# Did cowboys really duel each other? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 8, 2020, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099 "2020-03-08T12:38:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![CastletonSnob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7ea924/32.png) [@CastletonSnob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CastletonSnob)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2020, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099/1 "2020-03-08T12:38:54Z")
You’ve probably seen Western duels in movies or TV shows. Two cowboys standing at opposite sides of the town, seeing who can pull out their gun and shoot the other the fastest. Did cowboys really duel each other, or is it just an invention of Hollywood? ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2020, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099/2 "2020-03-08T13:03:34Z")
Pretty much an invention. There were gunfights, of course (e.g., the OK Corral ), but next to none when the parties faced off. It was far more likely that it was an ambush, or just two people getting angry and drawing on each other wherever they were. It actually predated movies; pulp westerns of the 19th century included them. One western town even used to stage them for tourists. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2020, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099/3 "2020-03-08T15:37:16Z")
Most sources seem to say that there was only one case of a classic gun duel in the Old West - the one between Wild Bill Hickok and David Tutt: > **[Hickok–Tutt shootout](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wild_Bill_Hickok_%E2%80%93_Davis_Tutt_shootout)** > > The Hickok–Tutt shootout was a gunfight that occurred on July 21, 1865, in the town square of Springfield, Missouri between Wild Bill Hickok and gambler Davis Tutt. It is one of the few recorded instances in the Old West of a one-on-one pistol quick-draw duel in a public place, in the manner later made iconic by countless dime novels, radio dramas, and Western films such as High Noon. The first story of the shootout was detailed in an article in Harper's Magazine in 1867, making Hickok a house Tu... ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2020, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099/4 "2020-03-08T16:17:08Z")
I believe the custom of formal dueling is one of those chivalric holdovers of the European upper classes, all about the elaborate honor code. It did persist, especially in the American South, for a good while, as the dominant culture there intended to duplicate English upperclass lifestyles. But cowboys were underpaid over-worked uneducated herdsmen, a mix of latino, black, and lower-class white. They came from no such culture. Lots of drunken brawls, that I can buy. ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2020, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099/5 "2020-03-08T17:40:55Z")
Seems like a stupid thing to do by both parties, since I believe _both_ would end up getting shot. A person shot by a bullet in the gut or chest can easily return fire… ---
**Author:** ![RioRico](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f04885/32.png) [@RioRico](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RioRico)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2020, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099/6 "2020-03-08T17:57:20Z")
[Gunfight at the O.K. Corral](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gunfight_at_the_O.K._Corral) didn’t happen anywhere near the O.K. Corral and wasn’t a duel but a shootout after outlaws refused to hand over their weapons to lawmen, as was required in most Western towns. Gunsmen, amateur or hired, did not duel. Handguns and rifles and their cartridges were costly; many Old West denizens continued to use percussion (ball-and-cap) firearms and even flintlocks, which were pretty cheap to operate. Knives and clubs don’t need reloading so death by penetration or blunt object was common. I don’t see a breakdown of [Western homicide rates](https://cjrc.osu.edu/research/interdisciplinary/hvd/homicide-rates-american-west) by weapon but the Old West was a pretty deadly environment. ---
**Author:** ![GreysonCarlisle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@GreysonCarlisle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreysonCarlisle)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2020, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099/7 "2020-03-08T18:44:31Z")
> [@Wendell\_Wagner](#): > > Most sources seem to say that there was only one case of a classic gun duel in the Old West - the one between Wild Bill Hickok and David Tutt: > > [Hickok–Tutt shootout - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wild_Bill_Hickok_%E2%80%93_Davis_Tutt_shootout) I wonder if Hickok got his watch back. ---
**Author:** ![Telperion](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telperion/32/509_2.png) [@Telperion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telperion)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2020, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099/8 "2020-03-08T19:31:36Z")
> [@Crafter\_Man](#): > > Seems like a stupid thing to do by both parties, since I believe _both_ would end up getting shot. A person shot by a bullet in the gut or chest can easily return fire… I don’t know about easily, it seems to me that it would be really effing difficult to aim a gun while you’re in horrible agony and blood is spurting out of your torso, but I have to admit I’ve never tried it. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2020, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099/9 "2020-03-08T20:03:40Z")
> [@Crafter\_Man](#): > > Seems like a stupid thing to do by both parties, since I believe _both_ would end up getting shot. A person shot by a bullet in the gut or chest can easily return fire… Gun duels did exist, but (for reasons that might be immediately obvious) they went away with the introduction of rifling. Previous to that, duelists usually fought to “first blood”. Occasionally, someone would die because of a lucky hit (by ball or by blade) but I suspect that the survival rate was high enough that people were willing to do it. Alexander Hamilton and Aaron Burr, for example, dueled by pistol. ---
**Author:** ![Hatchie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hatchie/32/3983_2.png) [@Hatchie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hatchie)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2020, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099/10 "2020-03-08T20:21:46Z")
Mister, I don’t doubt that you was good in your day, but I also reckon you ain’t as quick as you once was. And this kid, I hear he’s a pretty fast draw; mebbe not as fast as you was twenny year ago, but he makes up for it in bein’ just plain mean. Hell, he’s already planted a dozen good men. It ain’t no shame if you decide to hang up your Colt - ain’t we seen enough killin’ in this town already? ---
**Author:** ![Telperion](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telperion/32/509_2.png) [@Telperion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telperion)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2020, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099/11 "2020-03-08T20:27:07Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > Gun duels did exist, but (for reasons that might be immediately obvious) they went away with the introduction of rifling. Duelling pistols were rifled, because that is one situation where you probably wouldn’t want to miss your target. ---
**Author:** ![GreysonCarlisle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@GreysonCarlisle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreysonCarlisle)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2020, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099/12 "2020-03-08T20:34:03Z")
> [@Telperion](#): > > I don’t know about easily, it seems to me that it would be really effing difficult to aim a gun while you’re in horrible agony and blood is spurting out of your torso, but I have to admit I’ve never tried it. It’s happens pretty often. Cops sometimes don’t know they’re hit until after the gunfight. Reports of the OK Corral say that Frank McLaury was shot in the gut (he was well aware of the fact), but he kept shooting, even managing to graze Doc Holliday before being shot in the ear. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2020, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099/13 "2020-03-08T20:48:23Z")
> [@GreysonCarlisle](#): > > I wonder if Hickok got his watch back. I wonder where the watch is now. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2020, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099/14 "2020-03-08T20:48:58Z")
> [@RioRico](#): > > [Gunfight at the O.K. Corral](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gunfight_at_the_O.K._Corral) didn’t happen anywhere near the O.K. Corral … It was in a vacant lot behind the Ok Corral, but “GunFight in the vacant lot near Fly’s and the OK corral” has no ring to it. The corral was the nearest well known landmark. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2020, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099/15 "2020-03-08T20:52:14Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > Gun duels did exist, but (for reasons that might be immediately obvious) they went away with the introduction of rifling. …l. No, they went away with the introduction of _revolvers_… ---
**Author:** ![Ignotus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/ecc23a/32.png) [@Ignotus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ignotus)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2020, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099/16 "2020-03-08T21:00:02Z")
> [@Telperion](#): > > Duelling pistols were rifled, because that is one situation where you probably wouldn’t want to miss your target. That would depend on the rules, though. If it’s the classic single-shot duel I’d say that what you’d want most of all were your opponent missing his target! Thirty steps apart, in the morning mists, with clumsy weapons of low precision! Honor defended, and no blood loss! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Telperion](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telperion/32/509_2.png) [@Telperion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telperion)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2020, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099/17 "2020-03-08T21:09:35Z")
> [@Ignotus](#): > > That would depend on the rules, though. If it’s the classic single-shot duel I’d say that what you’d want most of all were your opponent missing his target! Thirty steps apart, in the morning mists, with clumsy weapons of low precision! Honor defended, and no blood loss! 😃 People used to see it differently back then. In most places it was considered quite cowardly to use smooth-bored guns, and even where it wasn’t they would often sneak in scratch rifling. Nobody wanted to look like a bad shot, I suppose. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2020, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099/18 "2020-03-08T21:10:45Z")
> [@Telperion](#): > > Duelling pistols were rifled, because that is one situation where you probably wouldn’t want to miss your target. The Hamilton-Burr pistols were smooth bore, high end, purpose-built dueling pistols: > **[The Little-Known Story of the Gun That Killed Alexander Hamilton](https://www.popularmechanics.com/military/weapons/a21083805/hamilton-dueling-pistols/)** > > These two English flintlock dueling pistols changed America forever. This was very near the end of the dueling era. In Europe, you could choose between the two by the 19th century. But, if you chose rifled then both participants got a rifled weapon. You’re more accurate but so is your opponent. This was seen as more manly but was optional. The British seem to have been among the earlier groups to start producing rifled dueling pistols. Likewise, they’re among the earliest to make dueling a crime. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2020, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099/19 "2020-03-09T00:30:42Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > I wonder where the watch is now. Christopher Walken kept it safe. ---
**Author:** ![Ignotus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/ecc23a/32.png) [@Ignotus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ignotus)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2020, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099/20 "2020-03-09T00:37:13Z")
> [@GreysonCarlisle](#): > > I wonder if Hickok got his watch back. He should have watched his back instead! 😉 [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-cowboys-really-duel-each-other/849099.md?page=2)