# Did Old West outlaws ever tie women to train tracks? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 2, 2010, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714 "2010-12-02T21:19:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2010, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714/1 "2010-12-02T21:19:49Z")
You see it all the time in the Warner Bros. and Disney cartoons from decades ago. Wherever there’s an outlaw or bandit who kidnaps a maiden fair, usually some attractive saloon wench, he inevitably ties her up on some train tracks for the hero to rescue, which he usually does by picking her up. Apparently, the Dillenger wannabe just ties up the girl and places her on the tracks, not even securing her to it. And she, being of a shapely womanness, is too feminine to roll out of the fucking way Did this ever happen? Was it like “walking the plank” for pirates? Or just something dreamed up by cartoonists to emphasize the dastardlyness of the swarthy criminal? ---
**Author:** ![engineer\_comp\_geek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/engineer_comp_geek/32/504_2.png) [@engineer\_comp\_geek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/engineer_comp_geek)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2010, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714/2 "2010-12-02T22:02:38Z")
I don’t believe it ever really happened. As for the cliche, this is what TV tropes has to say about where it came from: > [@](#): > > This familiar scenario first appeared in the 1867 short story “Captain Tom’s Fright”, although a more rudimentary form of it was seen on stage in 1863 in the play The Engineer. However, it really entered the meme pool as a result of its inclusion in the 1867 play Under the Gaslight◊, by Augustin Daly. (Interestingly, in Gaslight the victim is a male, not a fair maiden) By 1868, it reportedly could be found in five different London plays all running at the same time, and remained a theatre staple for decades. From there it was but a short leap to silent films when the latter appeared on the scene, the first appearance on film seemingly being the 1914 serial version of The Perils of Pauline. From here: > **[Chained to a Railway - TV Tropes](https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ChainedToARailway)** > > The music is high-tempo, the damsel is in distress, and the mustachioed villain is mugging to the camera. Yup, she's been chained to a railroad track, and the 7:10 Express is running right on time. Despite popular opinion, this trope isn't nearly … ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2010, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714/3 "2010-12-02T22:10:11Z")
I don’t know about cartoons, but I can’t remember a movie in which rope was not used to do the tying. It may not have been a tie worthy of a Boy Scout, but the ropes were always there. Do you have any actual examples of an untied woman sitting helplessly on a track? ---
**Author:** ![Darth\_Sensitive](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/58956e/32.png) [@Darth\_Sensitive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darth_Sensitive)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2010, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714/4 "2010-12-02T22:19:05Z")
Crazily enough, TVTropes links back [here.](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2266/did-anyone-really-ever-get-tied-to-railroad-tracks) ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2010, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714/5 "2010-12-02T22:22:33Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > I don’t know about cartoons, but I can’t remember a movie in which rope was not used to do the tying. It may not have been a tie worthy of a Boy Scout, but the ropes were always there. > > Do you have any actual examples of an untied woman sitting helplessly on a track? Sorry, I meant to say that the woman was tied up, but not tied to the tracks itself. She was tied and simply placed on the tracks ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2010, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714/6 "2010-12-02T22:24:01Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > I don’t know about cartoons, but I can’t remember a movie in which rope was not used to do the tying. It may not have been a tie worthy of a Boy Scout, but the ropes were always there. > > Do you have any actual examples of an untied woman sitting helplessly on a track? I believe the OP was saying that the woman herself is tied up, but that she is not secured to the tracks by anything. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2010, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714/7 "2010-12-02T22:28:53Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > I believe the OP was saying that the woman herself is tied up, but that she is not secured to the tracks by anything. I can believe that. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![SanDiegoTim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/85e7bf/32.png) [@SanDiegoTim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanDiegoTim)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2010, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714/8 "2010-12-02T22:35:42Z")
Back to the original question…only when they deserved it. ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2010, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714/9 "2010-12-03T00:17:22Z")
> [@Darth\_Sensitive](#): > > Crazily enough, TVTropes links back [here.](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2266/did-anyone-really-ever-get-tied-to-railroad-tracks) Yeah. Don’t you guys ever read the Straight Dope? Gfactor did a superbjob on that one. ---
**Author:** ![UncleFred](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f0a364/32.png) [@UncleFred](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleFred)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2010, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714/10 "2010-12-03T00:31:55Z")
On a related note - how about when someone is tied to the platform slowly dragging them into the big blade at the old sawmill? I think Snidely Whiplash did that as well as the old railroad bit. Any real-life cites? A more modern version would be James Bond and the laser in Goldfinger (IIRC) ---
**Author:** ![BubbaDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bubbadog/32/333_2.png) [@BubbaDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BubbaDog)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2010, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714/11 "2010-12-03T00:44:22Z")
I believe that threat happened to Curly too. His bald noggin ruined the saw. ---
**Author:** ![Valgard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/7feea3/32.png) [@Valgard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Valgard)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2010, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714/12 "2010-12-03T00:49:58Z")
Immortalized in song by The Coasters: [![]( " - YouTube") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T-timQghfQI) ---
**Author:** ![Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/le_ministre_de_l_au-dela/32/12181_2.png) [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Ministre_de_l_au-dela)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2010, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714/13 "2010-12-03T00:56:06Z")
Michael Ondaatje does not provide a cite, but in the poem ‘In Boot Hill’ from ‘The Collected Works of Billy the Kid’, he makes the claim that ‘some (of the dead) were pushed under trains - a popular and overlooked form of murder in the west.’ It is plausible - I’ll continue to hunt for something in his sources. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2010, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714/14 "2010-12-03T03:31:11Z")
I’ve tried it. Their screams always give me headaches. Believe me, it’s not worth the trouble. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2010, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714/15 "2010-12-03T03:31:18Z")
> [@UncleFred](#): > > On a related note - how about when someone is tied to the platform slowly dragging them into the big blade at the old sawmill? I think Snidely Whiplash did that as well as the old railroad bit. > > Any real-life cites? Real life? No. But the theatrical version is also traced back to Augustin Daly, in his play **The Red Scarf**. Note that in **Under the Gaslight** , it’s a man tied to the tracks, and a woman rescues him. It’s also a man on the buzzsaw in **The Red Scarf** , though I don’t know how he was rescued, since the play has been lost. ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2010, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714/16 "2010-12-03T23:38:45Z")
Given the disparity between females & males in the Old West, most outlaws could think of other things to do to women than tying them on train tracks! Except for those that are [frequently secretly fond of each other](http://www.burbler.com/pansy-division-cowboys-are-frequently-secretly-fond-of-each-other-lyrics.html). ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2010, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714/17 "2010-12-04T02:04:37Z")
> [@samclem](#): > > Yeah. Don’t you guys ever read the Straight Dope? Gfactor did a superbjob on that one. Well, aren’t you modest. Apparently you helped out, too. From the article: > [@](#): > > _Thanks to fellow SDSAB members samclem and Una Persson for their research help and comments._ ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2010, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714/18 "2010-12-04T02:07:39Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > I’ve tried it. Their screams always give me headaches. Believe me, it’s not worth the trouble. So you’re the evil one? Is Sauron’s blog the real story? ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2010, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714/19 "2010-12-04T02:19:25Z")
> [@UncleFred](#): > > On a related note - how about when someone is tied to the platform slowly dragging them into the big blade at the old sawmill? I think Snidely Whiplash did that as well as the old railroad bit. > > Any real-life cites? > > A more modern version would be James Bond and the laser in Goldfinger (IIRC) Poe Pit and Pendulum? ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2010, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714/20 "2010-12-04T02:45:23Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > So you’re the evil one? Is Sauron’s blog the real story? No and yes, respectively. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-old-west-outlaws-ever-tie-women-to-train-tracks/562714.md?page=2)