# Did Jesus only eat kosher? When did Christians stop eating only kosher foods? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 22, 2005, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-jesus-only-eat-kosher-when-did-christians-stop-eating-only-kosher-foods/336875 "2005-12-22T22:24:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2005, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-jesus-only-eat-kosher-when-did-christians-stop-eating-only-kosher-foods/336875/1 "2005-12-22T22:24:05Z")
Did the ending of kosher rules for Christians start with Jesus himself? Did He nosh a nice ham and cheese with his goyim buddies? If not, when did Christians stop following the kosher rules? ---
**Author:** ![Tevildo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Tevildo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tevildo)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2005, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-jesus-only-eat-kosher-when-did-christians-stop-eating-only-kosher-foods/336875/2 "2005-12-22T22:29:28Z")
Acts 10:9-15. “On the morrow, as they went on their journey, and drew nigh unto the city, Peter went up upon the housetop to pray about the sixth hour: And he became very hungry, and would have eaten: but while they made ready, he fell into a trance, And saw heaven opened, and a certain vessel descending upon him, as it had been a great sheet knit at the four corners, and let down to the earth: Wherein were all manner of fourfooted beasts of the earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and fowls of the air. And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and eat. But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten any thing that is common or unclean. And the voice spake unto him again the second time, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.” So, yes, all the apostles would have kept kosher until this incident. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2005, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-jesus-only-eat-kosher-when-did-christians-stop-eating-only-kosher-foods/336875/3 "2005-12-22T22:33:00Z")
Well, Jesus is reported to have flouted some of the hygiene laws to make the point that _it isn’t what goes into a man’s mouth than makes him unclean, it’s what comes out_. And there’s that bit where Peter is instructed (in a dream or vision, by a voice he responded to as ‘Lord’) to eat animals he considered unclean; I know this is supposed to be an analogy of the gentiles, but that doesn’t necessarily disqualify it as having a more mundane interpretation too. OTOH, in Acts 15, James instructs his audience to abstain from blood and the meat of strangled animals. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2005, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-jesus-only-eat-kosher-when-did-christians-stop-eating-only-kosher-foods/336875/4 "2005-12-22T22:54:12Z")
How much of this had to do with Paul’s efforts to spread Christianity to the Gentiles? It certainly makes it easier to add converts if they don’t have to change the foods they eat. I mean all that “love they neighbor” crap is hard enough without having to ditch the _har gow_, or have to decline when the waiter says: “today the chef is serving a wonderful Anatolian kid goat simmered in a sauce of its mother’s milk, accomplanied by fresh Mediteranian scallops.” ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2005, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-jesus-only-eat-kosher-when-did-christians-stop-eating-only-kosher-foods/336875/5 "2005-12-22T23:00:10Z")
[One source’s view](http://www.wells.edu/whatsnew/wnspch25.htm) > [@](#): > > This earliest community of believers had Peter as its first leader, perhaps because he was the first to believe that God had raised Jesus and made him Messiah and Lord. The group met in the Jerusalem temple, observed Jewish customs, shared their resources, and was opposed by the Jerusalem priesthood. They also seem to have met in one another’s houses to share in the breaking of bread, through which they participated symbolically in the crucifixion and exaltation of their Lord. > > Very early in Jerusalem there arose another group whose language and outlook was more Greek than Hebrew, more Hellenistic than Jewish. The earliest members of this group were Stephen (who was stoned by the Jews), Philip (an associate of Stephen), Simon the magician, a nameless Ethiopian government official, Paul, and Cornelius (who was the first Gentile convert). This group had a more universal outlook than the group that had formed around Peter’s leadership - a view beyond Judaism. They advocated a Christianity independent of the mother religion, not just as a sect within Judaism. They maintained that there was no need for followers of Jesus to observe the Jewish Torah (or law), and they soon found themselves in disagreement with the Jewish Christians over issues such as observance of the Jewish dietary laws and the requirement of male circumcision. > > It was in Syria, in the city of Antioch, that followers of what had often been called “the Way,” were first called “Christians” (or “Christers”). Paul and a traveling companion Barnabas were commissioned by the church at Antioch to undertake a journey to spread the nascent religion to Asia Minor (current western Turkey). Upon their return from that journey, they found a group of Jewish Christians insisting that Gentile converts be circumcised. Paul’s bitterness and anger over this expectation are clearly presented from his perspective in his Letter to the Galatians. There he blatantly challenges the authority of the so-called “pillars of the church,” Peter, James, and John, and he states clearly in Galatians 2 that when Peter came to Antioch he “opposed him to his face, since he was manifestly in the wrong.” Antioch raised these issues with Jerusalem and sent Paul and Barnabas to a council in Jerusalem in about the year 50. > > A compromise was reached in Jerusalem. Gentile Christians must avoid sexual immorality and obey three of the dietary regulations: avoid meat offered to idols, blood, and strangled things. Circumcision was not included among the requirements. The parties agreed that Peter would preach to the Jews and Paul to the Gentiles. It appears that neither party lived up to the agreement. Paul went to the Gentiles and preached a gospel free of observance of Torah. And emissaries from Jerusalem followed him to many of the cities in which he preached to tell the churches Paul had established that he was preaching a false gospel, devoid of the requirements of circumcision and the observance of Torah. ---
**Author:** ![Rune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e68b1a/32.png) [@Rune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rune)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2005, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-jesus-only-eat-kosher-when-did-christians-stop-eating-only-kosher-foods/336875/6 "2005-12-23T00:05:23Z")
Also there were some Christians, called Judaizers, that maintained that they were bound by the Jewish customs. [http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/08537a.htm](http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/08537a.htm) Wasn’t it part of the deal struck between Paul and James, that Gentiles need not uphold the Jewish laws, while (converted) Jews had to? ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2005, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-jesus-only-eat-kosher-when-did-christians-stop-eating-only-kosher-foods/336875/7 "2005-12-23T01:26:34Z")
> [@Rune](#): > > Also there were some Christians, called Judaizers, that maintained that they were bound by the Jewish customs. [http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/08537a.htm](http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/08537a.htm) > > Wasn’t it part of the deal struck between Paul and James, that Gentiles need not uphold the Jewish laws, while (converted) Jews had to? UM. See the last paragraph in my cite. ---
**Author:** ![raindog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@raindog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raindog)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2005, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-jesus-only-eat-kosher-when-did-christians-stop-eating-only-kosher-foods/336875/8 "2005-12-23T01:55:54Z")
> [@Tevildo](#): > > Acts 10:9-15. “On the morrow, as they went on their journey, and drew nigh unto the city, Peter went up upon the housetop to pray about the sixth hour: And he became very hungry, and would have eaten: but while they made ready, he fell into a trance, And saw heaven opened, and a certain vessel descending upon him, as it had been a great sheet knit at the four corners, and let down to the earth: Wherein were all manner of fourfooted beasts of the earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and fowls of the air. And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and eat. But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten any thing that is common or unclean. And the voice spake unto him again the second time, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.” > > So, yes, all the apostles would have kept kosher until this incident. That is incorrect. The symbolism of this vision, as John Mace pointed out, was that The Good News about the Christ was no longer to be a “Jew-Only” affair, and henceforth preaching about the Christ/Messiah was to include Gentiles. This was a vision, and Peter himself clarifies it’s meaning, in the verses that followed: **(KJV)** > [@](#): > > **Acts 9:16-35** \*16This was done thrice: and the vessel was received up again into heaven. **17Now while Peter doubted in himself what this vision which he had seen should mean,** behold, the men which were sent from Cornelius had made enquiry for Simon’s house, and stood before the gate, 18And called, and asked whether Simon, which was surnamed Peter, were lodged there. **19While Peter thought on the vision, the Spirit said unto him, Behold, three men seek thee. 20Arise therefore, and get thee down, and go with them, doubting nothing: for I have sent them.** 21Then Peter went down to the men which were sent unto him from Cornelius; and said, Behold, I am he whom ye seek: what is the cause wherefore ye are come? 22And they said, Cornelius the centurion, a just man, and one that feareth God, and of good report among all the nation of the Jews, was warned from God by an holy angel to send for thee into his house, and to hear words of thee. 23Then called he them in, and lodged them. And on the morrow Peter went away with them, and certain brethren from Joppa accompanied him. 24And the morrow after they entered into Caesarea. And Cornelius waited for them, and he had called together his kinsmen and near friends. 25And as Peter was coming in, Cornelius met him, and fell down at his feet, and worshipped him. 26But Peter took him up, saying, Stand up; I myself also am a man. 27And as he talked with him, he went in, and found many that were come together. 28 **And he said unto them, Ye know how that it is an unlawful thing for a man that is a Jew to keep company, or come unto one of another nation; but God hath shewed me that I should not call any man common or unclean. 29Therefore came I unto you without gainsaying,** as soon as I was sent for: I ask therefore for what intent ye have sent for me? 30And Cornelius said, Four days ago I was fasting until this hour; and at the ninth hour I prayed in my house, and, behold, a man stood before me in bright clothing, 31And said, Cornelius, thy prayer is heard, and thine alms are had in remembrance in the sight of God. 32Send therefore to Joppa, and call hither Simon, whose surname is Peter; he is lodged in the house of one Simon a tanner by the sea side: who, when he cometh, shall speak unto thee. **33Immediately therefore I sent to thee; and thou hast well done that thou art come. Now therefore are we all here present before God, to hear all things that are commanded thee of God. 34Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons: 35But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.** \* **Bolding mine** Christians are no longer required to keep the dietary restrictions of the Law Code. But these are _not_ the scrpitures that make that case. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2005, 8:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-jesus-only-eat-kosher-when-did-christians-stop-eating-only-kosher-foods/336875/9 "2005-12-23T08:34:37Z")
As I said above, just because the vision is argued to have a spiritual interpretation, doesn’t mean it cannot have an additional mundane one. That’s the whole reason why spiritual parables/analogies etc _work_ - they reflect a plausible real-world scenario. ---
**Author:** ![raindog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@raindog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raindog)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2005, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-jesus-only-eat-kosher-when-did-christians-stop-eating-only-kosher-foods/336875/10 "2005-12-23T12:59:03Z")
There is no need to _misapply_ a scripture because it _might_ mean something else. There are adequate scrpiptures that show that the Messiah (Christ) was for the Jews, and sent for the Jews. There are also scriptures that show that the Apostles largely recognized that the rigidity of the Law Code no longer applied to them after the Christ arrived and was killed. There were disputes however, especially among the [now Christian] Pharisees, who were known to be sticklers in matters of the Law. At any rate, there is no need to take liberties with this text–and expand it to mean something that it just doesn’t say. There are other texts that say just that, and don’t require us to guess, speculate or put words into the author’s mouth that they just didn’t say. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2005, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-jesus-only-eat-kosher-when-did-christians-stop-eating-only-kosher-foods/336875/11 "2005-12-23T15:44:48Z")
I recall someone’s saying that the Last Supper was a Seder. Is that right? ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2005, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-jesus-only-eat-kosher-when-did-christians-stop-eating-only-kosher-foods/336875/12 "2005-12-23T16:47:11Z")
[http://www.jewfaq.org/holidaya.htm](http://www.jewfaq.org/holidaya.htm) Yep, generally, it’s believed to have been such.