# Did Larry Silverstein know about 9/11? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 5, 2015, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340 "2015-07-05T20:17:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340/41 "2015-07-06T03:55:40Z")
> [@bombthefeds](#): > > Okay, that is going to take some time, that’s a lot of buildings hahahaha, gimme like 20 or 30 minutes… Remember the criteria much match WTC7’s conditions, because I doubt the rest of us will forget. ---
**Author:** ![bombthefeds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/77aa72/32.png) [@bombthefeds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bombthefeds)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340/42 "2015-07-06T03:56:00Z")
Okay just to get the ball rolling [Windsor Tower Madrid](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windsor_Tower_(Madrid)#The_fire) via wiki > [@](#): > > The fire spread quickly throughout the entire building, leading to the collapse of the outermost, steel parts of the upper floors; firefighters needed almost 24 hours to extinguish it. While seven firefighters were injured, nobody was killed in the fire, which was arguably the worst in Madrid’s history. photos [the building on fire](http://i.imgur.com/62XkN9t.jpg) [the building after fire](http://www.iklimnet.com/hotelfires/imagesfire/slide0008_image013.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![bombthefeds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/77aa72/32.png) [@bombthefeds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bombthefeds)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340/43 "2015-07-06T03:58:17Z")
Now I know a lot of you are going to say “Well wait a sec there were firefighters there…” If you look at the pictures you will see how that obviously didn’t matter at all. Need we remember what WTC 7 looked like [ON FIRE](https://s3.amazonaws.com/nasathermalimages/public/images/_dj/Street_W_Broadway/070.JPG) ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340/44 "2015-07-06T04:02:53Z")
> [@bombthefeds](#): > > I just found this theory to be different than the typical 9/11 truther… It isn’t. It’s completely in line with other truther bullshit. > [@](#): > > …because it explains the building 7 collapse which is still highly debated even in engineering communities… Except it isn’t. Any engineer worth his salt knows perfectly well what happened to Building 7. You might be confusing that petition signed by a bunch of “engineers” and “architects”–who are mostly neither–with the many thousands of real engineers and architects who agree with the NIST findings. You have failed utterly and spectacularly because you have a CT turn of mind and aren’t embarrassed to tell the world how doltish your beliefs are. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340/45 "2015-07-06T04:04:10Z")
> [@bombthefeds](#): > > Okay just to get the ball rolling > > [Windsor Tower Madrid](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windsor_Tower_(Madrid)#The_fire) > > via wiki > > photos > > [the building on fire](http://i.imgur.com/62XkN9t.jpg) > > [the building after fire](http://www.iklimnet.com/hotelfires/imagesfire/slide0008_image013.jpg) Fail right out of the gate. The Windsor tower had a concrete frame with a steel frame structure on the upper portion. Due to the fire the steel structure _failed and collapsed_. but since the main structure was concrete the remainder of the building survived. The concrete structure people are [quite proud of that detail](http://www.concretecentre.com/online_services/case_studies/windsor_building,_madrid.aspx). A detail that WTC7 lacked. > [@](#): > > Despite a complete burn-out, the strength provided by a technical concrete floor, plus the passive fire resistance of the building’s concrete core and frame, prevented the building from collapse. > > The only part of the building to collapse was the network of steel perimeter columns supporting the slab on the upper floors. Bad start. Let me guess, the next example you give will be in Philadelphia? ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340/46 "2015-07-06T04:05:19Z")
How do we know you didn’t have prior knowledge about 9/11? Based on your posts here you are highly suspect. This is for a few reasons: 1. You are trying very hard to point the finger of blame at others. 2. You have a lot of intimate knowledge of the events and both the good and bad illuminati. 3. You know how to add physics and you had a physics professor who could have told you how to do it. 4. You have an extensive knowledge of the effect of fire on steel frame buildings. ---
**Author:** ![bombthefeds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/77aa72/32.png) [@bombthefeds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bombthefeds)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340/47 "2015-07-06T04:05:49Z")
> [@dropzone](#): > > You have failed utterly and spectacularly because you have a CT turn of mind and aren’t embarrassed to tell the world how doltish your beliefs are. Jeez I’m flattered, well considering you had to resort to attacking my mind instead of addressing the photos of the burning Windsor Tower building that was on fire for 24 hours and didn’t lose a wink of a steel support, I’m guessing I’m pretty hot to the fire on this one (pun intended). ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340/48 "2015-07-06T04:09:48Z")
> [@bombthefeds](#): > > Now I know a lot of you are going to say > > “Well wait a sec there were firefighters there…” > > If you look at the pictures you will see how that obviously didn’t matter at all. > > Need we remember what WTC 7 looked like [ON FIRE](https://s3.amazonaws.com/nasathermalimages/public/images/_dj/Street_W_Broadway/070.JPG) You do understand what I meant when I said: > [@](#): > > Please list all the buildings that have **steel (and just steel)** support structures that have survived multi-hour fires with zero firefighting efforts put towards the flames. You do understand that concrete is not steel, yes? ---
**Author:** ![bombthefeds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/77aa72/32.png) [@bombthefeds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bombthefeds)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340/49 "2015-07-06T04:12:51Z")
> [@Mr.Miskatonic](#): > > Fail right out of the gate. > > The Windsor tower had a concrete frame with a steel frame structure on the upper portion. > > Due to the fire the steel structure _failed and collapsed_. but since the main structure was concrete the remainder of the building survived. Well that’s true it was steel enforced concrete, however the portions that did collapse did not collapse all at once as with WTC 7. Hold onto your hats folks exhibition 2 is coming up! ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 4:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340/50 "2015-07-06T04:18:48Z")
> [@bombthefeds](#): > > Well that’s true it was steel enforced concrete, however the portions that did collapse did not collapse all at once as with WTC 7. They weren’t part of the main structure (i.e. the major load bearer for the building so why the heck would they? > [@](#): > > Hold onto your hats folks exhibition 2 is coming up! Bad start with assuredly bad follow up, maybe I should go to bed. ---
**Author:** ![bombthefeds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/77aa72/32.png) [@bombthefeds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bombthefeds)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 4:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340/51 "2015-07-06T04:23:00Z")
> [@Mr.Miskatonic](#): > > Bad start with assuredly bad follow up, maybe I should go to bed. Hang in there we got a lot more case studies to address ---
**Author:** ![bombthefeds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/77aa72/32.png) [@bombthefeds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bombthefeds)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340/52 "2015-07-06T04:25:40Z")
Exhibition 2 [Beijing Television Cultural Center](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beijing_Television_Cultural_Center_fire) via wiki > [@](#): > > the entire building caught fire on the last day of the festivities marking the Chinese new year and was put out six hours later. A nearby unauthorised fireworks display caused the fire. Photos: [Building on fire 1](http://i.imgur.com/3J7IADy.png) [Building on fire 2](http://i.imgur.com/7PWBkvd.jpg) [Building on fire 3](http://i.imgur.com/MMMgaGU.jpg) [After fire](http://i.imgur.com/lbJZQ75.jpg) Now I’m going to be straight-dope from the beginning and tell you this building was not made of steel it was made of titanium zinc alloy, now you can tell me how that makes all the difference, due to temperature differences and all that good stuff… ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340/53 "2015-07-06T04:37:02Z")
> [@bombthefeds](#): > > Now I’m going to be straight-dope from the beginning and tell you this building was not made of steel it was made of titanium zinc alloy, now you can tell me how that makes all the difference, due to temperature differences and all that good stuff… You honestly think titanium has the same heat resistance properties of steel? You do know that that titanium allows are used in jet engine parts due to their heat resistance? Did you not read [wikipedia on Titanium Alloys](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Titanium_alloy)? > [@](#): > > Titanium alloys are metals that contain a mixture of titanium and other chemical elements. Such alloys have very high tensile strength and **toughness (even at extreme temperatures**). They are light in weight, have extraordinary corrosion resistance and **the ability to withstand extreme temperatures**. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![bombthefeds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/77aa72/32.png) [@bombthefeds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bombthefeds)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340/54 "2015-07-06T04:37:37Z")
Also, we could settle this much faster if someone has a case of a building similar to WTC 7 collapsing in demolition style due to fire alone. You know rather than me going through every major fire on a skyscraper in recorded history. Course there is no building similar to WTC 7 collapsing due to fire in demolition style so I guess this is going to be one long thread ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340/55 "2015-07-06T04:38:17Z")
Good night. You might want to quit while you are behind. ---
**Author:** ![bombthefeds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/77aa72/32.png) [@bombthefeds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bombthefeds)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340/56 "2015-07-06T04:39:34Z")
> [@Mr.Miskatonic](#): > > You honestly think titanium has the same heat resistance properties of steel? You do know that that titanium allows are used in jet engine parts due to their heat resistance? Thank you okay so let’s move on exhibition 3. Like I said, we can end this any time you want if you can present a case similar to WTC 7, otherwise if we want to be scientific we’ve got to be thorough. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 4:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340/57 "2015-07-06T04:43:26Z")
> [@bombthefeds](#): > > Also, we could settle this much faster if someone has a case of a building similar to WTC 7 collapsing in demolition style due to fire alone. This is your claim that things with are WTC7 are strange (albeit only to you). But you fail to grasp that the situation with WTC was pretty much unique. 1. Steel framed structure 2. large amounts of burning debris falling on top of the building from collapsing WTC 1 & 2 3. Failure of the sprinkler system due to water lines getting damaged by the aforementioned buildings 4. Zero firefighting efforts whatsover due to loss of firefighter’s lives and rescue efforts around collapsed WTC 1 & 2. Until you get a skyscraper fire with similar conditions, you cannot compare it to random skyscraper fires and say ‘Well that one didn’t collapse!!’’ Its not up to use to find a case where the 4 above conditions happened. You have to explain why any skyscraper should be considered a match for what happened to WTC7. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 4:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340/58 "2015-07-06T04:46:33Z")
> [@bombthefeds](#): > > I don’t get the joke? Did you never hear the Watergate tapes? Yes, I did. It was a small conspiracy that only involved a few people. But it was too big for them to keep it a secret so the whole thing became public knowledge. Did you ever hear the 9/11 cover-up tape? ---
**Author:** ![bombthefeds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/77aa72/32.png) [@bombthefeds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bombthefeds)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340/59 "2015-07-06T05:04:44Z")
Exhibition 3 [Fire Interstate Tower (now the Aon Center)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Interstate_Tower_fire) Photos: [Building on Fire](http://i.imgur.com/tLXD8lX.jpg) [After Fire](http://i.imgur.com/ec9rwZo.jpg) Now this building is very similar to WTC 7 in that it is a steel frame high rise. The fire cause of fire was suspected to be electrical though you imagine much of what was burning was “office combustibles.” One of the main differences was the fact fire fighters were actively working to put this fire out, and the fire seemed to be spread across the entire building not on one side. Just for sake of comparison here’s another look at the [FEROCIOUS BLAZE of WTC 7](http://i.imgur.com/naUffBR.jpg) Now one more thing needs to be pointed out here which is that in the [official report](http://www.webcitation.org/query?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.lafire.com%2Ffamous_fires%2F880504_1stInterstateFire%2FFEMA-TecReport%2FFEMA-report.htm&date=2010-07-13) regarding the FIT it was stated that: > [@](#): > > Unusually good application of fire resistive coating helped maintain structural integrity in fire. Proceed gentleman… ---
**Author:** ![zoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zoid/32/336_2.png) [@zoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoid)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2015, 5:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340/60 "2015-07-06T05:13:03Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Yes, I did. It was a small conspiracy that only involved a few people. But it was too big for them to keep it a secret so the whole thing became public knowledge. > > Did you ever hear the 9/11 cover-up tape? \*Three may keep a Secret, if two of them are dead. \* Benjamin Franklin, Poor Richard’s Almanac (1735). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-larry-silverstein-know-about-9-11/724340.md?page=4)