# Did John Kerry take a page out of Westboro Baptist Church's playbook? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 24, 2013, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798 "2013-06-24T16:24:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798/1 "2013-06-24T16:24:39Z")
Mother Nature Hates Carbon! > **[As Deadly Floods Hit India, Kerry Calls on New Delhi to Address Climate Change...](https://world.time.com/2013/06/24/as-deadly-floods-hit-india-kerry-calls-on-new-delhi-to-address-climate-change/)** > > It was a fitting time to talk about the weather. With some 700 dead in the massive floods that have hit the northeastern state of Uttarakhand, new torrents of rain and landslides put rescue efforts on hold on Monday. Seriously? In the wake of 700 deaths and thousands displaced by flooding that has hit the country, he decides to make a political statement about climate change? Too soon John? Oh and here’s $150,000 from the United States. That’s like dropping some change in front of a homeless person, thinking about picking it up and then saying “oh, you can keep it.” ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798/2 "2013-06-24T16:30:07Z")
I’m not offended by Secretary Kerry’s comments. I didn’t see a political statement, but an environmental one. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798/3 "2013-06-24T16:34:46Z")
It what way can you compare this to the actions of the WBC? ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798/4 "2013-06-24T16:43:53Z")
I’m going to go with no. On the one side you have people glorifying in tragedy and trying to cause as much pain as possible to grieving families to raise a bigoted point entirely unrelated to the target of their protests. On the other side you have a diplomatic mission acknowledging the tragedy that befell them, and considering steps that can be taken to prevent it from happening in the future. As far as the money, he admitted it isn’t much but hopes that there will be more in the future. Unfortunately foreign aid is one step below universal healthcare on the Republicans hate list and they control the purse string, so we will see what can get done. ---
**Author:** ![miss\_elizabeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/838e76/32.png) [@miss\_elizabeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/miss_elizabeth)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798/5 "2013-06-24T16:53:46Z")
Well, _someone_ doesn’t like John Kerry… Anyway, no, this is in no way similar to the actions of Westboro Baptist Church. Glad we could clear that up. Next question: Is changing your vote on the farm bill _the same as stomping on puppies???_ ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798/6 "2013-06-24T16:54:04Z")
Ironically enough, I think the OP is the one who pulled a WBC, by comparing Kerry’s remarks to the actions of the WBC. It’s rather absurd to suggest that an event that may be the result of climate change shouldn’t be mentioned to make a point about climate change. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798/7 "2013-06-24T16:55:40Z")
It’s like WBC in that John Kerry can show as much evidence that the current flooding in India has been caused by greenhouse gases as Fred Phelps can show that any particular soldier’s death is due to God’s wrath on our country for accepting homosexual relationships in the mainstream. He’s attempting to use a tragedy to make a point when they are not related. Was historical flooding in Holland in the 13th and 16th century caused by greenhouse gases? Were the deadly cyclones in India in the 18th and 19th centuries due to excessive carbon usage? Sometimes bad things happen…nature can be a bitch on her on accord. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798/8 "2013-06-24T17:07:42Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > It’s like WBC in that John Kerry can show as much evidence that the current flooding in India has been caused by greenhouse gases as Fred Phelps can show that any particular soldier’s death is due to God’s wrath on our country for accepting homosexual relationships in the mainstream. A ridiculous analogy, given that there are well-known, scientifically valid reasons why excess carbon dioxide can affect the climate. On the other hand there’s no rational reason at all to believe in any god or gods, much less that they are interested in humanity or inclined to inflict wrath on a soldier because of someone’s sexual habits. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798/9 "2013-06-24T17:08:25Z")
Unless Kerry is going to the houses of grieving people and saying their loved ones deserved to die due to their country’s reliance on fossil fuels I’m not seeing the connection. > [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > much less that they are interested in humanity or inclined to inflict wrath on a soldier because of someone’s sexual habits. particularly if that someone isn’t even at all related to the soldier, unless god has really bad aim. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798/10 "2013-06-24T17:13:06Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > Oh and here’s $150,000 from the United States. That’s like dropping some change in front of a homeless person, thinking about picking it up and then saying “oh, you can keep it.” India has resources of its own – it even refused assistance from the Tsunami a few years ago not out of pride but because it could handle the situation. This is more like a gift card and some flowers when you’ve lost a relative. ---
**Author:** ![miss\_elizabeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/838e76/32.png) [@miss\_elizabeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/miss_elizabeth)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798/11 "2013-06-24T18:41:41Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > It’s like WBC in that John Kerry can show as much evidence that the current flooding in India has been caused by greenhouse gases as Fred Phelps can show that any particular soldier’s death is due to God’s wrath on our country for accepting homosexual relationships in the mainstream. > > He’s attempting to use a tragedy to make a point when they are not related. Well, that’s just factually untrue. There’s plenty of evidence for climate change, and none for god(s), and especially none for god(s) that kill soldiers in a war because there’s a gay kid on a TV show. If you truthfully cannot see a distinction between the scientific fact of climate change, and it’s effect on flooding, and imaginary sky daddies killing people for falling in love the wrong way, I don’t know if all the ignorance fighting in the world will help. Obviously this is a backdoor way for you to say you think climate change isn’t happening. Sorry, but you’re wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798/12 "2013-06-24T19:00:33Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > He’s attempting to use a tragedy to make a point when they are not related. Like the WBC, you are trying to provoke outrage by making a ludicrous linkage between entirely unrelated things. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798/13 "2013-06-24T20:15:14Z")
Outrage…wow, my words are more powerful than I give myself credit for. Please provide the scientific cite where the recent floods were caused by man induced climate change. It seems that every natural disaster we’ve had this year (Hurricane Sandy, Oklahoma tornadoes, Indian floods) some editorialist, blogger, politician, etc. wants to ascribe its cause to climate change, without any evidence. It gets printed enough the lemmings begin to believe it to be fact. In this case Kerry is no different. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798/14 "2013-06-24T20:27:07Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > Outrage…wow, my words are more powerful than I give myself credit for. Are you really being so disingenuous as to pretend that’s not the effect you meant to provoke by linking Kerry to a group that’s so widely despised? ---
**Author:** ![miss\_elizabeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/838e76/32.png) [@miss\_elizabeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/miss_elizabeth)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798/15 "2013-06-24T20:29:10Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > Outrage…wow, my words are more powerful than I give myself credit for. No, hun, you’re trying to _provoke outrage_. No one said you were succeeding (you aren’t). ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798/16 "2013-06-24T20:34:45Z")
> [@miss\_elizabeth](#): > > No, hun, you’re trying to _provoke outrage_. No one said you were succeeding (you aren’t). Yeah, you’re mostly provoking :dubious:. ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798/17 "2013-06-24T20:37:55Z")
> [@miss\_elizabeth](#): > > Glad we could clear that up. Next question: Is changing your vote on the farm bill _the same as stomping on puppies???_ No, but comparing John Kerry to the WBC is exactly the same as stomping on puppies. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798/18 "2013-06-24T21:24:02Z")
Still no answer on the actual scientific link between any of the recent national disasters and climate change. Interesting that anyone questioning the current administrations political motivations is just provoking outrage. It’s easier to label it as such than substantiating the claims with science. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798/19 "2013-06-24T21:55:42Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > Still no answer on the actual scientific link between any of the recent national disasters and climate change. If you haven’t understand anything about the climate change issue after all the debate so far, there’s really nothing anyone can say about it to convince you. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798/20 "2013-06-24T22:10:42Z")
Then please explain what caused all natural disasters prior to the 19th century. If it was human induced climate change please elaborate. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-john-kerry-take-a-page-out-of-westboro-baptist-churchs-playbook/661798.md?page=2)