# Did Hoffa ever collect on any of the loans he made to the mafia? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 29, 2021, 9:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-hoffa-ever-collect-on-any-of-the-loans-he-made-to-the-mafia/955122 "2021-11-29T09:08:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![whc.03grady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a6a055/32.png) [@whc.03grady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whc.03grady)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2021, 9:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-hoffa-ever-collect-on-any-of-the-loans-he-made-to-the-mafia/955122/1 "2021-11-29T09:08:02Z")
Did Hoffa ever collect on any of the loans he made to the mafia? Did he ever expect to? If not, what was he gonna do, just let it ride? How do you collect if, somehow, the mafia owes you money anyway? ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2021, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-hoffa-ever-collect-on-any-of-the-loans-he-made-to-the-mafia/955122/2 "2021-11-29T13:06:30Z")
Pretty sure his debt got cancelled when he was cancelled. Its kind of the Mafias thing of theirs. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2021, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-hoffa-ever-collect-on-any-of-the-loans-he-made-to-the-mafia/955122/3 "2021-11-29T13:14:02Z")
Hoffa is the guy Pacino played in _The Irishman_ right? ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2021, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-hoffa-ever-collect-on-any-of-the-loans-he-made-to-the-mafia/955122/4 "2021-11-29T13:15:44Z")
> [@Si\_Amigo](#): > > Pretty sure his debt got cancelled when he was cancelled. Its kind of the Mafias thing of theirs. My exact thought the moment I read the OP! 🤣 On a serious note, I would say that, when he went to prison, he lost any and all power he had, so that would be time. From everything I’ve read, I’ve gotten the distinct impression that he was whacked because he insisted on trying to regain power once he was released. If he had just quietly slipped into anonymity, I think he would have been okay. ---
**Author:** ![whc.03grady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a6a055/32.png) [@whc.03grady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whc.03grady)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2021, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-hoffa-ever-collect-on-any-of-the-loans-he-made-to-the-mafia/955122/5 "2021-11-29T13:18:29Z")
Yes yes, ha ha. I meant while he was alive. ---
**Author:** ![SpacemanSpiff\_II](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e19adc/32.png) [@SpacemanSpiff\_II](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpacemanSpiff_II)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2021, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-hoffa-ever-collect-on-any-of-the-loans-he-made-to-the-mafia/955122/6 "2021-11-29T14:59:44Z")
The money Hoffa loaned to the mafia was the Teamsters pension fund money. It’s my understanding that overall the Teamsters did pretty well with the Mafia, which wouldn’t be the case if all the debts were never paid back. I once read an article about this, but couldn’t find it just now. But the notion is referenced in [Opinion: How the Teamsters pension disappeared more quickly under Wall Street than the mob - MarketWatch](https://www.marketwatch.com/story/how-the-teamsters-pension-disappeared-more-quickly-under-wall-street-than-the-mob-2016-04-04) ---
**Author:** ![Kropotkin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kropotkin/32/18045_2.png) [@Kropotkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kropotkin)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2021, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-hoffa-ever-collect-on-any-of-the-loans-he-made-to-the-mafia/955122/7 "2021-11-29T17:25:50Z")
This is correct: most of the pension fund investment was in mob-controlled casinos, which returned a better rate than Wall Street over the same period. Tony Soprano: “and I don’t want to hear about the fuckin economy either! I don’t want to hear it. Sil, break it down for them. What two businesses have traditionally been recession proof since time immemorial?” Silvio Dante: “Certain aspects of show business… and our thing.” I suppose one could argue therefore Hoffa had fiduciary duty to invest with the mob. ---
**Author:** ![3AxisCtrl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/3/ecd19e/32.png) [@3AxisCtrl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/3AxisCtrl)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2021, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-hoffa-ever-collect-on-any-of-the-loans-he-made-to-the-mafia/955122/8 "2021-11-29T17:28:47Z")
> [@Kropotkin](#): > > I suppose one could argue therefore Hoffa had fiduciary duty to invest with the mob. And the mob no doubt felt they had a duty to deal with Hoffa. ---
**Author:** ![Kropotkin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kropotkin/32/18045_2.png) [@Kropotkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kropotkin)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2021, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-hoffa-ever-collect-on-any-of-the-loans-he-made-to-the-mafia/955122/9 "2021-11-29T17:31:35Z")
No doubt. To quote Tony Soprano again, “This thing is a pyramid since time immemorial, shit goes downhill, money goes up: it’s that simple.” Hoffa threatened to upset the pyramid by trying to regain leadership of the union; his replacement was a more compliant stooge with no legal baggage. Well, not the same baggage and attention from law enforcement Hoffa carried