# Did National Endowment for Democracy foment 2004 coup in Haiti?! **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 24, 2006, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-national-endowment-for-democracy-foment-2004-coup-in-haiti/341354 "2006-01-24T03:51:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-national-endowment-for-democracy-foment-2004-coup-in-haiti/341354/1 "2006-01-24T03:51:09Z")
Today on the _Democracy Now!_ radio show, I heard some truly astonishing news: The 2004 coup in Haiti that ousted President Aristide was backed, possibly even stirred up, by right-wing American political organizations: The International Republican Institute ([http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International\_Republican\_Institute](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Republican_Institute)) and the National Endowment for Democracy ([http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National\_Endowment\_for\_Democracy](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Endowment_for_Democracy)). This comes from Canadian journalist Anthony Fenton, author of a new book, _Canada in Haiti: Waging War on the Poor Majority._ Complete rush transcript of interview with Fenton: [http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=06/01/23/1441204](http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=06/01/23/1441204) Related coverage from 7/20/04: [http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=04/07/20/1327215&mode=thread&tid=25](http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=04/07/20/1327215&mode=thread&tid=25) NED, BTW, is almost entirely funded by the U.S. government; in 2004 that came to $79.25 million. [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National\_Endowment\_for\_Democracy#Source\_of\_funding](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Endowment_for_Democracy#Source_of_funding) Is this true? If so, will any Doper try to defend it? ---
**Author:** ![David\_God\_of\_Frogs](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/5f9b8f/32.png) [@David\_God\_of\_Frogs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_God_of_Frogs)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-national-endowment-for-democracy-foment-2004-coup-in-haiti/341354/2 "2006-01-24T04:07:54Z")
Just as background information, NED isn’t really considered a right wing organization. Although it funds the IRI, it also funds the National Democratic Institute for International Affairs, which is associated with the Democratic party, and a couple of other organizations with similar balance. Make of that what you will. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 4:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-national-endowment-for-democracy-foment-2004-coup-in-haiti/341354/3 "2006-01-24T04:23:43Z")
> [@David](#): > > Just as background information, NED isn’t really considered a right wing organization. Although it funds the IRI, it also funds the National Democratic Institute for International Affairs, which is associated with the Democratic party, and a couple of other organizations with similar balance. > > Make of that what you will. Noted. However, according to the Wikipedia article on it, the IRI is also funded directly by the U.S. government. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-national-endowment-for-democracy-foment-2004-coup-in-haiti/341354/4 "2006-01-24T14:03:33Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Noted. However, according to the Wikipedia article on it, the IRI is also funded directly by the U.S. government. Oh my God, that means PBS is a neo-con front organization! ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-national-endowment-for-democracy-foment-2004-coup-in-haiti/341354/5 "2006-01-24T18:14:42Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > Oh my God, that means PBS is a neo-con front organization! Way to obfuscate, **Sam.** (Jeez, is that the best you can do? I’ve come to expect better. That was fucking **lame!)** The point being, of course, that it appears our tax dollars went to organize that bloody coup. If Canuckistani tax dollars had been used for such a purpose, I hope you would be outraged. As for the NED, **David, God of Frogs** might not be right that it is “not considered a right-wing organization.” That’s actually a controversial question about the organization. From [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National\_Endowment\_for\_Democracy#Funding\_of\_foreign\_political\_parties:](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Endowment_for_Democracy#Funding_of_foreign_political_parties:) > [@](#): > > According to left-wing critics, the NED regularly provides funding to opposition candidates in elections in countries other than the USA. It does not directly fund any political party, as this is forbidden by law. However activities such as student “get-out-the-vote” campaigns are funded [2]. > > right wing critics such as Pat Buchanan deride the NED as fomenting worldwide democratic revolution and regularly interfering in the affairs of other countries, especially dictatorships and undemocratic regimes. [3] > > It was also alleged that the NED only supports candidates with strong ties to the military and who support the rights of U.S. corporations to invest in those countries, and that the NED does not support candidates who oppose investments by US corporations or who promise restrictions on investment rights of US corporations. For example, Bill Berkowitz of Working for Change claims that, “The NED functions as a full-service infrastructure building clearinghouse. It provides money, technical support, supplies, training programs, media know-how, public relations assistance and state-of-the-art equipment to select political groups, civic organizations, labor unions, dissident movements, student groups, book publishers, newspapers, and other media. Its aim is to destabilize progressive movements, particularly those with a socialist or democratic socialist bent.” [4] > > Supporters of the NED claim that the NED in fact supports a myriad of groups of social-democratic and liberal orientation everywhere in the world. NED also supports, provides training, and consults openly anti-American groups as far as they are committed to the norms and principles of democracy in countries like Indonesia and Ukraine. The NED contends it focuses funding on democracy-minded organizations rather than opposition groups; however it does not support groups that openly advocate communism, fundamentalism, or any dictatorships. Michael McFaul, in an article for the Washington Post, argues that the NED is hardly an instrument of U.S. foreign policy. As an example of this he states that the NED was willing to fund pro-democratic organizations even as the U.S. government was reluctant and has been supportive of non-democratic governments in the region. [5] ---
**Author:** ![Crotalus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crotalus/32/41_2.png) [@Crotalus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crotalus)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-national-endowment-for-democracy-foment-2004-coup-in-haiti/341354/6 "2006-01-24T18:29:29Z")
**BrainGlutton** - Am I misreading the transcript? It seems that Fenton is saying that Canada, France and the US(not the NED by name) had something to do with getting rid of Aristide, and that the NED is _currently_ involved in trying to defeat a member of Aristide’s party. I also wonder if you know of any support Fenton may have for his contention that the US fears popular democracy in Haiti. I’m not arguing, just seeking more info. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-national-endowment-for-democracy-foment-2004-coup-in-haiti/341354/7 "2006-01-24T18:30:47Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Way to obfuscate, **Sam.** (Jeez, is that the best you can do? I’ve come to expect better. That was fucking **lame!)** Well actually, it was supposed to be a joke. My bad. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-national-endowment-for-democracy-foment-2004-coup-in-haiti/341354/8 "2006-01-24T18:36:00Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > Well actually, it was supposed to be a joke. My bad. I know it was a joke. A lame one. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-national-endowment-for-democracy-foment-2004-coup-in-haiti/341354/9 "2006-01-24T18:49:14Z")
> [@Crotalus](#): > > **BrainGlutton** - Am I misreading the transcript? It seems that Fenton is saying that Canada, France and the US(not the NED by name) had something to do with getting rid of Aristide, and that the NED is _currently_ involved in trying to defeat a member of Aristide’s party. I also wonder if you know of any support Fenton may have for his contention that the US fears popular democracy in Haiti. I’m not arguing, just seeking more info. Fenton’s point was that the **IRI,** closely associated with and funded by the NED, was behind the coup. I didn’t name both the IRI and NED in the thread title because there wasn’t room, and I chose to include NED as the more widely recognizable name. As for the U.S. fearing popular democracy in Haiti, well, I haven’t read Fenton’s book, where he may make an argument to that effect; but it’s pretty obvious the U.S., or at least some powerful factions within it, does fear popular democracy in Latin America and the Caribbean in general. Viz., the Bush Admin’s support of the 2002 coup in Venezuela. Bush didn’t waste five minutes in recognizing the new and completely illegitimate government; and there’s a lot of evidence the Administration gave support to the opposition parties before the coup and has continued to support them after. ---
**Author:** ![Crotalus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crotalus/32/41_2.png) [@Crotalus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crotalus)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-national-endowment-for-democracy-foment-2004-coup-in-haiti/341354/10 "2006-01-24T18:59:46Z")
Thanks for the clarification. I’m a conservative Republican, so I guess I’m supposed to mindlessly defend anything done by the current administration, but I’d feel a lot better about our involvement in Haiti’s elections if they were devoted strictly to ensuring fair elections, not specific outcomes. ---
**Author:** ![David\_God\_of\_Frogs](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/5f9b8f/32.png) [@David\_God\_of\_Frogs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_God_of_Frogs)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-national-endowment-for-democracy-foment-2004-coup-in-haiti/341354/11 "2006-01-24T20:33:07Z")
> [@brainglutton](#): > > As for the NED, David, God of Frogs might not be right that it is “not considered a right-wing organization.” That’s actually a controversial question about the organization. From [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nation...litical\_parties:](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nation...litical_parties:) Well from your cite it looks like the criticism is pretty balanced. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-national-endowment-for-democracy-foment-2004-coup-in-haiti/341354/12 "2006-01-24T20:38:02Z")
> [@David](#): > > Well from your cite it looks like the criticism is pretty balanced. But if NED had even tangential involvement in the coup that ousted the Lavalas government in Haiti, it is not fair to call it a “pro-democracy” organization in any sense.