# Did Christie (or his staff) intentionally cause the Fort Lee traffic jam? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [January 9, 2014, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351 "2014-01-09T13:34:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 51
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2014, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1001 "2014-03-17T17:58:41Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > …Wildstein did ‘work for the Port Authority’. > > …technically accurate. > > …There is something I don’t understand. > > …Everyone knows you’re trying to put a positive (or at lease less negative) spin on Wildstein’s position. > > …Everyone sees what you’re doing. (post shortened for clarity) Yes, Wildstein did work for the Port Authority. “Port Authority’s Wildstein” is an accurate description. It’s absurd that you think you speak for _Everyone_. Have you even met everyone? You’re actually speaking for yourself. \*George Wade (Hugh Grant): Before you came into my life I could make all kinds of decisions now I’m addicted I have to know what you think. What do you think? [holds up cufflinks] Lucy Kelson (Sandra Bullock): I think your the most selfish human being on the planet. George Wade: Well that’s just silly. Have you met everybody on the planet? - quote from “Two Weeks Notice”\* ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2014, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1002 "2014-03-17T18:10:53Z")
What’s it going to take for you to say Christie’s guilty, doorhinge? If Kelly and/or Wildstein sing and say “Yeppers, I was acting on Christie’s direct orders” would you throw in the towel? Or do you need a signed and notarized order from Christie himself ordering the lanes to be closed? I’ll flip the question on myself and say that if both Wildstein and Kelly get immunity and still testify that Christie was in the dark and did not participate in the planning or the cover up, then I’ll say “sorry, big guy. I misjudged you.” In the meantime, I no more begrudge you the right to protest Christie’s innocence than I do my own dancing at the prospect of seeing Christie in an orange jumpsuit. Whether the truth lies at either extreme or somewhere in the middle, there was never any chance for him to get the nomination anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2014, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1003 "2014-03-17T18:36:47Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > “Port Authority’s Wildstein” is an accurate description. As I said, it’s _technically_ accurate. It is not meaningfully accurate. Let me try once again… Suppose you have MegaPharm, which says their new drug has been clinically tested to be safe and effective for treating a previously untreatable illness. They produce a report by Creative Testing LLC that verifies everything MegaPharm is saying. Only, Creative Testing LLC is a subsidiary wholly owned by MegaPharm. MegaPharm is technically accurate when they say that their new drug has been clinically tested to be safe and effective. No one can say they are lying. But the technical accuracy is not meaningful. It is a ‘continuing misrepresentation’. > [@BobLibDem](#): > > Or do you need a signed and notarized order from Christie himself ordering the lanes to be closed? It would have to be the ‘original long form’ order. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2014, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1004 "2014-03-17T19:30:56Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > What’s it going to take for you to say Christie’s guilty, doorhinge? If Kelly and/or Wildstein sing and say “Yeppers, I was acting on Christie’s direct orders” would you throw in the towel? Or do you need a signed and notarized order from Christie himself ordering the lanes to be closed? > > I’ll flip the question on myself and say that if both Wildstein and Kelly get immunity and still testify that Christie was in the dark and did not participate in the planning or the cover up, then I’ll say “sorry, big guy. I misjudged you.” > > In the meantime, I no more begrudge you the right to protest Christie’s innocence than I do my own dancing at the prospect of seeing Christie in an orange jumpsuit. > > Whether the truth lies at either extreme or somewhere in the middle, there was never any chance for him to get the nomination anyway. My position has nothing to do with Christie being guilty or not. If he’s guilty, he can join a long line of Illinois governors who have been sent to prison. If Christie is proven innocent or there is never any proof that Christie is guilty, I will still get 8 hours sleep every night and eat all the cookies I want. Life will go on. Do you think the _Christie is guilty_ camp will ever admit that Christie wasn’t involved, even if they were presented with a signed and certified document from Bill and Hillary plus Obama and God? I don’t think so, either. I object to the unverified rumors that have been circulated about the Great NJ Lane Reassignment and the lynch mob mentality of the media and internet. Christie must be guilty because he’s fat, a fucking republican, wanted to punish Sokolich, went to high school in NJ, attends photo-ops and meet-and-greets with Port Authority employees, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. I just want to see actual, verifiable proof that Christie was involved. (Just between you and me, I could probably make a better case for Christie being guilty than anything I’ve seen so far, but that would only undermine my position. 😃 ) I do think it’s time for the political persecution committee to fold it’s tent and get out of the way of the federal investigation. At least the feds can put people in prison and fine them a hundred sows and bucks. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2014, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1005 "2014-03-17T19:34:35Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > As I said, it’s _technically_ accurate. It is not meaningfully accurate. _Technically_ accurate is accurate. Whether it’s meaningful to you, or not, is of no concern to me. You seem to have overestimated your opinions importance to me. ---
**Author:** ![Zakalwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zakalwe/32/270_2.png) [@Zakalwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zakalwe)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2014, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1006 "2014-03-18T01:52:29Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > he can join a long line of Illinois governors who have been sent to prison > > Christie must be guilty because he’s … a fucking republican (Post shortened for clarity) Gotcha. You have NOOOOOO stake in this. Riiiiiggghhhttt… Fight the good fight there, **doorhinge**. Everybody is buying the “I’m not partisan! I just happen to hate all Democrats and love all Republicans, but that just makes me a searcher for the Truth, not a partisan!” routine. ---
**Author:** ![Truman\_Burbank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecc23a/32.png) [@Truman\_Burbank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Truman_Burbank)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2014, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1007 "2014-03-18T02:32:05Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > (post shortened for clarity) > > Less accurate? That’s absurd. Wildstein worked for the Port Authority. I’m not joining the lynch mob based on your opinion that a _fact_ is somehow less accurate. Or for any other red herring, no matter how it’s served. Mayor Sokolich will be mighty glad you’ve decided to stop serving up red herrings. _Sheesh._ ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2014, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1008 "2014-03-18T14:01:11Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > Personally, I don’t really mind if the “why” is never definitively established. I’m okay with removing Christie from office just because he’s a fucking Republican. > [@Zakalwe](#): > > (Post shortened for clarity) > > Gotcha. You have NOOOOOO stake in this. Riiiiiggghhhttt… > > Fight the good fight there, **doorhinge**. Everybody is buying the “I’m not partisan! I just happen to hate all Democrats and love all Republicans, but that just makes me a searcher for the Truth, not a partisan!” routine. I doubt that you speak for “everyone”. I don’t care if Christie is guilty or not. There are many other Christie threads for people who chose to participate in Kool-Aid pissing contests. I do object to the cluster-fuck “reporting” provided by the lynch mob media. I also question why so many people object to anyone questioning the media’s many unverified versions of what actually happened. I provided a list of reasons used by people who want Christie to be guilty or want other people to believe that Christie is guilty. “Fucking Republicans” was **kaylasdad99** term. If you want to understand why he chose that term, you’ll have to direct your questions to him. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2014, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1009 "2014-03-18T14:19:13Z")
> [@Truman\_Burbank](#): > > Mayor Sokolich will be mighty glad you’ve decided to stop serving up red herrings. > _Sheesh._ post 818 - > [@Truman\_Burbank](#): > > OK, fine > > "I consider Sokolich to be ineffective because he wasn’t effective. Port Authority Foye was effective and ended the traffic jam in Ft Lee. It’s up to the Ft Lee voters to decide if Sokolich’s efforts are worth reelecting him again. " > > I just finished lunch. I’m going to have a cookie now. > Try and stop me, smart guy! You will, in your simple worldview, now become either effective, or not. > > Oops, too late. You are ineffective. Hahahaha. It was you who created the bestest red herring ever. It’s a classic. Other red herrings bow down to your red herring. Whether you acknowledge it or not, Sokolich is a key piece of the puzzle that is the Great NJ Lane Reassignment. It appears that the Port Authority bureaucracy is so screwed up that Port Authority’s Wildstein could have created a similar situation in any NJ town under Port Authority jurisdiction. Why was he drawn to Ft Lee? Was it because he knew that Sokolich had no political clout? Was it because he knew that Sokolich was the least likely mayor to be able to fix the problem? What is known is that after four days, Sokolich was able to accomplish nothing. His constituents must be very proud. ---
**Author:** ![MacCat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maccat/32/216_2.png) [@MacCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MacCat)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2014, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1010 "2014-03-18T14:54:31Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > Was it because he knew that Sokolich was the least likely mayor to be able to fix the problem?. Who would be the _most likely **mayor** _ to be able to fix the problem(s) the Christie appointees inflicted upon Fort Lee? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2014, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1011 "2014-03-18T16:48:21Z")
Would have been Bloomburg, he could pretty much have _bought_ New Jersey. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2014, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1012 "2014-03-18T16:54:35Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > I doubt that you speak for “everyone”. I don’t care if Christie is guilty or not. There are many other Christie threads for people who chose to participate in Kool-Aid pissing contests. I do object to the cluster-fuck “reporting” provided by the lynch mob media. I also question why so many people object to anyone questioning the media’s many unverified versions of what actually happened. As has been _repeatedly_ pointed out to you, the media has **not** put out unverified versions of what actually happened. What I object to is your inability to understand what the media is reporting and your baseless assumption that the media have acted as a “lynch mob.” ---
**Author:** ![DragonAsh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/db5fbb/32.png) [@DragonAsh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DragonAsh)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2014, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1013 "2014-03-18T18:29:19Z")
I always wondered what it would be like, talking to one of the hopelessly, cruelly brain-washed North Korean citizens, mindlessly repeating devotions to their Beloved Leader. After reading 20 pages of doorhinge posts, I no longer wonder. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2014, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1014 "2014-03-19T00:49:08Z")
> [@MacCat](#): > > Who would be the _most likely **mayor** _ to be able to fix the problem(s) the Christie appointees inflicted upon Fort Lee? If you’ll provide a list of possible candidates, I’ll be more than happy to chose one. Or, you can direct your question to Port Authority’s Wildstein. Unless he’s not returning your calls, either? ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2014, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1015 "2014-03-19T00:50:11Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > As has been _repeatedly_ pointed out to you, the media has **not** put out unverified versions of what actually happened. What I object to is your inability to understand what the media is reporting and your baseless assumption that the media have acted as a “lynch mob.” How do you know that Christie is guilty? Or that Christie should be guilty? Where did you get your decision-making information from? A Ouija board? Magic 8-Ball? Tarot cards? Palm reader? News media? ---
**Author:** ![Zakalwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zakalwe/32/270_2.png) [@Zakalwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zakalwe)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2014, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1016 "2014-03-19T01:47:19Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > How do you know that Christie is guilty? Or that Christie should be guilty? Where did you get your decision-making information from? A Ouija board? Magic 8-Ball? Tarot cards? Palm reader? News media? How do you know that the media is saying Christie is unequivocally guilty? Cite to a news media piece stating this or shut the fuck up. ---
**Author:** ![Truman\_Burbank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecc23a/32.png) [@Truman\_Burbank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Truman_Burbank)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2014, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1017 "2014-03-19T20:02:09Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > post 818 - > Hahahaha. It was you who created the bestest red herring ever. It’s a classic. Other red herrings bow down to your red herring. > > Whether you acknowledge it or not, Sokolich is a key piece of the puzzle that is the Great NJ Lane Reassignment. It appears that the Port Authority bureaucracy is so screwed up that Port Authority’s Wildstein could have created a similar situation in any NJ town under Port Authority jurisdiction. Why was he drawn to Ft Lee? Was it because he knew that Sokolich had no political clout? Was it because he knew that Sokolich was the least likely mayor to be able to fix the problem? What is known is that after four days, Sokolich was able to accomplish nothing. His constituents must be very proud. That was parody of your prior post, you should know better and be ashamed of yourself for the misrepresentation. But I bet you’re not. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2014, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1018 "2014-03-20T14:12:40Z")
> [@Truman\_Burbank](#): > > That was parody of your prior post, you should know better and be ashamed of yourself for the misrepresentation. But I bet you’re not. Potato, potaeto, tomato, tomaeto. You gave it a shot. It failed. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2014, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1019 "2014-03-20T14:20:18Z")
> [@Zakalwe](#): > > How do you know that the media is saying Christie is unequivocally guilty? Cite to a news media piece stating this or shut the fuck up. \*Ed Rooney (Jeffrey Jones): That is why I have got to catch him this time- To show these kids the example he sets is a first class ticket to nowhere! Grace (Edie McClurg): Oh, Ed, you sounded like Dirty Harry just then. - quote from "Ferris Bueller’s Day Off\* You must be aware that there is, currently, no evidence that Christie was involved in the Great NJ Lane Reassignment. So what has led you to believe that Christie is guilty, or that Christie must be guilty, or that Christie should be guilty? Can you describe the logical progression you used to reach your heartfelt conclusion? Are you familiar with advertising and product branding? If you want to sell cola, or cars, or beer, it’s important to constantly get your product’s name in front of the potential consumers. Buy COKE, COKE, COKE. Buy FORD, FORD, FORD. Buy BUD, BUD, BUD. And don’t forget to include pictures of the product. It seems to me that the media has been using the same age old advertising technique to sell their product. Their product being that Christie must be guilty. Christie this, Christie that, Christie aide, Christie associate, Christie appointee, Christie, Christie, Christie. Display a picture of Christie and the GW Bridge while discussing Port Authority’s Sampson actual involvement in the attempted cover up. Unfortunately for the lynch mob media, there isn’t any evidence that Christie was involved, let alone guilty. But that hasn’t stopped people from jumping to conclusions. Has it? The media even chose to give a boost to Carl Lewis’s sagging career simply because Lewis mentioned Christie’s name as the reason Lewis couldn’t find work in New Jersey and moved to Texas. Assemblywoman Bonnie Watson Coleman, D-Mercer, was forced to resign from the George Washington Bridge lane closure investigative committee because she insists, without any actual evidence, that Christie must be guilty. Buh-bye Coleman. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2014, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1020 "2014-03-20T14:28:02Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > > [@Zakalwe](#): > > > > How do you know that the media is saying Christie is unequivocally guilty? Cite to a news media piece stating this or shut the fuck up. > > \*Ed Rooney (Jeffrey Jones): That is why I have got to catch him this time- To show these kids the example he sets is a first class ticket to nowhere! > Grace (Edie McClurg): Oh, Ed, you sounded like Dirty Harry just then. > > - quote from "Ferris Bueller’s Day Off\* Um… _Ferris Bueller’s Day Off_ is not a ‘news media piece’. I may have been misreading when **Zakalwe** wrote ‘Cite to a news media piece stating [that Christie is unequivocally guilty]’, but the way I read it gave me the impression that **Zakalwe** was asking that you post a citation from a reputable news outlet that says Christie is unequivocally guilty. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351.md?page=50) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351.md?page=52)