# Did Pelosi just un-invite Trump from the State of the Union? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [January 16, 2019, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898 "2019-01-16T22:02:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 25
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898/481 "2019-01-23T19:26:54Z")
Here are [the House rules](https://republicans-rules.house.gov/sites/republicans.rules.house.gov/files/115/PDF/House-Rules-115.pdf) from the Congress that just ended. I doubt they’ve changed much in the new Congress with respect to this sort of detail. One relevant section: > [@](#): > > RULE IV > THE HALL OF THE HOUSE > Use and admittance > > 1. The Hall of the House shall be used > only for the legislative business of the > House and for caucus and conference > meetings of its Members, except when > the House agrees to take part in any > ceremonies to be observed therein. > 2. (a) Only the following persons shall > be admitted to the Hall of the House or > rooms leading thereto: > (1) Members of Congress, Memberselect, > and contestants in election > cases during the pendency of their > cases on the floor. > (2) The Delegates and the Resident > Commissioner. > (3) The President and Vice President > of the United States and their > private secretaries. > (4) … Seems clear from those rules that the President is free to enter the House chamber at any time. **But** he can’t give the SOTU there unless “the House agrees to take part in [that ceremony] to be observed therein” because the SOTU isn’t “legislative business of the House,” nor is it “caucus and conference meetings of its Members.” Pelosi’s invitation to Trump to give the SOTU, as best as I can suss it out, is a necessary but not sufficient condition for Trump to be able to give the SOTU in the House chamber. The House has to vote its agreement to hold a joint session of Congress for that occasion. This is normally just a formality, and Pelosi’s invitation implied a willingness at that point to attend to any required formalities. That was then, this is now, and the formality may well not happen. And if it doesn’t happen, there is no joint session, and while Trump is free to wander in, he doesn’t have the right to give a speech while he’s there. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898/482 "2019-01-23T19:54:26Z")
[Pelosi has responded to Trump’s letter.](https://thehill.com/homenews/house/426649-pelosi-tells-trump-no-sotu-on-tuesday) Summary: Nope, Trump. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898/483 "2019-01-23T19:57:45Z")
> [@nelliebly](#): > > Why couldn’t Trump simply give the SOTU address in Senate Chambers? Apparently that would require a resolution on the floor, which could be filibustered, so Moscow Mitch would need seven Democrats – fat chance. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898/484 "2019-01-23T20:27:20Z")
Pelosi has changed #SOTU to #STFU. -stolen from Twitter ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898/485 "2019-01-23T21:37:50Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > Here are [the House rules](https://republicans-rules.house.gov/sites/republicans.rules.house.gov/files/115/PDF/House-Rules-115.pdf) from the Congress that just ended. I doubt they’ve changed much in the new Congress with respect to this sort of detail. > > One relevant section: > Seems clear from those rules that the President is free to enter the House chamber at any time. That’s not how I read it. To me, that list limits who may be admitted into the House, not who has free access to the House. ---
**Author:** ![jasg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f0a364/32.png) [@jasg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jasg)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898/486 "2019-01-23T22:13:19Z")
I think The Speaker missed a great opportunity - as I understand the SOTU, it is a communication from the Executive branch to the Legislature. She could allow Trump to address Congress, but she could choose to not broadcast it. Imagine Trump’s reaction! > [@](#): > > RULE V > > BROADCASTING THE HOUSE > > 1. The Speaker shall administer, direct, and control a system for closed-circuit viewing of floor proceedings of the House in the offices of all Members, Delegates, the Resident Commissioner, and committees and in such other places in the Capitol and the House Office Buildings as the Speaker considers appropriate. Such system may include other communications functions as the Speaker considers appropriate. Any such communications shall be subject to rules and regulations issued by the > Speaker. > > 2. (a) The Speaker shall administer, direct, and control a system for complete and unedited audio and visual broadcasting and recording of the floor proceedings of the House. The Speaker shall provide for the distribution of such broadcasts and recordings to news media, for the storage of audio and video recordings of the proceedings, and for the closed-captioning of the proceedings for hearing-impaired persons. ---
**Author:** ![scr4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@scr4](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scr4)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898/487 "2019-01-23T22:47:55Z")
> [@jasg](#): > > I think The Speaker missed a great opportunity - as I understand the SOTU, it is a communication from the Executive branch to the Legislature. That would be undeniably spiteful. What she’s doing can at least be attributed to concern for security staff who would have to work extra hours without pay. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898/488 "2019-01-23T22:57:11Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > They have a duty to protect the President. I’m not terribly familiar with their SOPs, but I imagine that this means not allowing people to lay hands on the President in a physical confrontation. For example, if the President’s limo, with him present inside, were to violate a traffic law or be involved in a minor fender-bender, I suspect they might not allow a random police patrolman to approach the vehicle while armed and order the occupants, including the President, out of the vehicle. Out of curiosity, how far do you think that this protection is extended? I’m not sure if the presidential motorcade is subject to traffic laws, as it has a police escort, and that pretty much gives you the right of way, so your scenario is not likely. But, lets say the Melania accuses him of domestic assault. What is SS going to do in the WH residence to resolve that? What if he carries out his “threat” to shoot someone on 5th avenue? Can he continue to shoot people with impunity, while the SS holds law enforcement at abay? Can he rob a bank, using his presidential motorcade as his getaway car? Just how far above the law are you placing this man? ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898/489 "2019-01-23T22:59:09Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > The House Chamber will be empty anyway. Let him in and have the cameras rolling as he wanders around an empty room looking lost and alone. > [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > What if all the republicans show up? Leave the cameras on, but turn off the sound. ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898/490 "2019-01-23T23:21:38Z")
> [@jasg](#): > > She could allow Trump to address Congress, but she could choose to not broadcast it. Imagine Trump’s reaction! Yes, but does a president giving a state of the union address that isn’t broadcast to the public make a sound? ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898/491 "2019-01-23T23:33:19Z")
I think she’s handling it perfectly. She continues to say no in a calm way to the tantrum-throwing toddler, who will persist in exhibiting his obsession with being on the tee vee above all else – including getting federal employees back to work. Even the ones who protect him and the rest of us. In a perfect demonstration of his unfailing tactic of projection, he responded to her latest “nope” by saying she was “afraid of the truth.” Rich, coming from an inveterate liar whose latest tally while in office now exceeds 8,000. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898/492 "2019-01-23T23:46:17Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > I think she’s handling it perfectly. She continues to say no in a calm way to the tantrum-throwing toddler, who will persist in exhibiting his obsession with being on the tee vee above all else – including getting federal employees back to work. Even the ones who protect him and the rest of us. > > In a perfect demonstration of his unfailing tactic of projection, he responded to her latest “nope” by saying she was “afraid of the truth.” Rich, coming from an inveterate liar whose latest tally while in office now exceeds 8,000. ^Yes to all this. Pelosi’s letter is perfection: in a few words she conveys the dignity of high office to a man who has no idea what “dignity” means: > [@](#): > > Dear Mr. President: > > When I extended an invitation on January 3rd for you to deliver the State of the Union address, it was on the mutually agreed upon date, January 29th. At that time, there was no thought that the government would still be shut down. > > In my further correspondence of January 16th, I said we should work together to find a mutually agreeable date when government has re-opened and I hope that we can still do that. > > I am writing to inform you that the House of Representatives will not consider a concurrent resolution authorizing the President’s State of the Union address in the House Chamber until government has opened. > > Again, I look forward to welcoming you to the House on a mutually agreeable date for this address when government has been opened. > > Sincerely, > > NANCY PELOSI > > Speaker of the House [https://www.speaker.gov/newsroom/12319-3/](https://www.speaker.gov/newsroom/12319-3/) There’s not a particle of snark in that. It’s simply ‘until the government is re-opened there will be no State of the Union speech in the House.’ It’s very smart. Because it is so straightforward and, one might say, sincere in its expression of doing what’s right, there’s nothing that a reasonable person could object to in it. Trump and his enablers have no possible option but to make up stuff. Not that they ever mind making up stuff. But each time they do, they lose another independent. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898/493 "2019-01-23T23:50:46Z")
Trump views truth the way he views Tiffany, in that he’s vaguely aware it exists but doesn’t meet it often. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898/494 "2019-01-23T23:53:56Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > What if he carries out his “threat” to shoot someone on 5th avenue? Can he continue to shoot people with impunity, while the SS holds law enforcement at abay? I do not know what would happen but the Secret Service are not Emperor’s Imperial Guard who are told to do whatever the president says or let him do whatever he wants. Their job is the protection of the president…even from himself. I imagine if Trump shot someone on 5th Avenue the SS would immediately disarm him and toss him like a sack of potatoes into his limousine and get him back to the White House and locked in the bunker in the basement. I seriously doubt they’d let Joe Police Officer arrest him and throw him in the city lockup. They’d then let congress sort it out (likely with an immediate removal from office). ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898/495 "2019-01-23T23:58:35Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Trump views truth the way he views Tiffany, in that he’s vaguely aware it exists but doesn’t meet it often. I love this line. ---
**Author:** ![galen\_ubal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/galen_ubal/32/4440_2.png) [@galen\_ubal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/galen_ubal)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2019, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898/496 "2019-01-24T04:35:37Z")
Quoting two tweets from Trump - [the first is here.](https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1088288311922307072) > [@](#): > > As the Shutdown was going on, Nancy Pelosi asked me to give the State of the Union Address. I agreed. She then changed her mind because of the Shutdown, suggesting a later date. This is her prerogative - I will do the Address when the Shutdown is over. I am not looking for an… > > …alternative venue for the SOTU Address because there is no venue that can compete with the history, tradition and importance of the House Chamber. I look forward to giving a “great” State of the Union Address in the near future! > 3:18 PM - 24 Jan 2019 3:18 PM My local time - 11:18 PM US Eastern. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2019, 4:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898/497 "2019-01-24T04:40:09Z")
> [@galen\_ubal](#): > > Quoting two tweets from Trump - [the first is here.](https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1088288311922307072) > 3:18 PM My local time - 11:18 PM US Eastern. **From the Office of Speaker of the House of Representatives:** Now go home and get your fucking shine box. Sincerely, Nancy Pelosi ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2019, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898/498 "2019-01-24T04:47:11Z")
Master. Negotiator. ---
**Author:** ![galen\_ubal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/galen_ubal/32/4440_2.png) [@galen\_ubal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/galen_ubal)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2019, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898/499 "2019-01-24T04:56:33Z")
Headline on the Fox News site - “Trump Blinks”. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2019, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898/500 "2019-01-24T04:58:05Z")
> [@galen\_ubal](#): > > Headline on the Fox News site - “Trump Blinks”. Hee hee!! This is going to be the worst burr under his saddle. 😃 ETA: It took Madame Speaker a grand total of 20 days to put him in his place. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898.md?page=24) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-pelosi-just-un-invite-trump-from-the-state-of-the-union/827898.md?page=26)