion another time, but— > > MOORE: Yes, he did it because he had courage! > > MAHER: Put your money where your mouth is. I’ll bet you on that, that he didn’t say “Let’s get ‘Hussein’ on the ballot!” > > MOORE: Yes, he wanted his middle name. How much are you going to bet me on that? From there, a negotiation over the stakes ensued. But the basic terms as set clearly show that Bill Maher was the winner, and Michael Moore completely imagined this. (Which I’m glad to learn, because it would have shocked me that Obama did something so reckless and unnecessary.) ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2019, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258/18 "2019-09-16T07:35:50Z")
> [@nate](#): > > In Bama, our former governor had his name legally changed to “Dr. Robert Bentley” in order for “Dr.” to appear on the ballot. There was an attack ad during the primaries (the only competitive races in Alabama) mocking him for this. So there seems to be at least some restrictions on how your name appears on a ballot. I remember a promotional exam in my old job. The people who got passing grades were grouped in sets of five point increments (so people had a mark of 100, 95, 90, etc). This meant that each group had a lot of people in it and the person at the front of each group might end up getting promoted a year ahead of the person at the end of the group. Ties between people within each group were broken by a system of assigning a numerical value to the first three letters of the person’s last name in reverse order. And after the numerical values had been announced, one person had his name legally changed (obviously to something which produced a really good score) and then filed a lawsuit to be able to use his new name for scoring purposes. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2019, 8:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258/19 "2019-09-16T08:16:34Z")
Meanwhile, on Reddit and everywhere else that shows up from googling this bet, everyone still seems to think that Michael Moore won: > **[r/entertainment - Bill Maher Loses Expensive Bet To Michael Moore While...](https://www.reddit.com/r/entertainment/comments/d4nx2w/bill_maher_loses_expensive_bet_to_michael_moore/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)** > > 471 votes and 41 comments so far on Reddit > **[Bill Maher And Michael Moore’s Fiery Debate Leads To Hawaii Trip Bet Won By…](https://deadline.com/2019/09/bill-maher-and-michael-moores-fiery-debate-leads-to-hawaii-trip-bet-won-by-1202734528/)** > > Bill Maher and Michael Moore got in a heated exchange Friday night on HBO’s Real Time with Bill Maher and eventually made a pricey on-air bet — the stakes: a trip to Hawaii — over… > **[Bill Maher Loses Expensive Bet To Michael Moore While Debating Barack Obama...](https://decider.com/2019/09/14/bill-maher-loses-expensive-bet-to-michael-moore-while-debating-barack-obama-on-real-time/)** > > It looks like the HBO host will be footing the bill for Moore’s next luau. > **[WATCH: Michael Moore got in shouting match with Bill Maher — and the comedian...](https://www.rawstory.com/2019/09/watch-michael-moore-got-in-shouting-match-with-bill-maher-and-the-comedian-lost-an-expensive-bet/)** > > HBO "Real Time" host Bill Maher got in a heated argument with Academy Award-winning filmmaker Michael Moore on Friday.The two argued over democratic socialism and the direction of the Democratic Party being debated during the 2020 DNC presidential... :smack: Outside of our little corner of the Internet, ignorance is winning. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2019, 8:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258/20 "2019-09-16T08:41:49Z")
Geeze, that’s weird, you’d think that two old has-beens getting in an irrelevant argument on weekend evening cable would have spawned a bunch of diligent research. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-barack-obama-choose-to-put-his-middle-name-on-the-ballot/840258.md?page=2)