# Did Christie (or his staff) intentionally cause the Fort Lee traffic jam? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [January 9, 2014, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351 "2014-01-09T13:34:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 56
**Author:** ![MacCat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maccat/32/216_2.png) [@MacCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MacCat)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2014, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1101 "2014-03-28T21:03:25Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > I think the spider at the center of the web is this Samson guy. I see that rat has left the ship. [HuffPo](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/03/28/david-samson-resigns_n_5050214.html) > [@](#): > > New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie (R) announced Friday that David Samson, the chairman of the Port Authority and a close ally, was resigning in the wake of the Bridgegate scandal. > [@](#): > > The taxpayer-funded report concluded that Wildstein told Christie about the lane closures while they were happening, at a memorial event on Sept. 11. > [@](#): > > “I don’t know if we’ll ever know what the motive is,” Christie said Friday. “As I said when I was here [at a press conference] on Jan. 9, it mystifies me, on every level, why this was done.” ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2014, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1102 "2014-03-28T21:09:55Z")
The trajectory of the shit has intercepted the locus of the fan. Friday afternoon, as usual. ---
**Author:** ![Randolph](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Randolph](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Randolph)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2014, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1103 "2014-03-28T21:16:52Z")
Well, that’s it, then. Nothing else to see here. Everybody move along. Move along, now. Move along. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2014, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1104 "2014-03-29T00:10:30Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > She did it because she thought Christie wanted her to. Duh. I’m glad that you can finally provide proof that Christie wanted her to. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2014, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1105 "2014-03-29T00:17:36Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > I’ve only been sorta paying attention as this slow boring train wreck is pulled apart, but whatever negative impressions one can have of Christie I never thought stupid is one of them. > > But this governor’s inquiry/report he spent $1M on screams of stupidity and insult to anybody with the most basic of critical thinking abilities. > > If for no other reason, he should be voted out of office for this fuckshow. When you were sorta paying attention, did you happen to see Christie’s response to the reporter who said that the inquiry/report had cost $1M? How did you learn that Christie had spent $1M on the inquiry/report? ---
**Author:** ![MacCat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maccat/32/216_2.png) [@MacCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MacCat)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2014, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1106 "2014-03-29T00:18:26Z")
After hearing about it on MSNBC, I found this… [Newark Star Ledger](http://www.nj.com/politics/index.ssf/2014/03/bridget_kellys_lawyer_responds_to_internal_christie_report.html) > [@](#): > > In a statement obtained by the Newark-based Star-Ledger newspaper, Kelly’s attorney Michael Critchley, condemned the Christie-commissioned report released on Thursday, saying “The report’s venomous, gratuitous, and inappropriate sexist remarks concerning Ms. Kelly have no place in what is alleged to be a professional and independent report.” MSNBC also reported that “Kelly will be ‘fully cooperative’ if given safeguards by US Attorney” ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2014, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1107 "2014-03-29T00:28:58Z")
> [@MacCat](#): > > After hearing about it on MSNBC, I found this… > > [Newark Star Ledger](http://www.nj.com/politics/index.ssf/2014/03/bridget_kellys_lawyer_responds_to_internal_christie_report.html) > > MSNBC also reported that “Kelly will be ‘fully cooperative’ if given safeguards by US Attorney” HOORAY! It’s about time. Just to be clear, Patsy Kelly’s lawyer is talking about her talking to the federal criminal investigators, right? _IF_ they cut her a deal? ---
**Author:** ![MacCat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maccat/32/216_2.png) [@MacCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MacCat)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2014, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1108 "2014-03-29T00:40:02Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > It makes it just a little bit harder to check his work. Just like he doesn’t use the quote function correctly, ignores questions and then demands people ask them multiple times, all to clutter up the thread, obfuscate, and annoy people into no longer engaging with him. It worked on me, I’ll admit. A word that springs to mind regarding those tactics is _insufferable_. There really is no reason to engage. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2014, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1109 "2014-03-30T16:28:33Z")
> [@MacCat](#): > > A word that springs to mind regarding those tactics is _insufferable_. There really is no reason to engage. I accept your _insufferable_ comment as acknowledgement that you haven’t been able to provide proof that Christie was involved in the Great NJ Lane Reassignment. That doesn’t mean that the national conversation will end simply because you do not wish to participate. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2014, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1110 "2014-03-30T16:31:22Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > It makes it just a little bit harder to check his work. Just like he doesn’t use the quote function correctly, ignores questions and then demands people ask them multiple times, all to clutter up the thread, obfuscate, and annoy people into no longer engaging with him. It worked on me, I’ll admit. All of which has nothing to do with whether Christie intentionally caused the Fort Lee traffic jam or not. I had no idea that roman numerals would prove to be so difficult to understand. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2014, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1111 "2014-03-30T17:48:58Z")
So long as you stack the deck in your favor, by insisting that it’s all about proving beyond a shadow of a doubt that Christie is directly and personally responsible, you cannot lose. Congratulations! Please note, however, that the original title is Christie or his staff. You have already accepted that his staff were responsible, so your righteous insistence of proof beyond doubt is absurd. And this bit of drivel… > [@](#): > > I’m glad that you can finally provide proof that Christie wanted her to. Subordinates as a general rule are instruments of their superiors will. Nobody would have obeyed them except that they thought they were reflecting the will and power of the governor. It is an entirely reasonable presumption, and it is more true to say that it is the opposite that must be proven, that they were _not_. At this point, I’m thinking that they were misled to believe that it was Christie’s idea and will. It hardly matters, they are his people, his administration, and the responsibility rests squarely with him. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2014, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1112 "2014-03-30T17:57:45Z")
Did anyone post a link to the report? ---
**Author:** ![MacCat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maccat/32/216_2.png) [@MacCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MacCat)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2014, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1113 "2014-03-30T19:06:37Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > I accept your _insufferable_ comment as acknowledgement that you haven’t been able to provide proof that Christie was involved in the Great NJ Lane Reassignment. It’s not my job “to provide proof that Christie was involved”. I think it’s _possible_ that he wasn’t involved, though he likely was. Insufferable relates to your posting techniques. You answer NOTHING, just constantly sidetrack in a desperate attempt to deflect blame on to anyone but Christie. > [@doorhinge](#): > > That doesn’t mean that the national conversation will end simply because you do not wish to participate. Seriously? I’m _so_ disappointed… 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2014, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1114 "2014-03-30T19:30:17Z")
> [@MacCat](#): > > It’s not my job “to provide proof that Christie was involved”. I think it’s _possible_ that he wasn’t involved, though he likely was. Insufferable relates to your posting techniques. You answer NOTHING, just constantly sidetrack in a desperate attempt to deflect blame on to anyone but Christie. _ **And** _, he constantly asserts that others have stated that Christie was involved as “a fact,” when no one here or in the media has ever done so. He arguing with imaginary figures, but does so tirelessly. So, that’s something. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2014, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1115 "2014-03-30T20:37:55Z")
> [@j666](#): > > Did anyone post a link to the report? [If you must.](http://www.businessinsider.com/bridgegate-report-chris-christies-lawyers-2014-3) ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2014, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1116 "2014-03-30T22:11:34Z")
[This is what I was looking for.](http://www.scribd.com/doc/214880622/REPORT-OF-GIBSON-DUNN-CRUTCHER-LLP) > [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > [If you must.](http://www.businessinsider.com/bridgegate-report-chris-christies-lawyers-2014-3) I’ve just started reading it; there are some word choices that look a bit slanted to me, but that’s all so far. If I find anything really interesting, I’ll post. ---
**Author:** ![not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/not_what_you_d_expect/32/3246_2.png) [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/not_what_you_d_expect)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2014, 9:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1117 "2014-03-31T09:10:20Z")
That report is a joke and I think it’s likely to push people to start talking. I don’t think we’ve heard the last about Bridgegate and Christies involvement in it. I sure do hope we learn the truth before the 2016 Elections. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1118 "2014-04-01T02:05:49Z")
The Gibson, Dunn, & Crutcher LLP report doesn’t speak very highly of Mayor Zimmer’s remembrances of events. \*3. Mayor Zimmer’s Allegations About Executive Director Ferzan Do Not Withstand Scrutiny Mayor Zimmer’s allegations of her discussion with Executive Director Ferzan, in which she has claimed that he linked Sandy aid and “Rebuild by Design” to “how much development [she was] willing to do,” are likewise unsupported by the contemporaneous documentary evidence and eyewitness accounts. a. Mayor Zimmer’s Recollection Of The Timeline Is Inaccurate Mayor Zimmer’s account of the timeline of her last conversation with Ferzan is inaccurate. Mayor Zimmer alleged to the media on January 20, 2014, that Ferzan’s comments were made during a meeting “a month ago.” However, documents reflect that the last time Ferzan and Mayor Zimmer had a meeting was on November 25, 2013. At that meeting, Ferzan briefed approximately 20 to 30 or more mayors and staffers simultaneously to inform them about the second allotment of CDBG-DR funds from HUD. Ferzan has unequivocally denied raising private development with Mayor Zimmer, or tying Sandy aid to anything other than the objective, transparent criteria. We have spoken with at least 10 eyewitnesses to Ferzan’s briefing, and not one supported Mayor Zimmer’s account. In fact, all of them said that Ferzan never tied Sandy aid to private development or anything other than the objective criteria of the programs at the November 25, 2013 briefing, and has never done so at any other meeting he has held relating to Sandy aid programs. Indeed, many witnesses that we spoke with in the Governor’s Office, the DEP, the DCA, and OEM said consistently and uniformly that Ferzan emphasized objectivity and transparency in allocating Sandy aid.\* > **[Gibson Dunn Report On Findings of Christie Probe | PDF | Government](https://www.scribd.com/doc/214880622/REPORT-OF-GIBSON-DUNN-CRUTCHER-LLP)** > > Though there is evidence to show the lane closures near the George Washington Bridge were intended to target a local mayor, there is no proof that it is because he would not endorse New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie, his lawyers say. Looks like more of the so-called _mounting evidence_ against Christie falls by the wayside. ---
**Author:** ![bengangmo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@bengangmo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bengangmo)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1119 "2014-04-01T04:24:55Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > The Gibson, Dunn, & Crutcher LLP report doesn’t speak very highly of Mayor Zimmer’s remembrances of events. > > \*3. Mayor Zimmer’s Allegations About Executive Director Ferzan Do Not Withstand Scrutiny > > Mayor Zimmer’s allegations of her discussion with Executive Director Ferzan, in which she has claimed that he linked Sandy aid and “Rebuild by Design” to “how much development [she was] willing to do,” are likewise unsupported by the contemporaneous documentary evidence and eyewitness accounts. > > a. Mayor Zimmer’s Recollection Of The Timeline Is Inaccurate > > Mayor Zimmer’s account of the timeline of her last conversation with Ferzan is inaccurate. Mayor Zimmer alleged to the media on January 20, 2014, that Ferzan’s comments were made during a meeting “a month ago.” However, documents reflect that the last time Ferzan and Mayor Zimmer had a meeting was on November 25, 2013. At that meeting, Ferzan briefed approximately 20 to 30 or more mayors and staffers simultaneously to inform them about the second allotment of CDBG-DR funds from HUD. > > Ferzan has unequivocally denied raising private development with Mayor Zimmer, or tying Sandy aid to anything other than the objective, transparent criteria. We have spoken with at least 10 eyewitnesses to Ferzan’s briefing, and not one supported Mayor Zimmer’s account. In fact, all of them said that Ferzan never tied Sandy aid to private development or anything other than the objective criteria of the programs at the November 25, 2013 briefing, and has never done so at any other meeting he has held relating to Sandy aid programs. Indeed, many witnesses that we spoke with in the Governor’s Office, the DEP, the DCA, and OEM said consistently and uniformly that Ferzan emphasized objectivity and transparency in allocating Sandy aid.\* > > [Report of Gibson, Dunn & Crutcher LLP | PDF | Government](http://www.scribd.com/doc/214880622/REPORT-OF-GIBSON-DUNN-CRUTCHER-LLP) > > Looks like more of the so-called _mounting evidence_ against Christie falls by the wayside. Good god - Even I can see that’s answering a question not asked… Do people really think we’re so stupid? ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 5:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351/1120 "2014-04-01T05:23:27Z")
Mayor Zimmer also seems to have a faulty recollection of her interactions with the Lt. Governor. Was Zimmer simply forgetful or was she trying to mislead the public by duping the media? (I apologize in advance for GIBSON, DUNN & CRUTCHER LLP use of roman numerals in their report.) \*a. Mayor Zimmer’s Exchange With Lieutenant Governor Guadagno Mayor Zimmer has alleged that, two days after she sent a May 8, 2013 letter to Governor Christie requesting more Sandy aid, the Lieutenant Governor, having met “w/ the Gov.,” “created” a public event at a ShopRite in Hoboken, invited Mayor Zimmer to attend, and then, after the May 13, 2013 event, “pulled [her] aside in the parking lot” to deliver “a direct message from the governor” that “if you don’t move ahead” with the Rockefeller Group’s project, “we’re not going to be able to help you” with more Sandy aid. Mayor Zimmer further alleged that the Lieutenant Governor said to her at that time: “I know it’s not right. I know these things should not be connected, but they are and if you tell anyone, I’ll deny it.” In other words, to credit Mayor Zimmer’s account, one would have to believe that Guadagno, a former federal prosecutor and county sheriff, made a full confession—right there, out in the open, in the supermarket’s parking lot, immediately after that public event, with press and staff nearby—that she was doing something wrong, knew it was wrong, and was doing it anyway. Our investigation found that Mayor Zimmer’s account of this exchange is, in material respects, demonstrably false: (i) Guadagno did not meet with the Governor and then create this event to deliver his message to Mayor Zimmer. In fact, the decision to invite Mayor Zimmer to the event occurred midday on Friday, May 10, 2013 — before Guadagno met with the Governor at a senior staff retreat later that day, as contemporaneous documents show. (ii) This was not a “created” event. It was weeks in the planning, as contemporaneous documents show. (iii) It was not the Lieutenant Governor who “pulled” Mayor Zimmer “aside” to have this private meeting. It was actually Mayor Zimmer who requested the meeting, as contemporaneous documents show. And she requested that meeting to pitch her “(i)mportant idea” to fund a sweeping, post-Sandy flood mitigation plan for Hoboken. (iv) It was Mayor Zimmer who had the Rockefeller Group on her mind, not Guadagno, as contemporaneous documents show. That is because the Rockefeller Group designed Hoboken’s flood mitigation plan—the same one that Mayor Zimmer was seeking Sandy aid to fund—but its development project, backed by lawyers she perceived as close to the Governor, had just suffered a setback before Hoboken’s Planning Board five days earlier when its application for redevelopment benefits was voted down. Mayor Zimmer was anxious about its status, having recently written the Governor complaining that “the solution to Hoboken’s flooding challenges cannot be dependent on future development.” (v) Guadagno had to be firm with Mayor Zimmer during their private meeting, pushing back on Mayor Zimmer’s funding demands and unwarranted assumption that the stalled Rockefeller Group project was why Hoboken was not getting more Sandy aid. And we know what Guadagno said because she repeated it to the press that same day: “[While] the mayor is a great advocate for Hoboken, . . . the governor has to be an advocate for the entire state. We are trying to [do] the best we can with the resources we have.” (vi) Guadagno has had no role in the Sandy aid decision-making process, which is formula-driven, based on objective criteria, and subject to federal oversight. Therefore, she personally could not have affected Hoboken’s Sandy aid allocations at all. Moreover, even though the Rockefeller Group project did not “move ahead,” Hoboken nevertheless then got all of the CDGB funding it applied for ($200,000), and its allocation for hazard mitigation funding is roughly equivalent to what other applying municipalities received ($142,080), and is likely to change when all the grant applications are rescored. Both the Lieutenant Governor and Governor deny Mayor Zimmer’s allegations. And the Lieutenant Governor’s account of what transpired is corroborated by hard evidence, contemporaneous with the events in question. Mayor Zimmer’s isn’t.\* > **[Gibson Dunn Report On Findings of Christie Probe | PDF | Government](https://www.scribd.com/doc/214880622/REPORT-OF-GIBSON-DUNN-CRUTCHER-LLP)** > > Though there is evidence to show the lane closures near the George Washington Bridge were intended to target a local mayor, there is no proof that it is because he would not endorse New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie, his lawyers say. Mayor Zimmer’s isn’t. The alleged “mounting” evidence seems to be getting smaller and smaller. I can only hope that the federal criminal investigation finds a way to get Kelly to implicate Christie before the “mounting” evidence disappears altogether. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351.md?page=55) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-christie-or-his-staff-intentionally-cause-the-fort-lee-traffic-jam/678351.md?page=57)