# Did Christie (or his staff) intentionally cause the Fort Lee traffic jam? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [January 9, 2014, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351 "2014-01-09T13:34:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 5:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/181 "2014-01-11T05:12:21Z")
You can sure as hell delegate the blame, because that’s what staff is for. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/182 "2014-01-11T05:14:30Z")
> [@Shayna](#): > > They did [write up a fake report on the not-really-a-study](http://www.businessinsider.com/george-washington-bridge-davos-study-2014-1). It’s actually kind of hilarious. “In conclusion, we have found that the repercussions of lane closings are much more severe than we had anticipated.” ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/183 "2014-01-11T05:46:44Z")
Bill Baroni and David Wildstein better start packing bags for prison. These texts are extremely serious. They were told about EMS and police delays and still continued the bridge lane closures. I’m not sure what charges can be filed but this is just cold blooded. [New documents reveal ‘Bridgegate’ Port Authority appointees ignored danger warnings.](http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/new-documents-reveal-bridgegate-pa-appointees-danger-warnings-article-1.1575622) > [@](#): > > They knew the George Washington Bridge gridlock could kill someone — and did nothing to stop it. > > New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie’s top two Port Authority appointees, despite warnings of severely delayed emergency response time, extended the government-sanctioned traffic jams in Fort Lee for three days. > > A Sept. 9 email to PA execs _Bill Baroni and David Wildstein_ laid out the life-threatening situation created by the punitive morning rush-hour lane closings at the world’s busiest bridge. > > “Wanted you both (to) have a heads-up — Peggy Thomas, Borough Administrator, called me regarding the increased volume and congestion,” wrote PA employee Tina Lado. > “She mentioned there were two incidents that Ft Lee PD and EMS had difficulty responding to: a missing child (later found) and a cardiac arrest … If there is anything you need me to do, let me know.” > > The lanes instead remained closed in the Sept. 9-12 Bridgegate scandal that led to the pair’s resignations. Emails showed Wildstein approving the daily extensions of the “road test.” ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 7:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/184 "2014-01-11T07:07:36Z")
You have to feel sorry for any engineer who wants to conduct a legitimate traffic study in the next ten years. Imagine what the oversight’s going to look like after this. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 11:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/185 "2014-01-11T11:29:28Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Your joke is bad, and you are old. True on both counts. Can’t stop getting older, and just try and stop me from cracking bad jokes. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Rachellelogram](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rachellelogram/32/8689_2.png) [@Rachellelogram](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rachellelogram)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/186 "2014-01-11T13:00:59Z")
> [@SpoilerVirgin](#): > > As Jon Stewart pointed out, by New Jersey governor standards, this is really a piss-poor scandal. Christie’s predecessor [Jon Corzine](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jon_Corzine), and [Jim McGreevey](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_McGreevey), who was forced to resign, set a very high bar. To be fair, anyone who had to govern the Jersey Shore would go a little nutty in short order. ---
**Author:** ![Moe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moe/32/2972_2.png) [@Moe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moe)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/187 "2014-01-11T14:30:46Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > I dunno if he’s lying or not, but I have to admit that if I were in his position and I really was blindsided by this, I absolutely would fire Kelly immediately and would not give her the respect of telling her in person. Really? So a member of your “tight knit” staff where you’re all “like a family” goes rogue and initiates an action that effects (how many? I don’t even know, tens of thousands, 100s of thousands…) including children getting to their first day of school, emergency vehicles performing potentially life-saving operations, people just needing to get to work, etc. and you have absolutely no idea why, you would’t first ask this person for an explanation? AND since you are being held responsible by the press and thus need an explanation not only to satisfy your own curiosity but the general public’s as well… really? ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/188 "2014-01-11T15:50:13Z")
And I’d certainly have to ask myself how my longtime friends and allies, both personally and professionally, all seem to be lying, vindictive assholes. Might it have something to do with me? Yeah, I know - in Christie’s case, the answer is pretty obvious. But I’m not expecting any deep reflection from him. Gotta say, it’s impressive how few defenders he suddenly has, the moment the shit hits the fan. ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/189 "2014-01-11T16:13:59Z")
This scandal is kinda dull, but I’m thankful that the [one article](http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/11/nyregion/hundreds-of-pages-on-bridge-scandal-released.html) I read featured someone with the fantastic name: Inspector Darcy Licorish of the Port Authority Police Department. ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/190 "2014-01-11T16:38:22Z")
> [@Merneith](#): > > Here’s a link to the original WSJ story, which, note was posted on December 12 - it’s behind a paywall. > [http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304477704579254012674389146](http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304477704579254012674389146) > And here is a link to the Kos story, published on January 9th, about the WSJ story, which MacCat was pointing to - > > [Christie asked Cuomo to back off investigating Fort Lee. In mid-December.](http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/01/09/1268413/-Andrew-Cuomo-needs-to-put-the-last-nail-in-Christie-s-coffin) > And here is an update to the Kos story - a different Kos story, posted on December 13, in which a Kos diarist, Jed Lewison, mentioned hearing that Christie had told Cuomo to tell his investigator to back off. > > [After revelation that Christie asked Cuomo to back off bridge lane closure inquiry, top aide resigns](http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/12/13/1262485/-After-revelation-that-Christie-asked-Cuomo-to-back-off-bridge-lane-closure-inquiry-top-aide-resigns) > > So both the Wall Street Journal story and the mention of it on Kos happened a month ago. At the time, Christie told Cuomo that his (Cuomo’s) guy, Patrick Foye, was pushing too hard into the investigation of Bill Baroni, the Cristie appointee who ordered the shutdown of the bridge. Foye was eventually called to testify in Trenton and said he was told by Baroni that the shutdown was for a traffic study, but he didn’t know nothing about no traffic studies and had no idea what Baroni was up to. A day later, Baroni resigned, denying that it all had anything to do with the bridge shutdown. > > Bottom line: Yesterday was not the first day Christie heard about any of this bullshit. This. The lane closures and resultant traffic jams were major local news at the time they happened. Probably the most unprecedented aspect was that no one was given any advance notice of the planned closures. For months now, Christie has been publicly denying any revenge motive in his typical nasty sarcastic style. The official NY Daily News editorial received front page placement and didn’t pull any punches “New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie’s one-hour-and-forty-seven-minute self-serving, self-pitying display of contrition on Thursday was a climactic act in a brazen cover-up that threatens to further unravel his political career. Ever so thoroughly the governor scoured the thesaurus for words of apology, regret and painless self-flagellation while nervily playing the victim and mercilessly destroying the aide who played only a supporting role for the George Washington Bridge political revenge plot.” Full article and cover photo here: > **[Gov. Chris Christie’s load of bull: Fired aide Bridget Kelly merely a patsy...](https://www.nydailynews.com/2014/01/09/gov-chris-christies-load-of-bull-fired-aide-bridget-kelly-merely-a-patsy-in-attempt-to-shelter-port-authority-cronies-himself/)** > > New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie’s one-hour-and-forty-seven-minute self-serving, self-pitying display of contrition on Thursday was a climactic act in a brazen cover-up that threatens to furthe… ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/191 "2014-01-11T16:53:47Z")
Is there any room left under the bus? Is his Mom still alive? ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/192 "2014-01-11T17:29:03Z")
> [@Moe](#): > > Really? So a member of your “tight knit” staff where you’re all “like a family” goes rogue and initiates an action that effects (how many? I don’t even know, tens of thousands, 100s of thousands…) including children getting to their first day of school, emergency vehicles performing potentially life-saving operations, people just needing to get to work, etc. and you have absolutely no idea why, you would’t first ask this person for an explanation? AND since you are being held responsible by the press and thus need an explanation not only to satisfy your own curiosity but the general public’s as well… Whether she’s going to answer questions or not isn’t something that hinges on whether I’d fire her sorry ass. She’s clearly going to end up in front of a judge. Priority number one at that moment, for me, would be making sure security gets her the hell out of her office in ten minutes. She can make her explanations to the police and the jury. Or her emails can. Let’s suppose Christie himself is telling the truth. That means Kelly lied to him outrageously and repeatedly for months. **Why on earth would it do Christie any good to ask for answers from someone he cannot trust to tell him the truth?** She’s either going to lie or lawyer up; nothing she says can be counted upon. I stres that I do not know (and have significant doubts, really) that Christie IS telling the whole truth. My point is merely that if he is, immediately firing Kelly is logical. Such an outrageous breach of trust and ethics is an automatic termination offense in any organization, and “asking her for an explanation” before firing her is unlikely to yield a meaningful answer. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/193 "2014-01-11T17:30:29Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > Gotta say, it’s impressive how few defenders he suddenly has, the moment the shit hits the fan. As a Republican who attacked a Democrat and a moderate in a party that’s predominantly conservative, he’s got few political allies. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/194 "2014-01-11T17:40:58Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > Gotta say, it’s impressive how few defenders he suddenly has, the moment the shit hits the fan. It’s rather indefensible. I personally liked Christie, but if he knew about this it’s just completely unacceptable and grounds for impeachment, and at a minimum should cost him anyone’s vote ever. If he didn’t know, it casts a great deal of extremely troubling doubt on his judgment with regards to appointing people to important positions. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/195 "2014-01-11T17:57:51Z")
> [@Karrius](#): > > If you’re going to accuse the Wall Street Journal of lying, are you willing to apologize if you’re proven wrong in your attempt to defend a scumbag politician that put people’s lives at risk in exchange for a petty revenge act? > > And honestly, “random bloggers on daily kos” have a way better track record than “people willing to defend conservatives on the SDMB”. Hahahaha. Who accused the WSJ of lying? You? Eventually, the story will come out and all of the silly rumors will be put to rest. Wouldn’t you like to know who started the rumors? You know, for future reference. In case the same “reporters”, pundits, bloggers, entertainers, start similar unsubstantiated rumors. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/196 "2014-01-11T18:00:36Z")
> [@BlankSlate](#): > > This scandal is kinda dull, but I’m thankful that the [one article](http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/11/nyregion/hundreds-of-pages-on-bridge-scandal-released.html) I read featured **someone with the fantastic name: Inspector Darcy Licorish of the Port Authority Police Department.** Oh, my. THAT name just HAS to be slapped onto the lead character of a police procedural on BBC. ---
**Author:** ![Moe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moe/32/2972_2.png) [@Moe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moe)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/197 "2014-01-11T19:09:25Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Whether she’s going to answer questions or not isn’t something that hinges on whether I’d fire her sorry ass. She’s clearly going to end up in front of a judge. Priority number one at that moment, for me, would be making sure security gets her the hell out of her office in ten minutes. She can make her explanations to the police and the jury. Or her emails can. > > Let’s suppose Christie himself is telling the truth. That means Kelly lied to him outrageously and repeatedly for months. **Why on earth would it do Christie any good to ask for answers from someone he cannot trust to tell him the truth?** She’s either going to lie or lawyer up; nothing she says can be counted upon. > > I stres that I do not know (and have significant doubts, really) that Christie IS telling the whole truth. My point is merely that if he is, immediately firing Kelly is logical. Such an outrageous breach of trust and ethics is an automatic termination offense in any organization, and “asking her for an explanation” before firing her is unlikely to yield a meaningful answer. I don’t understand this reasoning at all. I never said her job would hinge on her answers to any questions. But she joined the administration in 2010. Again, this is a “tight-knit…family-like” administration according to Christie. If he was really “blindsided” by the sudden realization that this person he’s known and trusted for 3 years did something as outrageous and inexplicable like this I can’t believe any sane person’s first course of action wouldn’t be to ask her why. And he knew he was going to be giving a press conference. If he’s telling the complete and total truth why in the world wouldn’t he want to have some information directly from her to tell the press? If she clammed up or told him more bullshit, how much better would he look being able to tell the press that: “I questioned her repeatedly, and pressed her for some explanation, and all she could say was blah blah…” Nonsense. More than anything else, this sticks out to me as the most damning piece of his story. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/198 "2014-01-11T19:22:12Z")
I picked up on that technicality too. Christie was very careful to say his lawyer and chief of staff questioned the staff members for an hour. Thats lawyer crap in action. Any boss would normally call an employee into their office and question them. Answering to your boss is something we all do. Christie is a lawyer and he acted like one in this situation. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/199 "2014-01-11T21:58:04Z")
I’m still reading the documents. I’m surprised Port Authority executive director Patrick Foye isn’t in trouble. He’s included in most of the emails. He almost never says anything. Steve Coleman the Port spokesman is constantly asking for guidance with the press requests on the bridge closures. Foye is just mute. The crap is hitting the fan and the executive director says nothing? Compare that to this email where Foye says he’ll investigate. I’m not seeing where he investigates anything. [http://www.newsday.com/news/region-state/pa-chief-patrick-foye-s-email-on-george-washington-bridge-closures-1.6774938](http://www.newsday.com/news/region-state/pa-chief-patrick-foye-s-email-on-george-washington-bridge-closures-1.6774938) At a minimum Foye fails to lead. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2014, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/200 "2014-01-11T22:42:59Z")
NY Times reports on how the the Port Authority leadership has divided powers. Foye is a NY appointee as executive director. Samson is a NJ appointed director. It makes my head hurt even thinking about this tangled mess. > **[Lane Closings Scandal Shows Port Authority’s Status as 2 Warring Fiefs...](https://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/11/nyregion/lane-closings-scandal-shows-agencys-status-as-2-warring-fiefs.html?_r=0)** > > The Port Authority of New York and New Jersey, controlled by Gov. Andrew M. Cuomo and Gov. Chris Christie, appears to be wracked by politics. > [@](#): > > In the past, the New York-appointed executive director ran day-to-day operations in both states. But over the last decade, appointees in New Jersey have moved to take greater control of their own affairs, and now, the authority’s deputy executive director — a New Jersey appointee — essentially runs a second chain of command consisting of New Jersey personnel. Mr. Foye testified in December that the deputy executive director reported to the Port Authority’s board, not to him. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351.md?page=11)