# Did carriers in WWII travel all alone? What's considered a carrier "group?" **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 26, 2012, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-carriers-in-wwii-travel-all-alone-whats-considered-a-carrier-group/638959 "2012-10-26T18:27:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 5\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Bartman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/779978/32.png) [@Bartman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bartman)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2012, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-carriers-in-wwii-travel-all-alone-whats-considered-a-carrier-group/638959/21 "2012-10-27T14:24:09Z")
> [@MonkeyMensch](#): > > Whereas early in the war we needed a miracle at Midway for our three carriers to prevail, by the end we had no less than 23 new Essex class carriers prowling about, looking for employment. Just to nitpick here. Yes the US had some disadvantages at Midway. Things weren’t as bad as requiring a miracle. The US had 360 total aircraft at Midway. The Japanese had 264. The US planes at the time were decidedly of lesser quality than the Japanese in almost all cases. But the US had a much better idea, due to intelligence, of the location of the Japanese fleet and their plan. The US got lucky, but it wasn’t miraculous. And the luck was mostly self made. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2012, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-carriers-in-wwii-travel-all-alone-whats-considered-a-carrier-group/638959/22 "2012-10-27T14:32:55Z")
Another thread that may be of interest: [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=643488](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=643488) ---
**Author:** ![BigAppleBucky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigapplebucky/32/178_2.png) [@BigAppleBucky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigAppleBucky)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2012, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-carriers-in-wwii-travel-all-alone-whats-considered-a-carrier-group/638959/23 "2012-10-27T14:53:11Z")
This is why budgeting an aircraft carrier is not a matter of merely paying for the construction of one ship for $5 billion (or whatever it is). An aircraft carrier always involves a group of ships and they have to be budgeted as well. ---
**Author:** ![MonkeyMensch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@MonkeyMensch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MonkeyMensch)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2012, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-carriers-in-wwii-travel-all-alone-whats-considered-a-carrier-group/638959/24 "2012-10-27T15:02:40Z")
> [@Bartman](#): > > Just to nitpick here. Yes the US had some disadvantages at Midway. Things weren’t as bad as requiring a miracle. The US had 360 total aircraft at Midway. The Japanese had 264. The US planes at the time were decidedly of lesser quality than the Japanese in almost all cases. But the US had a much better idea, due to intelligence, of the location of the Japanese fleet and their plan. > > The US got lucky, but it wasn’t miraculous. And the luck was mostly self made. You’re right , of course. I was paraphrasing Gordon Prange’s book\* Miracle at Midway \*in my description. ---
**Author:** ![MonkeyMensch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@MonkeyMensch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MonkeyMensch)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2012, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-carriers-in-wwii-travel-all-alone-whats-considered-a-carrier-group/638959/25 "2012-10-27T15:34:18Z")
> [@Bartman](#): > > Just to nitpick here. Yes the US had some disadvantages at Midway. Things weren’t as bad as requiring a miracle. The US had 360 total aircraft at Midway. The Japanese had 264. The US planes at the time were decidedly of lesser quality than the Japanese in almost all cases. But the US had a much better idea, due to intelligence, of the location of the Japanese fleet and their plan. > > The US got lucky, but it wasn’t miraculous. And the luck was mostly self made. Missed the edit window. I knew about the Americans cracking Purple, the Japanese code in use, and having thus having some great intelligence but had no idea about the difference in plane numbers. I would have thought that with four carriers the Japanese would have had superior numbers. Thanks for the info. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-carriers-in-wwii-travel-all-alone-whats-considered-a-carrier-group/638959.md?page=1)