# Did Obama violate the Logan Act? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 6, 2017, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-obama-violate-the-logan-act/790602 "2017-07-06T14:29:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2017, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-obama-violate-the-logan-act/790602/41 "2017-09-24T20:09:00Z")
> [@Iggy](#): > > Anybody remember [Bill Clinton’s 2009 trip to North Korea](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_imprisonment_of_American_journalists_by_North_Korea#Bill_Clinton.27s_visit_to_Pyongyang)? I don’t recall anyone screaming about Logan Act violations at the time. Surely the right wing conspiracy theorists would have been pushing that except no one cared. And that was a trip to an ostensibly hostile power. > > Somehow I think a former president visiting and even openly meeting with a close US ally is a long way from making the case for a Logan Act violation. As I recall. Clinton actually went to North Korea to help the US government, not to undermine it. The Logan act is a relic that will never be enforced, unless the circumstances are egregious. Two democrats went to Iraq before the Iraq war and supported Saddam’s arguments as I recall, and nothing happened to them. Jimmy Carter went abroad and opposed U.S. policy, and nothing happened to him. So forget about the Logan Act. That said, there has been a longstanding tradition that ex-presidents should bow out of political debates regarding current policy negotiations. Reagan, both Bushes, and Clinton (mostly) have respected that. If Obama continues shadowing the current president and having closed-door meetings with foreign leaders, that’s at least a violation of that tradition,and it’s probably not a good thing to be doing. And if it turns out that he’s actually attempting to undermine the current administration, that’s pretty bad. But I don’t know what can be done about it. He’s a free citizen and has a right to his own speech and negotiations. Short of committing actual treason, I think Obama is safe from prosecution. And treason is damned hard to prosecute. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2017, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-obama-violate-the-logan-act/790602/42 "2017-09-24T20:19:43Z")
The most truly patriotic action any American citizen can perform is to attempt to undermine this sorry excuse for a presidential administration. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2017, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-obama-violate-the-logan-act/790602/43 "2017-09-25T13:56:07Z")
'I’m covered by the First Amendment, as are those that align with my desired political outcomes, but anyone else’s mere pleasant smile towards a foreigner is a clear violation of the Logan Act." ANSWER to the OP: No. Obama’s actions are either protected by the First Amendment or otherwise not violative of the Logan Act. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2017, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-obama-violate-the-logan-act/790602/44 "2017-09-25T14:05:19Z")
> [@Bassman1068](#): > > The fact that no liberal biased so-called “news” outlets appeared in a Google search simply means that it’s another story being ignored by the liberal media. Exactly the way they ignored [Bat Boy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bat_Boy_(character))! ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2017, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-obama-violate-the-logan-act/790602/45 "2017-09-25T14:07:22Z")
> [@Bassman1068](#): > > The fact that no liberal biased so-called “news” outlets appeared in a Google search simply means that it’s another story being ignored by the liberal media. Similar to how NBC has made no mention whatsoever regarding Bob Menendez’s corruption & bribery trial. Usually, when it comes to bad news involving a Democrat you have to go to page two or maybe even three of a Google search to find a liberal outlet report Or, another possible explanation (and hear me out on this before you jump in to respond)…right wing people are out of their mind? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2017, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-obama-violate-the-logan-act/790602/46 "2017-09-25T14:19:00Z")
Am I the only one disappointed that the “Logan Act” has nothing to do with Wolverine? > [@Iggy](#): > > Anybody remember [Bill Clinton’s 2009 trip to North Korea](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_imprisonment_of_American_journalists_by_North_Korea#Bill_Clinton.27s_visit_to_Pyongyang)? I don’t recall anyone screaming about Logan Act violations at the time. Surely the right wing conspiracy theorists would have been pushing that except no one cared. And that was a trip to an ostensibly hostile power. Oh, some of them lost their shit about it but since all Clinton had to do was turn up and pose for a picture in return for getting two Americans released from North Korean custody there wasn’t much hay to make (and indeed the story made Clinton look good so they didn’t talk about it for long). As for Obama, if Tom Cotton and company didn’t run afoul of the Logan Act for their dickery with Iran, I can’t imagine Obama has much to worry about unless he’s actually claiming to speak for the US - and I’d be very, very surprised if that were true. ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2017, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-obama-violate-the-logan-act/790602/47 "2017-09-25T14:39:27Z")
I’m not sure why people take ‘possible violations of The Logan Act’ seriously; it’s a law that’s hung around for more than two centuries but has only resulted in one indictment and no convictions, and would pretty clearly not be considered constitutional today. Breaking the Logan Act is pretty obviously not something that anyone needs to worry about it, but I’ve seen people on both the left and right act like it’s a huge deal to even possibly violate it. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2017, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-obama-violate-the-logan-act/790602/48 "2017-09-25T15:12:34Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Or, another possible explanation (and hear me out on this before you jump in to respond)…right wing people are out of their mind? Would you be interested in reading some passionate left-wing claims that Trump or his team violated the Logan Act? ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2017, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-obama-violate-the-logan-act/790602/49 "2017-09-25T15:30:21Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Or, another possible explanation (and hear me out on this before you jump in to respond)…right wing people are out of their mind? You are responding to a poster who registered and made a single post the same day, reviving not quite a zombie, and hasn’t posted since. Within 1.5 hours of the first posting, the factual matter of his assertion was defeated in a thread that had already dispensed with the legal and pragmatic matter of the Logan Act. Not sure why you felt the urge to use that as an invitation to get in a dig about right wing people, with not quite subtle implications about the poster them self, but in that context I recommend you save this type of unnecessarily inflammatory invective for the Pit. [/moderating] ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2017, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-obama-violate-the-logan-act/790602/50 "2017-09-25T15:55:43Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Would you be interested in reading some passionate left-wing claims that Trump or his team violated the Logan Act? It sounds less crazy when you and your administration are being investigated with colluding with the Russians for influencing a Presidential election. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 8:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-obama-violate-the-logan-act/790602/51 "2017-09-26T08:17:29Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Would you be interested in reading some passionate left-wing claims that Trump or his team violated the Logan Act? I’m sure there are myriad examples of this and any other dubious proposal one might think of. More to the point, however: is anyone on the “passionate left-wing” complaining that the media aren’t adequately reporting about it? ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-obama-violate-the-logan-act/790602/52 "2017-09-26T13:36:56Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > It sounds less crazy when you and your administration are being investigated with colluding with the Russians for influencing a Presidential election. Perhaps. But if Trump or any of his staff are prosecuted, it won’t be under the Logan Act. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-obama-violate-the-logan-act/790602/53 "2017-09-26T20:22:48Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Perhaps. But if Trump or any of his staff are prosecuted, it won’t be under the Logan Act. Apparently no one has ever been prosecuted under the Logan Act, so I’m inclined to agree with you. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2017, 12:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-obama-violate-the-logan-act/790602/54 "2017-09-30T12:26:21Z")
> [@Bassman1068](#): > > The fact that no liberal biased so-called “news” outlets appeared in a Google search simply means that it’s another story being ignored by the liberal media. With the distortions we see from liberal media it’s good to have a simple path to truth. Thanks, **Bassman1068**! I tried some experiments. When I type “Hillary is a satan worshipper” into Google, the top three hits in order are > [@New York Times](#): > > “She had Vince Foster killed.” “She’s behind many more murders than that.” “It’s well-established that Hillary Clinton belonged to a satanic cult, still does.” > [@The Daily Beast](#): > > … a WikiLeaks email proves Hillary Clinton and her campaign are Satanists who participate in witchcraft. > The Drudge Report, the right’s internet firehose, featured as its lead story a headline suggesting that Clinton campaign chairman John Podesta had been involved with occult activities linked to Satanism, complete with a photo of Hillary Clinton raging, arms outstretched, to the skies. Fox News’s Sean Hannity tweeted a story from his own website, along with its headline: “LEAKED EMAIL appears to link Clinton Campaign Chairman to bizarre occult ritual” and, perhaps the only reputable news source of the three, > [@Infowars](#): > > Hillary Clinton’s ties to satanic rituals and the occult have been well-documented for decades. > Clinton insider Larry Nichols told Infowars that Hillary Clinton used to attend a “witch’s church” in Los Angeles during Bill’s presidency. > And a source claimed many FBI agents consider Clinton to be “the Antichrist personified.” Googling “Hillary is the antichrist” the top hit is Huffingtonpost quoting Hillary as denying the charge. :rolleyes: For “Obama is the antichrist” Snopes is the top hit, branding this as a false fact. Hah! For “Obama is a satan worshipper”, Snopes is again the top hit, branding this as ALMOST false. In addition to a repeat of the NY Times story confirming Hillary as satan worshipper, the other top hits are: > [@](#): > > Proof That Obama is Satan - Patheos > [www.patheos.com/blogs/religionprof/2015/04/proof-that-obama-is-satan.html](http://www.patheos.com/blogs/religionprof/2015/04/proof-that-obama-is-satan.html) > > Obama Performs Rite of Super Blood Moon To Hand Satan Control of … > [liberaldarkness.com/.../obama-performs-rite-of-super-blood-moon-to-hand-satan-cont](http://liberaldarkness.com/.../obama-performs-rite-of-super-blood-moon-to-hand-satan-cont)… > Sep 27, 2015 - Obama has completed the rite of ascension for Satan in the darkest … > > Michelle Obama Shows Her Allegiance to Satan - [Jesus-is-savior.com](http://Jesus-is-savior.com) > [Michelle Obama Shows Her Allegiance to Satan](http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Wolves/michelle_obama.htm) I think this pretty well confirms that Obama is a Satan worshipper: Among the liberal press only NY Times mentions it — and that’s probably a false hit with Obama just mentioned in the story that confirmed Hillary as Satan worshipper. Even the liberal Snopes called it only “ALMOST false.” Typing “Hillary antichrist witch” into Google, Washington Post is the 1st hit and NY Times is the 3rd hit. I don’t know what to make of this. Are they mentioning this sad fact just to deflect the truth from those of us applying **Bassman1068** ’s rule? Finally I tried Google: “Hillary antichrist witch eats babies.” Just as **Bassman1068** predicted, the two top liberal rags are silent. _This charge must be true._ > [@](#): > > About 261,000 results (0.56 seconds) > > Is Hillary Clinton the Antichrist or an Illuminati Witch? — Charisma News > [www.charismanews.com](http://www.charismanews.com) › Opinion › Watchman on the Wall > > Is Hillary Clinton the Antichrist or an Illuminati Witch? - Patheos > [www.patheos.com/.../christian-website-seriously-asks-is-hillary-clinton-the-antichrist-](http://www.patheos.com/.../christian-website-seriously-asks-is-hillary-clinton-the-antichrist-)… > Aug 12, 2016 - Christian Website Seriously Asks: “Is Hillary Clinton the Antichrist or an Illuminati Witch?” > > Bombshell: Hillary Clinton’s Satanic Network Exposed » Alex Jones … > [https://www.infowars.com/bombshell-hillary-clintons-satanic-network-exposed/](https://www.infowars.com/bombshell-hillary-clintons-satanic-network-exposed/) > … Clinton to be “the Antichrist personified. … Satanist Aleister Crowley, which involves eating semen, blood and breast milk. > > [https://www.infowars.com/spirit-cooking-clinton-campaign-chairman-invited-to-bizar](https://www.infowars.com/spirit-cooking-clinton-campaign-chairman-invited-to-bizar)… > > The hideous, diabolical truth about Hillary Clinton - Chicago Tribune > [www.chicagotribune.com/news/.../ct-hillary-clinton-robot-truth-20161014-story.html](http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/.../ct-hillary-clinton-robot-truth-20161014-story.html) > Oct 14, 2016 - The era of general prosperity that follows only serves to confirm the fact that Hillary Clinton is the Antichrist (in addition to being a witch, a robot … Since the Chicago Tribune is, I think, part of the Fake News industry I was intrigued enough to click — but got Thailand’s “Censored” indicator! Google cache to the rescue: > [@Chcago Tribune](#): > > It is time someone got to the bottom of everything that people say about Hillary Clinton. Who is she? More importantly, WHAT is she? I have compiled the following timeline of her life by combining all the actual theories about her. When lined up together, they form quite a biography. > > Before Time, Before the Earth Was Made, Before Matter and Being and History: Hillary Clinton (Lucifer, Beelzebub, Lord of the Flies, Prince of Darkness, Satan, She Whose Many Names the Cats Scream in the Night) is cast out of heaven for overweening hubris. She is condemned to lie in eternal torment in a lake of fire surrounded by her fallen angels, or, alternatively, to run for a major office while female. For thousands of years she lies outside time, smelling of sulfur, before deciding to undertake the second option. > > Oct. 26, 1947: Hillary Clinton, a robot, is constructed by Saul Alinsky, then slipped into a bassinet and delivered to the Rodham house, where it stores its Six Human, Relatable Memories of squeegeeing, family life and honest toil. Both NY Times and Washington Post seem to be silent on this search — or at least they don’t show up in the first ten hits — and the article in Chicago’s libtard rag may be sarcastic, so I think it’s pretty well confirmed: _ **Hillary Clinton is a witch and the Antichrist and eats babies.** _ If the liberals had any evidence to refute this charge surely they would have published it. I’m not a very good Googler. Perhaps others can follow **Bassman1068** ’s rule and learn more unfortunate truths about today’s Democrats. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2017, 9:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-obama-violate-the-logan-act/790602/55 "2017-10-02T09:14:55Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > Am I the only one disappointed that the “Logan Act” has nothing to do with Wolverine? Maybe. It’s probably more likely that I’m the only one disappointed that it has nothing to do with Rory Gilmore. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-obama-violate-the-logan-act/790602.md?page=2)