# Did Christie (or his staff) intentionally cause the Fort Lee traffic jam? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [January 9, 2014, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351 "2014-01-09T13:34:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 18
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2014, 6:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/341 "2014-01-18T06:36:55Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > [IRS targeting controversy - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_IRS_scandal#FBI_Investigation) > > But like Banghazi, why attribute to incompetence what can easily be spun as malice. So, in your view, Christie and/or his staff had the GWB lanes shut down because they were incompetent? Could you maybe elaborate a bit on how you reached that opinion? ---
**Author:** ![Trion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ccd318/32.png) [@Trion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trion)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2014, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/342 "2014-01-18T13:56:18Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > So, in your view, Christie and/or his staff had the GWB lanes shut down because they were incompetent? > > Could you maybe elaborate a bit on how you reached that opinion? Obviously Bridget Anne Kelly didn’t really mean to send an email that said “Time for some traffic problems in Fort Lee.” Damn you auto-correct! ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2014, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/343 "2014-01-18T14:38:56Z")
Now the floodgates have opened. Hoboken mayor Dawn Zimmer says that [Christie held Sandy relief money hostage](http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/mayor-christie-camp-held-sandy-money-hostage) because she wouldn’t approve a development project favored by Christie. > [@](#): > > The mayor, Dawn Zimmer, hasn’t approved the project, but she did request $127 million in hurricane relief for her city of Hoboken – 80% of which was underwater after Sandy hit in October 2012. What she got was $142,000 to defray the cost of a single back-up generator plus an additional $200,000 in recovery grants. > > In an exclusive interview, Zimmer broke her silence and named Lt. Gov. Kim Guadagno and Richard Constable, Christie’s community affairs commissioner, as the two officials who delivered messages on behalf of a governor she had long supported. Christie belongs in prison. ---
**Author:** ![MacCat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maccat/32/216_2.png) [@MacCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MacCat)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2014, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/344 "2014-01-18T15:01:06Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Christie belongs in prison. He might. We do need to find out, not cover up or ignore. If it’s shown that he really didn’t know anything about these crimes in his administration, fine. The voters can deal with that level of incompetence however they see fit. If he was involved, prison may be in the picture. Let the chips fall where they may. ---
**Author:** ![burunduk34](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3ec8ea/32.png) [@burunduk34](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/burunduk34)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2014, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/345 "2014-01-18T15:10:34Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Cool story, bro. > My second favorite part is how you brag about getting away with punching a woman. When I’m being assaulted, I don’t discriminate whether I defend myself, depending on the gender of the attacker. I’m not a mysogonist, and that woman got treated exactly the same way a man would get treated. > [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > So you’re praising Chris Christie because he fired a couple of underlings. Wouldn’t truly be taking responsibility involve Christie himself resigning? In this day and age? I think I addressed that point in my first post. See, for example IRS scandal where the worst thing that happened to the people responsible for targetting political groups solely for their political views is early retirement (probably with full federal pensions and such–in essense, an award, not punishment). See, for example, Melissa Mark-Viverito who participated in the blocking of Brooklyn Bridge, and who got handpicked by de Blaiso for the job of City Council speaker (clearly, an award) after de Blasio labeled Christie’s actions as “immoral” and “not mature”. Imagine Christie awarding and promoting those responsible for Fort Lee debacle. > [@Marley23](#): > > Truer words were never spoken. Au contraire, mon frere. Here’s several example where the truer words most surely have been spoken. “If you like your insurance, you can keep your insurace” “I had an uncle who was one of the, part of the first American troops to go into Auschwitz and liberate the concentration camps” “I will not sign a plan that adds one dime to our deficits , either now or in the future.” etc. etc ,etc > [@Marley23](#): > > 1. The bridge wasn’t blocked for very long. Reminds me of an old joke. A guy walks down the street and sees a beautiful woman approaching him. –Hey, Miss, you’re gorgeous. Will you sleep with me, if I give you a million bucks? The woman hesitates for a few seconds, then says: –Million bucks? Yeah, ok. The guy says: –Well, how about ten bucks? The woman is indignant: –Who do you think I am, a whore? –Well, we’ve already established who you’re, now we’re just haggling about the price. > [@Marley23](#): > > 1. The people who did it were quickly arrested. See the whore joke above > [@Marley23](#): > > 1. That was a protest, not an act of politically motivated retribution. It was not a protest. It was a political act of retaliation by the dregs of the society against people who have jobs and actually wanted to get to those jobs that day. > [@Marley23](#): > > 1. Bill di Blasio had nothing to do with the bridge closure I didn’t say he did, did I? Melissa Mark-Viverito, on the other hand, sure did. What de Blasio is responsible for, is for hand-picking a person who participated in blocking of the Brooklyn Bridge to the post of the City Council speaker > [@Marley23](#): > > There are probably about six more major differences, but it’s not worth the time. Could you list these 6 major difference, please? So far, it seems to me that your view is that bridge-blocking is acceptable based on: 1. The length of the time a bridge was blocked. 2. Whether the people who blocked a bridge were arrested or not. 3. The purpose of those who blocked a bridge–“a political retaliation” is not ok, while a “protest” is ok. 4. Please fill in. 5. Please fill in. 6. Please fill in. 7. Please fill in. 8. Please fill in. 9. Please fill in. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2014, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/346 "2014-01-18T15:18:47Z")
> [@burunduk34](#): > > In this day and age? I think I addressed that point in my first post. > See, for example IRS scandal where the worst thing that happened to the people responsible for targetting political groups solely for their political views is early retirement (probably with full federal pensions and such–in essense, an award, not punishment). There was no IRS scandal. Liberal groups as well as conservative groups were scrutinized. The only thing was that liberals didn’t fucking whine about it. Plus, according to the letter of the law, NONE of these groups should have had their tax-exempt status approved. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2014, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/347 "2014-01-18T15:22:41Z")
From a Christie spokesman: > [@](#): > > “Mayor Zimmer has been effusive in her public praise of the Governor’s Office and the assistance we’ve provided in terms of economic development and Sandy aid,” Christie spokesman Michael Drewniak wrote in a statement. “What or who is driving her only now to say such outlandishly false things is anyone’s guess.” It strikes me that her past support gives more weight to her statements, not less. Why, indeed, would she suddenly start lying about him when she’s supported him in the past? ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2014, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/348 "2014-01-18T15:50:32Z")
> [@burunduk34](#): > > 1. The purpose of those who blocked a bridge–“a political retaliation” is not ok, while a “protest” is ok. This is all that matters. Period. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2014, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/349 "2014-01-18T16:02:50Z")
Can hijacks about the IRS, other bridge incidents, etc. be taken elsewhere? This thread is about alleged misbehavior by the Christie administration. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2014, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/350 "2014-01-18T16:20:36Z")
Take them somewhere else? How about Benghazi, that’s somewhere else! ---
**Author:** ![MacCat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maccat/32/216_2.png) [@MacCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MacCat)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2014, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/351 "2014-01-18T16:34:24Z")
> [@burunduk34](#): > > It was not a protest. It was a political act of retaliation by the dregs of the society against people who have jobs and actually wanted to get to those jobs that day. Does “the society against people who have jobs” have a clubhouse or anything? ---
**Author:** ![Enginerd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/bcef8e/32.png) [@Enginerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enginerd)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2014, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/352 "2014-01-18T16:53:02Z")
> [@davidm](#): > > From a Christie spokesman: > It strikes me that her past support gives more weight to her statements, not less. Why, indeed, would she suddenly start lying about him when she’s supported him in the past? Moreover, it seems like it would be easy to demonstrate that her remarks really were “outlandishly false” if that were the case. Just a matter of saying, “Hoboken was granted $xxx,xxx for evacuation alpha, $y,yyy,yyy for recovery plan bravo, and $zzz,zzz for project foxtrot.” Saying nothing more than “she’s lying” is pretty unconvincing. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2014, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/353 "2014-01-18T17:18:46Z")
> [@burunduk34](#): > > When I’m being assaulted, I don’t discriminate whether I defend myself, depending on the gender of the attacker. I’m not a mysogonist, and that woman got treated exactly the same way a man would get treated. Men don’t hit girls. End of story. It doesn’t matter if she swore at you, spit on you, or voted for a Democrat. Men don’t hit girls. > [@burunduk34](#): > > Could you list these 6 major difference, please? So far, it seems to me that your view is that bridge-blocking is acceptable based on: The bridge blocking you’re whining about was not ordered by any government official. That’s the major difference so I don’t need five more. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2014, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/354 "2014-01-18T17:23:43Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Men don’t hit girls. End of story. It doesn’t matter if she swore at you, spit on you, or voted for a Democrat. Men don’t hit girls. That’s incredibly sexist and insulting. You shouldn’t hit anyone, but if someone spits on you the fact that they have a vagina should make absolutely zero difference in your reaction. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2014, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/355 "2014-01-18T17:36:49Z")
Seriously guys, can you take this argument elsewhere rather than continuing to hijack this thread? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2014, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/356 "2014-01-18T17:41:16Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > There was no IRS scandal. Liberal groups as well as conservative groups were scrutinized. The only thing was that liberals didn’t fucking whine about it. Plus, according to the letter of the law, NONE of these groups should have had their tax-exempt status approved. Except, Conservatives are above the law. If they weren’t, Socialism! > [@Enginerd](#): > > Just a matter of saying, “Hoboken was granted $xxx,xxx for evacuation alpha, $y,yyy,yyy for recovery plan bravo, and $zzz,zzz for project foxtrot.” Saying nothing more than “she’s lying” is pretty unconvincing. Good. But I’d replace Bravo with Mike. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Enginerd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/bcef8e/32.png) [@Enginerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enginerd)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2014, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/357 "2014-01-18T17:55:54Z")
Well played, **Johnny**! ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2014, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/358 "2014-01-18T17:59:14Z")
Yes. Yes. Well played. Hilarious. Ha ha ha haha ha ha… _(I don’t get it)_ ---
**Author:** ![Enginerd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/bcef8e/32.png) [@Enginerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enginerd)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2014, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/359 "2014-01-18T18:23:01Z")
[alpha mike foxtrot](http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=amf) ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2014, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/360 "2014-01-18T18:54:50Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > That’s incredibly sexist and insulting. You shouldn’t hit anyone, but if someone spits on you the fact that they have a vagina should make absolutely zero difference in your reaction. I disagree. Maybe it’s a sign of being old but I still say it’s wrong for a man to hit a woman. (Okay, if she’s trying to stab me or something, I would defend myself.) But there are circumstances where I would hit a man for doing the same thing that I would not hit a woman for - and getting spit on would be an example of that. If that makes me sexist, so be it. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351.md?page=17) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351.md?page=19)